User talk:Jeffness/Archive 1
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[edit] defensemen in the NHL
The NHL spells it DEFENCEMAN !
And don't you go changing the spelling of NHL articles, since it was originally headquartered in Montreal, Canada.
132.205.45.148 19:14, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
- Your link proves my point. There are only 27 instances of it spelled "Defencemen" on NHL.com, as opposed to 1,300 references for "Defenseman". Thanks for proving me right. And it's funny, it says "Did you mean 'Defenseman'?
- --Jeff 23:35, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
[edit] My Crusade for 'Defense'
So I've discovered my first heavy involvement in the inner workings of Wikipedia and the politics. It's funny it's over something so minor, but it's entertaining at the same time.
I was reading the Main Page the other day when I noticed what, I thought, was a mis-spelling of the word defenseman when it referenced Nicklas Lidstrom and his role in scoring the game winning goal during the competition for Ice_hockey_at_the_2006_Winter_Olympics. I posted about it to Talk:Main Page and was corrected and pointed at Defenceman (ice hockey) for proof that defenceman was the correct spelling.
I spent some time reviewing the Wikipedia:Manual of Style and came to the conclusion that this error had basis to be corrected. I started posted to the Wikipedia:Requested moves, a discussion about which is archived on Talk:Defenceman (ice hockey).
I underestimated the negative reaction to the proposal, and there were admitted flaws on my logic used. They were right about some things, wrong about others, and my proposal had areas that could be attacked. I didn't research the Canadian spelling at all, I just assumed, wrongly, that they followed the US spelling.
Another thing I underestimated was how ferociously the US standard was opposed, despite its vastly more prolific usage as proven through research done at [1]. It seems that the US is attacked even in how we spell words! I don't like some of what my country may do as an entity, but extending the level of opposition into spelling surprised me. I think this little microchasm illustrates a much larger modern fact-of-life, and is very interesting to see at work. Canadians have long been known for contrarianism in regards to US positions, feeling they are a counter point to our den of inequity on the southern side of the border, but wow. Spelling. Really.
Moving on, the largest flaw in my logic for my proposal for Defenseman (ice hockey) was that the Wikipedia:MOS only allowed changes from the original main contributor's form of spelling in cases where the spelling is subject to regional concerns. In this case, I chose the wrong article. Defenceman (ice hockey) is about the position, not the nationality of the position. Despite Professional Ice Hockey having it's roots in Michigan as noted at the article Ice Hockey, the subject of the article has no regional ties, and therefore should remain.
Interested, I researched other spellings in other languages in major ice hockey playing countries:
- Swedish: backar
- German: Verteidigern
- French: défenseur (notice the s!)
- Canadian: Defenceman
- Dutch: word for defense: defensie (notice the s!)
- Finnish: Puolustajat
- Slovakian: ---
- Russian: ---
- Italian: Defensore (notice the s!)
(I have problems with baltic languages and can't even begin to guess)...
I also performed research with | Google to determine frequency of use. Results are below.
| Site | With an S | With a C |
|---|---|---|
| NHL.COM] | 25,400 | 160 |
| EuroHockey.net | 234 | 202 |
| IIHF.com | 521 | 61 |
| canoe.ca | 539 | 17,700 |
| "ice hockey" + c or s | 310,000 | 57,600 |
| en.wikipedia.org | 578 | 412 |
| HHOF.com | 76 | 29 |
Amusing: Searching for "defenceman" through www.google.ca
Anyway, I intend to further pursue the spelling change in articles, especially those articles which should have US-centric regional dialects such as the NHL and Derian Hatcher and other US Defenseman. Future proposals will include above noted evidence, reasoning based upon the Wikipedia:MOS regional clauses, and evidence from the James Norris Memorial Trophy, whenever I find out how exactly what the inscription spells "defense". Nothing quite as solid as that, i think. --Jeff 00:43, 2 March 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Spelling changes
The English word material and the English word matériel are two very different things. Arbitrarily changing between the two, as you did in Spruce Goose, is not a good idea. --Carnildo 00:06, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
- God damn you people are picky... That's fine though and a good thing it turns out. I actually meant to change it to materiel without the accented "E"... rather than "material" because there are no accented e's in english, even if it's originally a french word. Thanks for fixing it and NOT putting the accent back, I appreciate it. --Jeff 01:14, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
- What! No diacritics in the English language? What an utterly déclassé position to take. I will sit in a café, eating canapés and drinking Curaçao. and consider your assertion. Perhaps I'll order a soufflé while I contemplate writing a roman à clef. My dining companion will wear a macramé wrap over a gold lamé blouse and tell me about a feeling of déjà vu she had when she met a naïve débutante. During our tête-à-tête, I will tell her a risqué story about ingénue I once knew. Then someone could try to sell us a piñata made from papier-mâché.
-
- Voilà! An overabundance of words that still usually maintain their diacritics when used in more formal writing in English, even though the words have been naturalized into the English language. Words that I couldn't shoehorn into my example would include fiancée, ménage à trois, outré, El Niño and chargé d'affaires, as well as numerous French cooking and music terms. BlankVerse 13:27, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
- Well, thanks for the thorough owning. I might point out, however, that all of the words you used are imports from other languages... A point of contention might be that, even though the foreign word is used amongst a bunch of English words, doesn't make it any more English or any less French or Spanish. That English is so closely related to French, Spanish and German makes it all the easier for words to transfer back and forth, even with the diacritic (thanks for the new word by the way).. :) --Jeff 23:03, 16 March 2006 (UTC)
- Voilà! An overabundance of words that still usually maintain their diacritics when used in more formal writing in English, even though the words have been naturalized into the English language. Words that I couldn't shoehorn into my example would include fiancée, ménage à trois, outré, El Niño and chargé d'affaires, as well as numerous French cooking and music terms. BlankVerse 13:27, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Great pics
Good job on the pictures in the MSU main article. I took a lot of the other pictures in January, whcih we both know is not the ideal time of year for photographing campus. Unfortunately, I am too far away to go take some more campus pics this time of year. Lovelac7 23:44, 29 May 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Unspecified source for Image:MSU Bronze Sparty 2.jpg
Thanks for uploading Image:MSU Bronze Sparty 2.jpg. I notice the file's description page currently doesn't specify who created the content, so the copyright status is unclear. If you have not created this file yourself, then there needs to be a justification explaining why we have the right to use it on Wikipedia (see copyright tagging below). If you did not create the file yourself, then you need to specify where it was found, i.e., in most cases link to the website where it was taken from, and the terms of use for content from that page.
If the file also doesn't have a copyright tag, then one should be added. If you created/took the picture, audio, or video then the {{GFDL-self}} tag can be used to release it under the GFDL. If you believe the media meets the criteria at Wikipedia:Fair use, use a tag such as {{fairusein|article name}} or one of the other tags listed at Wikipedia:Image copyright tags#Fair_use. See Wikipedia:Image copyright tags for the full list of copyright tags that you can use.
If you have uploaded other files, consider checking that you have specified their source and tagged them, too. You can find a list of files you have uploaded by following this link. Unsourced and untagged images may be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.
- From what I can see, as long as we mention the artistic details of the statue, (modernist design by Leonard D. Jungwirth), we're in the clear. I went ahead and added a few words to the MSU article, (and a reference), so it should be kosher. Lovelac7 06:23, 1 September 2006 (UTC)
