Talk:List of Starfleet starships ordered by class

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[edit] merged, featured list soon?

Allright, the stubby classes have been merged in, next lets get summaries entered for the larger articles that retained independence. With luck and some hard work, this can make a featured list as it's not bogged down by excessive fair use images like the rank one is. -Mask 05:55, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

Err no this article will never be a featured list as it is no list. I reverted all your edits in a lump sum. A list does not have 51+ sections. Your version simply put is very hard to follow.
I have writen a featured lists from scratch. This article should be in a table format and should be a comparasion chart. That is the point of lists right? Each ships description should not exeed a single sentece. --Cool CatTalk|@ 01:06, 25 March 2006 (UTC)
You have been reverted. Lists such as this are common. Suggest you look around at others. -Mask 01:12, 25 March 2006 (UTC)
Just for example here, these are all Featured Lists:
-Mask
Excuse me I am not going to revert you but I will oppose the Featured Candidateness of this article. See WP:OWN as well as List of Oh My Goddess episodes. --Cool CatTalk|@ 20:11, 25 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Sources for classifying scout/escort/etc...

Just curious, how do we know that the Danube class is a type of scout? Or that the Defiant class is a type of escort? AlistairMcMillan 19:53, 19 April 2006 (UTC)

Okay so that source says the Defiant class is an escort but according to your source the Danube class isn't a scout vessel. AlistairMcMillan 20:23, 19 April 2006 (UTC)
Yes. I make mistakes. I ci--Cat out 20:11, 8 June 2006 (UTC)ted the source and there is a great amount of information. It is overwhelming for a single person.
  • I am copying all list of ships from their respective articles. Such as Galaxy class starship
  • After that I'll check for classes, weather or not is it cannon. is it really a cruser or not etc.
  • after that I'll check for sources (aka what episode the ship was from) which is actualy avalible on the articles explaining the ships. Feel free to check ship class pages.
In sum, feel free to assist. --Cat out 17:53, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

Okay. Some time in the next couple of days I'm going to start going through and removing all the starships that don't list sources. Where I remember the sources I'll add them myself. I'm also going to remove the classifications that have been used here unless someone can supply a canon source that backs them up. Please see WP:VERIFY if you have a problem with this. AlistairMcMillan 17:22, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

Well some do have sources. The tachion blocade happened on spesific episodes. Should be easy enough to source. Which ships are you looking at? --Cat out 03:41, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] table

Excelsior class starship Miranda class starship

Is it posible for someone to add these ships in a table format? --Cat out 20:11, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

I have done the Excelsior class. --Cat out 11:20, 8 July 2006 (UTC)
Done both... :P --Cat out 12:28, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Halo

The subjects at the bottom of the list, such as "Pillar of Autum" and "In Amber Clad" should probably be removed, as the rest of the article is about Starfleet from the Star Trek series, while these ships and space stations are from the Halo videogame series and not connected.


-agreed, Star Trek and Halo are two seperate universes.

[edit] Delta Flyer

Why isn't there any mention of the Delta Flyer under the auxiliary vessels section? Wl219 09:30, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

Why dont you do it :) --Cat out 08:23, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Name

Should this article not be "List of Starfleet ships by class?" The article lists ships, not the classes of ships, whihc the title says.say1988 18:08, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

The classes are listed along with ships. A category should be used if you do not want to include information. --Cat out 21:14, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Pre-Fed ships

According to startrek.com, Daedalus class ships are early Federation not pre-Federation. The Daedalus section should be bisected from the NX class section. Wl219 16:15, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

Okay, I dont mind that --Cat out 21:13, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Relevance?

Can we add some real world relevance to this article... i.e. info in a column specifying what fictional work we are referencing here? (Film title or TV episode this ship appears in or is referenced in?) Halfblue 05:21, 17 August 2006 (UTC)

