User talk:Jinanez

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You have new messages (last change).

hi

i dont really know what i am doing but here goes.

William Hawi is part of Lebanon history. He was a Lebanese politician and he was killed 1976 during his fight for independance. He should be included for his contribution to Lebanon's fight for freedom. This page should be linked to the "Lebanese people" page and to the Lebanon project thing... i just dont know how to do it.

As i said, i dont really know what i am doing. I also have relevant pictures that i would like to include but unforutnately i have not found out how yet....

Anyway, a simple googe search should show more information about the existance and life of William Hawi (or Haoui).



Welcome!

Hello, Jinanez, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Again, welcome! 

Hi there, The main reason for the nomination for deletion is that the article is biased (not neutral) and needs some heavy wikifying. Please read the links above, do the necessary changes and I'm sure that you will end up with a good article. See for instance Rafik Hariri as an example on how to do this. Cheers, ArchStanton 15:48, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

  • Look at Rafik Hariri as an example and open the edit tab. Notice that each section begins with ==Heading== - this creates those bold headings and separates the article into sections. If you want a section to be broken into subsections, use ===Sub Heading===. You don't need to use outline form with I.1.a. and stuff like that. This is the main thing most editors refer to when they say something needs to be wikified - that way it's not just a lot of text. I would even suggest copying the first paragraph of Rafik Hariri and pasting it into the new article, replacing the pertinent text, just to see what the formatting should look like.--Dmz5 10:11, 22 December 2006 (UTC)
  • All the complicated stuff at the top of Hariri's article in the edit tab translates into that nifty box on the article page with all the information about him. You might even try copying that stuff to the top of the new article and filling in whatever lines you can fill in.--Dmz5 10:15, 22 December 2006 (UTC)
  • Also, read WP:N, WP:V, WP:NPOV, and WP:NOR to get yourself situated and see what the other users are referring to in the deletion debate. "Notable" and "POV" (that is, "point of view") have very specific definitions on Wikipedia. ghits means google hits - some editors reason that if a subject has only a handful of google hits, it is not notable. Good luck --Dmz5 10:14, 22 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] William Hawi

Hi there! I hope that you don't interpret my actions on this article as unfriendly. An important Wiki-policy is to not bite the newcomers - and I really believe that you could be an important contributor to Wikipedia. I hope that I have not scared you off with all the links!

The reason for my suggestion to speedy delete the article was that it has all the signs of an article directly copied and pasted from another source. This is a violation to Wikipedia's copyright policy, and is a reason in itself for deletion. Your comments here has shown that you are fluent in English (better than me!) so I don't think this is the case anymore - but you should fix the section headings and the article will not look like a copy/paste-thing.

But please read the WP:NPOV and stick to facts because I still believe that Wikipedia-articles should not raise someone to martyrdom. It is a very loaded word that should be used with care. That is why it is still nominated for deletion. What I would suggest is that you to begin with strip the article down to a few facts (background, life, death, importance) and let it stay that way for some days. Actually, It could well happen that the article will expand by 'itself' by people adding to it. Then you can slowly expand the article yourself with more facts and preferably some images as time progresses and your experience with editing Wikipedia builds up. Good luck, and hope to see more of your edits in the future! ArchStanton 11:17, 22 December 2006 (UTC)

  • Thank you for your suggestions ArchStanton, as i said, i am learning as i go and you have been of tremendious help. Maybe i should explain that the 'Martyrdom' of Hawi is a known and accepted fact in Lebanon by all political parties but i understand your point of view and i am currently working on making it more 'wikified'. Translating some words from Arabic to English is a bit tricky though. As for the copy/paste thing, well anything worthwhile you will find online about Hawi was actually submitted by myself on behalf of my mother, who is William Hawi's only daughter. So rest assured i have all information first hand and it is the result of 11 years of extensive research and documentation. My mother presented her findings for her Doctorate degree in History and even got the highest grade. :) Jinanez 11:36, 22 December 2006 (UTC)
I like to add some remarks to your answer. Wikipedia is completely neutral. It is nor for, or against somebody. Therefore, any biography has to be treated in a neutral manner (see WP:NPOV. All facts, mentioned in your article, must rely on INDEPENDENT published sources (books, magazines, newspapers etc.) which are then cited as references or in-line notes (see WP:REF). Your own findings and documentation must still be in accordance with the official policy of WP:OR. Furthermore, the word "martyrdom" is a very loaded word, mostly used to designate Christian martyrs in Antique Rome or nowadays Muslim suicidal bombers. I think your grandfather deserves a better word than that. Read the guidelines I mentioned and follow the good advice of user:ArchStanton and in the end you will have an article you'll be proud of. Good luck. JoJan 13:45, 22 December 2006 (UTC)
  • I appreciate that Wikipedia is neutral and I was not trying to express an opinion or take sides. I will rewritten the article in a less 'biased' way upon your recommendations. For now I am learning my way through the editing in Wikipedia. As for "martyrdom" it is a word used heavily in the Lebanese culture and the information i have is all in Arabic hence the translation. I will come up with a less 'loaded' word though to comply with the rules. As for "independant" this article is a summary of 11 years of research and documentation, including newspaper clippings, meeting transcripts, interviews and voice recordings. I will cite the miscelleneous sources as per the rules also. I just need some time to get my act together.Jinanez 14:19, 22 December 2006 (UTC)
What a wonderful article! I was surprised to see it since the article about the Kataeb Party was in such poor shape. I wrote the Hebrew article about the party, and I'll incorporate some of the information in the Hawi article to it. When I have some more free time, I'd like to translate it as a whole to Hebrew. I see you know French (like many of the Lebanese intelligentsia), so you might find this study about the Kataeb interesting. السلام عليكم Lizrael 15:39, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
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