Talk:List of Australian ports

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Contents 1 Completeness? 2 Overwritten 3 How should we annotate non-gazetted ports? 4 Red links

[edit] Completeness?

Was this created from any authoritative source or restrictive definition? The lists seem to be extrememly short to me, but I don't want to add more ports to the list that I think belong there without some reference for completeness. --Scott Davis ^Talk 13:41, 9 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Overwritten

I am about to overwrite this list with a list of ports as they appear in the Gazetteer. This will have the following advantages:

1. It will be complete, authoritative, well defined and referenced, in some sense, per Scott's query above;
2. Ports will be listed according to their gazetted names, and will therefore link to an article on the port itself, rather than to cities in which they are located.

The disadvantages are:

1. Information on port usage will be lost.

Eventually I will merge the previous information into the current article. Until then, I'm of the view that this overwrite is an improvement. The previous version is still in the article history; revert me if you disagree. Hesperian 13:25, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

I am still confused, sorry. What was the source of the list of ports, is it places with "Port" in their name. I am almost sure that the list is not complete. For example the Batemans Bay marina is missing. Eden was too?!

I appreciate that for large cities, the port and the city articles should be separate. For smaller places like Ulladulla and Bermagui though I don't think this is the way to go, but that can be solved by a redirect - is that what is intended? --Golden Wattle ^talk 21:54, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

The source was the Gazetteer of Australia. The criterion was all places of type "PORT" (i.e. ports) or "HBR" (i.e. harbours, havens, roadsteads, marinas). It would appear that Batemans Bay Marina is not a gazetted place.

I prefer to link to the actual harbours, rather than link directly to the "wrong" place. I do believe that we'll have an article on Ulladulla Harbour eventually. I'm sure there's plenty to write about it; it's just a matter of waiting for someone to get around to writing it. Hesperian 22:53, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

In particular because Eden was missing, I am tagging the list as incomplete - no disrespect to Hesperian but Geoscience Australia is not sufficiently authorative. Eden is a major minor regional port! I hate to think what else is missing.--Golden Wattle ^talk 22:45, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

No offense taken. Actually, the Gazetteer of Australia is the ultimate authority on place names in Australia. Which is a shame because I agree that in some areas it is incomplete. e.g. less than a third of Australia's lighthouses have been gazetted. Hesperian 22:53, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

With reference to the comment, "I prefer to link to the actual harbours, rather than link directly to the "wrong" place." Not sure if you have been to Ulladulla, the harbour is at the centre of the town. I think it would be better if we included information on harbours in the place and allowed the article to break out when it got too detailed. A bit like schools in a community. I doubt for Ulladulla it will be a separate article - a challenge of course for somebody to prove me wrong. It does need to be a separate section within the article. My redirection policy only applies to very small places like Bermagui and Ulladulla and I intend that they should indeed have a separate section on the harbour within the placename article.--Golden Wattle ^talk 23:21, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] How should we annotate non-gazetted ports?

The article states in the heading The list also contains some entries for places that are widely recognised as ports or harbours, yet have not been gazetted as such. These are noted and individually referenced in the list. - How should we note and reference to identify clearly? I think there are going to be similar numbers of ungazetted places as gazetted places in the end for NSW at least, particularly if this list includes historic ports such as Tathra - I think it should, but of course noted as such. --Golden Wattle ^talk 00:43, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

It wasn't very clear, was it? What I meant to say was that places that aren't gazetted are provided with an explicit citation, so places that don't have an explicit citation can be assumed to cite the Gazetteer of Australia. The alternative is to explicitly cite the Gazetteer for every gazetted entry; this might make sense once we get to the point where the gazetted ports only constitute half the list. Hesperian 01:42, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Red links

Thanks for making it some sort of complete list (I only just noticed). Should we make redirects from the red links, and disambiguate wrong blue ones to unique article names for the ports (then make redirects to a town there)? The redirects mean this list is still right if someone later turns the redirect into an article. Examples: Port Glenelg (presently red) will likely never have an article, so I'd like to make it a redirect to Glenelg, South Australia. Outer Harbour is presently a redirect to Outer Harbor, South Australia, but is listed as a port in Queensland. --Scott Davis ^Talk 13:33, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

I think that some of the west aus entries that are blue are to wrong articles as well.I think we will encounter wrong arts and dismbig and redirect issues for most entries SatuSuro 13:59, 20 January 2007 (UTC)