Talk:Jumping the broom
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Two POV sentences removed from pagan section:
- Many pagans, as well as non-pagans, now associate jumping the broom with pagan handfastings. For pagans not of African American descent, including a broom in the ceremony is appropriate.
Nothing wrong with neo-pagans taking over African American custom, but claiming it as their own seems a bit much. Ortolan88 16:49 Dec 5, 2002 (UTC)
Could someone move up the actual description of what this practice is, and explain it a bit more? Assume a reader who has never heard of this -- Tarquin 18:39 Dec 5, 2002 (UTC)
- Done, with link. I guess I didn't move it up though. Ah, well. Ortolan88
"has been adopted as neo-pagan custom." Huh? By whom? Isn't it only Wiccans that do this? Is it really NPOV or is it just another example of a Wiccan trying to push his/her religion as a general pagan thing? It's probably just due to ignorance, but it should perhaps be reworded, something like "some neo-pagans, mostly Wiccans...". // Liftarn 09:08 Jan 3, 2003 (UTC)
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[edit] jumping the broom: the real story
it kind of offends me, as an african-american, to hear people say that jumping over the broom was a "pagan" ritual. this is the real story... during the time of the enslavement of black people, they, as "non-humans", were not allowed to worship God in a sanctuary like whites. therefore, when a "nigger marriage" was to commence, there was no way for the black slaves to commit to each other before God, as was the custom in a religious ceremony. the slaves had to create their own rituals to honor their union. therefore, to symbolize a male slave's committment to his slave wife, they jumped the broom. jumping the broom symbolizes sweeping away the old and bringing in the new, or a symbol of a new beginning. another reason that jumping the broom was used by enslaved africans was because it assisted in maintaining a tie to their culture and homeland-- it was an African traditon. and as a little known aside- jumping the broom was an ancient celtic ritual also. i hope that clears everything up!
- I moved this commentary out of the article: "This is incorrect. Jumping the broom WAS a West African tradtion brought over to America. Even though slaves couldn't legally marry, they still could follow tradition." posted by User:70.178.86.74 and added a {{dubious}} tag to the claim. We can just pull the info out if no one has any sources. NickelShoe (Talk) 21:07, 25 March 2006 (UTC)
- it kind of offends me, as an african-american, to hear people say that jumping over the broom was a "pagan" ritual......as a little known aside- jumping the broom was an ancient celtic ritual also.
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- Was this even wrote by the same person? In most people's minds pagan and ancient celtic are synonymous and there is, frankly, a contradiction in his own words here.--MaverickDruid 16:21, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
[edit] jumping the broomstick
from www.phases.org.uk: "The besom, or broomstick wedding is now usually associated with gypsies, but at one time it seems to have been known in Wales amongst people who were not gypsies. A birch-broom was set aslant across the open door, either that of the bride's home or that of the cottage in which the couple were to live. The young man leapt over it into the house, and the girl then did the same. Care had to be taken not to touch the doorpost or the broom, or to move the latter accidentally, otherwise the ceremony was void. It had to be performed in the presence of witnesses, and one person, chosen for his standing and importance in the community, acted as officiant. Such a marriage was considered quite valid, however strongly the clergy might condemn it. It could, however, be broken without difficulty if, during the first twelve months, the besom was replaced in the doorway, and the dissatisfied partner jumped backwards over it from the house into the open air. The same conditions applied here as at the wedding. There had to be witnesses, and the person jumping had to avoid touching the broom or doorpost as he or she leapt. If the rite was properly performed, both parties were considered free to marry again.
- They gypsy wedding was slightly different. A broom-branch was laid on the ground in the open, and the bride and groom jumped backwards and forwards over it, holding hands as they did so. A rush ring was then placed on the girl's finger, to be replaced later by a gold ring brought from the joint earnings of the couple. There was also another form in which an ordinary besom was held by the father of the bride, or of the groom, with its bushy end resting on the ground, and first the young man and then the girl leapt over it in turn."
It is generally associated in the UK with "common law" marriages
[edit] Phrase indicating marriage?
I question the first sentence of this article. Jumping the broom is a symbolic wedding custom. As a phrase indicating marriage, it's a euphemism based on the custom and it seems odd to use that as the first statement in the article. I don't wish to edit it because I'm not familiar enough with the custom, but it seems misleading.
[edit] Phrase or Custom
I understand your concern, but I fully believe that it is a phrase first and a custom second. My reason being that more people in the African American community identify with the saying than the actual practice. Yes it is/was definately a practice (in Africa and America). But if we are going to speak of the subject in the present, then the former (phrase) should take prcedense. Plus, more people are probably searching for this article to find out the root of the SAYING than the root of the practice since most already know it originates among Blacks (in the American form, anyway). Still, I think I will add the custom/practice part to the first sentence as well just to be safe. thanks for the feedback. --Scott Free 19:02, 31 July 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Ashanti Connection
I'm not sure this is true. I know Ashantis and they don't recognize this practice at all. Unless you can provide a reference, I think that part should be taken out
[edit] Ashanti Connection
Read the book I cited below "Fall of the Asante Empire" and it explains it there. The article also explains that the practice isn't done much anymore by today's Akan populations and was mainly popular during the height of the Asante Confederacy. By the way, do you have a reference (other than yourself) for the pre-christian jumping of the broom you recently added. Just curious cuz if not that part might need to be deleted as well. holla back.Scott Free 14:14, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