We have that column, feel free to fill it in. I am working on other things so it will be some time before I have time for this particular article. --Cat out 12:31, 17 August 2006 (UTC)
Going through the linked articles I am noticing a problem with a few of them. They seem to lead off or include in their entirety fictional information about the ship in question. The actual real world reference as to where this "ship" comes from is way down the article or buried in the notes. The Wikipedia Guide to layout WP:LAYOUT asks that "first paragraph summarizes the most important points of the article". I think an "important point" would be what specific work of fiction (title and plot detail) the ship in question comes from. Halfblue 14:32, 18 August 2006 (UTC)
Oh dont give me the bla guideline thing. This is a list not an article. Furthermore article already tells the reader where the ships are from under "Participations" field. The tachion blocade for instance happened on a very spesific episode, citing the episode number shouldn't be rocket science. Same goes for stuff like battle of wolf 359. --Cat out 16:39, 18 August 2006 (UTC)
Apparently you miss-read my post above since I was talking about "the linked articles" and not this page in particular. As to “bla guideline thing “, consensus guidelines is the way Wikipedia works. Since this is Wikipedia and not a Star Trek fan site information included is supposed to have citations. Halfblue 16:32, 19 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Napalm + Chlorine

i.e., what I'd like to douse this list in. I started puting in some sources for these appearances but am frustrated by a few things. I'd like y'all's thoughts on these observations/suggestions:

  • "Cruiser" / "Heavy Cruiser" / "Escort" etc. -- With very few exceptions, it seems Starfleet doesn't categorize its ships like this. If I were looking for a particualar ship on this page, I would find the current headings virtually useless.
    • I'd suggest ditching the headings and sorting by ship class. Alternatively, perhaps a few major headings, e.g. "Starships" and "Support Craft", with the classes underneath.
  • Column headers. Seems that "participations" and "sources" should be merged, esp. for entries that have appeared multiple times (e.g. the Excelsior class Hood -- info.'s not all there on this page, but look at the Excelsior class starship (Star Trek) blurb).
    • What do you think about cutting the class pages' information and pasting it to this page (replacing the class page ship listings with a link to the list here). OR for the major ship classes on this page, napalm the tables here and link instead to the "List of ___ class ships" on the ship class pages. The rationale being that it seems silly to have a large portion of this information duplicated across this page and the class pages. Okay, time to partay; see y'all bleary eyed in the morning --EEMeltonIV 01:19, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

How about something more like this... AlistairMcMillan 01:33, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

Can I ask why the list is set up alphabetically? Wouldn't it make more sense to arrange chronologically by when the ship class first came into service. Seems like readers would get a much better idea of the evolution of the Federation starship that way.132.183.70.215 15:16, 28 August 2006 (UTC)JPH

Since it's a list, I imagine someone coming to this page is looking for info. on a specific class, in which case alphabetical is easier to find what you're looking for than chronological. --EEMeltonIV 17:04, 28 August 2006 (UTC)
And for most (if not all) off the classes, we don't know when they entered service. AlistairMcMillan 21:56, 28 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Merge with/redirect to Lost Ships of Starfleet?

I came across Lost Ships of Starfleet, and someone suggested a merge with List of Starfleet ship classes. At first I thought that wasn't a good idea, but since List of Starfleet ship classes attempts to list the fate of each ship, perhaps the two should be merged (or possibly just creating a redirect from there to here). Thoughts? --Fang Aili talk 19:05, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

Agreed, and I'd even suggest throwing in the "other ship classes", too. Just squeeze 'em all into one über list. --EEMeltonIV 19:09, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] edit sections?

Is there some way we can make each section editable? Right now you have to edit the whole thing at once. Is this a table issue? --Fang Aili talk 18:24, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

Actually.. each type of ship is separate. But if there's a way to separate the ship classes that'd be cool. Some of them are pretty long. --Fang Aili talk 18:37, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Grouping?

Rather than just a straight alphabetical list, I wonder if it would make sense to clump these. Some random ideas:

  • By series in which they first appear? Problem is that this assumes someone coming here looking for info. -- someone who saw a Miranda class ship in DS9 may, oh my goodness, have to spend two extra seconds finding it under a "Movie ships" heading
  • Major vs. minor ships/classes? Problem is that it's subject to non-NPOV stuff
  • Multiple vs. single appearances? Possible way to avoid non-NPOV of doing major/minor ships, but excludes things like the Prometheus class -- then again, is that a major class?

My two strips of latinum. --EEMeltonIV 16:08, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

Sorting by "class" makes greater sense. Enterprise-D appeared in the movies and in TNG,DS9 era. A checkbox like how Seiyu is handled in Oh My Goddess! might shed some light.
"Source" column should be converted to a <cite> structure.
There is very little known about the ships that made appearances every season. Little is known about even ships like voyager (which was turned inside out on a number of occasions)
Basicaly we mostly only know that a ship and/or its class exists and not much more.
--Cat out 16:22, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Where did these ships come from?

