Talk:Kefir

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

As there was way too much duplication, I merged waterkefir and kefir together. Flame away. -- Sy / (talk) 01:23, 23 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Contents

[edit] Is that red Bull link just an Add?

Unless I'm missing something that Red Bull link can be removed because it seems like advertising to me.


12:43, 16 April 2006 (UTC)~

In certain sites, I noted that kefir is sometimes also known as (Tibetan) Snow Lotus (Tien Shan Hsueh Lien) and/or Tibetan mushroom. Does anyone know if this is correct or not?

[edit] Kefir grains list - not SPAM

The International Kefir community kefir grains list provides access to real kefir grains, mostly free or for cost of postage. I believe that this is useful information, not SPAM. If this is not acceptable, then a Google link that helps people find free kefir grains should be given. Webaware 16:03, 23 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Coconut kefir

If someone is looking for coconut kefir information than wikipedia is not probably the best place for it. It's spam. -- tasc talkdeeds 10:03, 26 April 2006 (UTC)

SPAM is unsolicited commercial information. A detailed description of how coconut water kefir is made is not SPAM. Kefir is broadly recommended as a "superfood", so many people with nutrition-based health problems are seeking information about what kefir is and how to prepare it. Some of these people (not a small number) cannot tolerate dairy, and are interested in ways to get the probiotic benefits of kefir without inflicting lactose or casein on their gastro intestinal tracts. Rather than providing a full description of these preparation methods (thus turning Wikipedia into a recipe book), I think it is better to provide references to existing information. Webaware 10:24, 26 April 2006 (UTC)
Kefir is not known to be or contain probiotics, but some health effects may be attributed to kefir. Knorrepoes 09:19, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Health benefits

BBC page on that. 86.136.252.198 01:02, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Links to do-it-yourself resources

I'm not generally opposed to a single external link that has other DIY resources about making your own Kefir, but a link to such a site should not be placed by an editor who is obviously affiliated to this site, per WP:EL. It is about this site: http://www.webaware.com.au/ferment/finding_kefir.php . I don't know enough of kefir to judge the page, so I leave that to other editors. Han-Kwang 19:37, 3 December 2006 (UTC)

G'day Han-Kwang, we have a problem here as you keep putting up road blocks. The article is about kefir, a fermented food / drink, and kefir requires a culture starter for the ferment to commence. We used to have some links that helped people find where to get that culture starter (for free - not commercial!) but you took them away, citing WP:EL. This is not the first time this article has had this problem.
I provided a page on my website to act as a directory for finding culture starters, and added a link in this article, in an attempt to comply with WP:EL; I initially looked at using DMOZ, but it was too limited, so I created a page and added a user submission form at the bottom. Now you claim that I can't even do that, again citing WP:EL, because I am affiliated with the link. This is just getting weird, because the page in question is a directory of links to other websites - thus my "affiliation" amounts to promotion of other people's websites, from whom I receive no benefit.
I put it to you, then: how can we provide some information on acquiring culture starters for kefir from non-commercial sources without breaking WP:EL? And please don't now cite WP:NOT, because I would first assert that knowing where to acquire culture starters for kefir is basic information. Webaware 21:57, 3 December 2006 (UTC)
See conflicts of interest: "If it is a relevant and informative link that should otherwise be included, please consider mentioning it on the talk page and let neutral and independent Wikipedia editors decide whether to add it. This is in line with the conflict of interests guidelines." If another (established) editor besides you agrees with you that it is an informative link that belongs in this article and replaces it, I will no longer object. Han-Kwang 22:21, 3 December 2006 (UTC)
OK, will do. Webaware 22:32, 3 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Finding Kefir Grains

G'day all. I have created a page on my website, detailing where to obtain real kefir grains. This page includes links to:

  • lists of users who share real kefir grains
  • email lists and web forums where people share kefir grains
  • some commercial suppliers of real kefir grains
  • some commercial suppliers of powdered kefir starters (hey, some people apparently like them!)

I've done this because too many Wikipedians want to remove any such links from this article, citing WP:EL. I personally think that information on how to find real kefir grains is important to the article, but I can't add the link to my page (above) because I'm affiliated - I made the page, it's on my website, Catch-22.

If you think that information on finding kefir grains is useful to include in this article, please add a link to this page to the External links section of the article. Webaware 22:42, 3 December 2006 (UTC)


[edit] plagiarism

The first paragraph in the health benefits section is cut and pasted from two places in an article written by Edward Farnworth in the "Food Science and Technology Bulletin" in 2005. It's plainly copyrighted and is available online. This link may work: plagerized

If not check out www.ifis.org and search for kefir. I can't seem to figure out what to do about it.James.folsom 19:08, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

Which article are you concerned with? I'd remove the sections and give this URL in the edit summary and talk page as my rationale, if it's true. I might summarize the passages and give the URL as a reference. Xiner (talk, email) 21:10, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

I'm going to delete the plagiarism now.James.folsom 23:08, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Koumiss confusion

I'm removing a passage from the article because it appears to be from an author who is confusing koumiss production with kefir production. I'm placing the passage here in case someone can prove otherwise.

(Throughout history, kefir was kept and fermented in a simple leather pouch, never to be washed. Portions were removed for consumption, the rest remaining in the pouch, and fresh milk added.)

—The preceding unsigned comment was added by James.folsom (talk • contribs) 2007-02-05T10:04:11.

G'day James, I like the edit job you've done on this article - it sorely needed it! Regarding your comment above, I've heard this particular concept put about a bit in the kefir forums, particularly by a bloke who has done a lot of (amateur) investigation into kefir, Dominic Anfiteatro. Additionally, Ed Farnworth says this in his book, Handbook of Fermented Functional Foods: "It would appear from the oral tradition of kefir that fermentation of milk in skin bags as a way of preserving milk led to the production of the first kefir grains and started the long tradition of producing kefir." Webaware talk 01:48, 5 February 2007 (UTC)
Work it back in there somewhere then. I honestly had never heard that in relation to kefir, but I'm not omnipotent.James.folsom 01:56, 5 February 2007 (UTC)
Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org../../../k/e/f/Talk%7EKefir_573b.html"