Talk:Kolob
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[edit] Archive
[edit] broken link
"A symbolic interpretation of Kolob" which used to point to [1] appears to no longer be on bibleman.net; I have removed the link. If someone can find somewhere else where it is hosted (on bibleman, or elsewhere) please add it with the correct URL. --Matthew 20:27, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Zions
it seems appropriate to mention Zion National Park here, but Pop culture doesn't seem to fit, somehow. If someone else has a better idea (I was thinking making it something like In modern culture or In the US but just couldn't get anything to fit well enough in my mind to be convinced. --Matthew 20:50, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
- how 'bout: Cultural use or Cultural usage? WBardwin 04:52, 11 July 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Encyclopedic Value
As an encyclopedia article, this entry fails horribly. For one, it is way too long. There needs to be a simple section explaining the basics about Kolob and another (or perhaps others) explaining current theories. I deleted the section or "representationalism" because it was not only esoteric but irrelevant. At most it deserves its only article with a one line description in the main Kolob article. The term "representationalism" is unreferenced and unexplained. It's unacceptable.
The section on theories of word origin is riddled with errors. Some sentences are completely false: "Most Egyptian scholars (who are neither critical nor interested in Mormon theology) believe that while Kolob may be of Semitic origin, it was not translated (rendered) from the papyri Smith possessed, but merely transliterated from a word he allegedly heard M. H. Chandler, the previous owner, use; and this prior to Smith's translation of some of the papyri's characters." First of all, most Egyptian scholars are not even aware of the word "Kolob" or of Joseph Smith's connection to M.H. Chandler. In is inaccurate to state that egyptologists believe that he heard the word and transliterated it. In fact, it is unlikely that even more than a handful have an opinion on the matter at all.
Next sentence: "The word is specifically claimed to be the Arabic 'qalb' (plural 'qulob'), meaning 'heart' or 'center.'" Why use the passive voice? WHO claims that the word has a connection to the Arabic "qalb?" If someone really believes that, please reference that person. Following sentence starts, "It is contended..." Once again, the writer frustratingly uses the passive voice. Who contests that? What is his/her name?
On a more fundamental level, the contention that "Kolob" may be connected to the Arabic "qalb" (heart) and thereby to Reformed Egyptian through the Afro-Asiatic language family is extremely, extremely weak. Is may just as easily be linked to the Arabic word, "kalb" (dog) or to any number of similar sounding words in the Semitic family. Since Joseph Smith gave no explanation of the word, there is virtually no evidence.
Next problem: "Some critics supporting and discounting Smith are apt to find legitimate Semitic origins and relations to the hypocephalus in order to empathize a non-African presence in Egypt. This has caused widespread controversy." First, "empathize" is not that best word. Secondly, I can say with total certainty that there was not "widespread panic." The writer sounds like he/she is trying SO hard to make this article sound important.
The statement that Kolob as Jesus Christ is "orthodox but relatively uncommon" is unsubstantiated. It is neither orthodox nor unorthodox. Rather it is unimportant. Leaders of the LDS Church do not speculate on the meaning of Kolob nor brand certain interpretations orthodox or unorthodox.
This article, in short, is without legitimate references or experts. Kolob is an element of Mormon theology and nothing else. Egyptologists are not concerned with the theory of the word "Kolob", though they may have some interest in the original papyri. The article should focus on its appearance in Mormon scripture with a no more than a brief discussion of its possible origin. After all, this encyclopedia is about consensus, not esoterica. If the FARMS people want to speculate more, they have their own website. They are free to keep pumping their internally reviewed literature to their limited audience without restraint. However, when they enter the realm of scholarly consensus, their ideas must have merit and include references. Otherwise, it looks like it was conjured out of thin air.
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- Restored the deletion referred to by the anon above until his concerns have been reviewed and/or addressed. WBardwin 16:59, 3 September 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Problems with Kolob
Because of the length of time that such a planet would take to rotate, it would mean that one side was extremily hot (depending on how close it was to the start it orbited) and at night, it would be so cold that it would near absolute zero (-273.16°C). It may be so hot on the day side that the rock would turn molten and even boil into space, and anything on it's service would be vapourised by the heat. There would be no atomosphere because the heat would have boiled it into space. With the described size of the planet, if it's this size, the stars would have to be massive. It would be under the influence of the planets gravity so much that the star would wobble all the planets around out of orbits as the planets transited each other. Planets and other bodies would possibility crash into Collob and the start because of the gravitational disruptions caused. If the planet slowed down enough and was close enough to the star, it would literally be boiled away into nothing. Whether it was made of rock or gasses, it would need far more chemical matter that the stars could ever happen to hold. 11:29, 13 October 2006 84.66.26.43 (Talk)
- moved from article for discussion. WBardwin 18:04, 13 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Sagittarius A
I think kolob is very massive therefore it slows down time and takes 1000 of our years by the time it rotates once. I think we could find out if Sagittarius A is indeed Kolob. The mass is estimated to be 3.7 solar masses and it has a radius of about 17-light hours. We need the correct relativity equations. Since Kolob is compare to Earth here is the earth's weight 59742KG earth's radius 6,378.135 km. I imagine if it possible that we could stand on Sagittarius A it would seem 1 day has past when 1000 years has past on Earth relativily speaking. However I don't got the correct relativity equation.