There are some ships and even classes in here that don't seem ever to have referenced on screen or even in the Star Trek: Encyclopedia, which normally has all the "semi" official speculation. Take for example the USS Endaevor II mentioned as being Daedalus class NCC 170????? Anyone know where this is supposed to have come from? I thought only canon stuff was supposed to make it into these articles. I'm open to correction but this seems to be someone's own made-up bit of Star Trek???? Rmkf1982 22:43, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

I can't answer for everything, but there is an also lot of things from the Encyclopedia that aren't cited as such, and far too many bare episode citations. Morwen - Talk 17:21, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
In a dialog between Riker, Picard, and Data the ship that crashed has been identified as a "Daedalus class - USS Essex" at the beginning of the show. At time index 24:28 Picard inquires the now possessed Troi the designation and crew compliment of the Essex. She responds with "NCC-173, Daedalus class starship, crew compliment 229". I do not know about Endaevor nor do I care to investigate. --Cat out 17:24, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
Yes. That's the entire extent of sourceable canon material about the Daedalus class. This article assigns the Archon and Horizon this class. It doesn't cite the Encyclopedia, which is the source of this. Instead it cites the episodes! Which contain no such claim, what with the Daedalus class not actually having been invented in TOS. This really is dreadful, that people have been putting these false citations in. I'm tempted rip out all these references as probably made up and stick a {{unreferenced}}, then re-add references as I can verify them. List of Star Trek planets has the same problem: it looks well-referenced but lots of the references are just lies. Morwen - Talk 21:15, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Aeroshuttle?

FAO EEMeltonIV

Saw your comment in the List of Starfleet ship classes article about the origins of the references to the Voyager Aeroshuttle. I would like to add my own doubts to yours so to speak - I can't recall coming across this anywhere. Does anyone else have any thoughts?

This is what fanboy central has to say on it. Considering other Okudagram-type things have made the cut, I suppose this is kosher... (?). --EEMeltonIV 19:25, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] "Status" column

Anyone else think the Status column is fairly useless? The overwhelming majority of these are "unknown", and instances where the ship is destroyed are covered under the "Significance" column. "In service" also seems a little too "in-universe"y. Probably this article needs to be finished up in terms of cleanup and getting significant info in, but would anyone object, strenuously or otherwise, to that "Status" column going away? --EEMeltonIV 04:05, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

No ojections here - as you say, the significant column mostly includes the fate of the ship in cases where it was destroyed. If not, I'll get around to adding it in when i'm finished with the lost ships article. Speaking of which, lost ships could be merged into the main ships article - i know its been suggested before but how about we see what the lost article looks like when its mostly complete, and see if its information can be merged into the main article?Rmkf1982 08:50, 23 October 2006 (UTC)
Status is necesary to identify which ones are destroyed, went afk/mia, or simply never mentioned out there. I wouldnt mind the usage of symbolism (a red cross representing destroyed and etc) --Cat out 11:03, 24 October 2006 (UTC)
Oh nevermind I like it how it is now. --Cat out 22:55, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Peregrine-class

Okay, I know this is going to be a bone of contention, but having poked around, the modified Peregrine-class courier ships used by the Maquis are different than the Federation fighters like those used in the opening shots of the Battle of Bajor. If you look at the Memory Alpha pages, the two CG models are - while similar - demonstrateably different, leading me to believe the two are separate classes. Kant Lavar 02:09, 30 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] {{main|}} major classes?

Rather than replicating information here and on separate class articles (i.e. the ones listed in Template:trekshipclass), would it be appropriate to cut-and-paste information here into the individual class articles and replace this content with {{main|-insert class article here-}}? NB List of Star Trek: Deep Space Nine characters for a page for which this seems to work. --EEMeltonIV 21:45, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Merge from USS Farragut (Star Trek)

Please merge any relevant content from USS Farragut (Star Trek) per Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/USS Farragut (Star Trek). (If there is nothing to merge, just leave it as a redirect.) Thanks. —Quarl (talk) 2007-02-26 08:52Z

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