Talk:Jeffrey Dahmer
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An event mentioned in this article is a July 22 selected anniversary
User:Someone Else: Thanks for correcting the "wife named susan" bit. I was somewhat wondering about that, since Dahmer is famous for being strictly gay. Also, I think some of the articles would have mentioned if he had a wife. --Pakaran 16:07, 22 Oct 2003 (UTC)
Should there be mention of Ed Gein, seeing how he was a famous serial killer, also from Wisconsin?
--
Personally, think the Ed Gein mention is completely out of place in this article, so am removing it.
40 year old virgin should be mentioned, the serial killer reference refers to dahmer
[edit] Parallels or parallelisms
What do you guys think is the proper form?
Parallels with the British serial killer Dennis Nielsen are often drawn.
or
Parallelisms with the British serial killer Dennis Nielsen are often drawn.
English is not my mother language, but parallels sounds quite incorrect to me. xDCDx 16:18, 26 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- ---
- Hi, xDCDx.
- English is my mother tongue, and "parallelisms" sounds quite incorrect to me, and to God ("parallels" 42,800 v "parallelisms" 119).
- chocolateboy 16:45, 26 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- ---
- It might simply be better to rephrase the sentence, something like this:
Parallels are often drawn between Dahmer and the British serial killer Dennis Nielsen.
- Different structure and no need to squibble; "parallel" serves the need correctly. Hope that helps! <3
- 24.238.203.44 03:47, 27 July 2006 (UTC) (Chacharu)
- ---
Hi there, the google thing is not proof enough for me. For example "fun" appears more in google than "funny", but both words are correct, and usually they are non-interchangeable. Investigating some more I found these: definition of parallelism definition of parallel The following quote from the latter one actually makes both of us right, but "parallel" is more widely used as an adjetive, and "parallelism" is only used as a noun, so I continue to think that "parallelisms" is more suitable for that particular phrase. Quote:
parallel
(...)
n.
3. The condition of being parallel; near similarity
or exact agreement in particulars; parallelism.
(...)
parallelism
n.
1. The quality or condition of being parallel;
a parallel relationship.
2. Likeness, correspondence, or similarity in
aspect, course, or tendency.
(...)
xDCDx 20:35, 28 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- ---
- Hi.
- Your "fun"/"funny" analogy misrepresents the Google stats, which compare the usage of two marginally overlapping nouns in the context used in the article i.e. "draw parallels", "parallels are drawn" and "drawing parallels" vs "draw parallelisms", "parallelisms are drawn" and "drawing parallelisms". The "fun"/"funny" standoff is completely unrelated.
- Rifling through dictionary definitions to improvise an inappropriate usage is like rifling through inconsistencies in English orthography to argue that "fish" should be spelled "ghoti". Common usage, common sense, clarity and good taste disfavour any number of constructions that could legally be concocted by someone determined to use a dictionary to generate meaning rather than analyze it.
- "Parallelisms" is at best clumsy and at worst clueless. Of course "parallelisms" can also mean "parallels". The transitive verb "to rule" can also mean "to draw something with a ruler". As a result, one could say "parallelisms have been ruled between Dahmer and Nielsen ... "; however one wouldn't and one shouldn't in an encyclopaedia.
- chocolateboy 00:42, 29 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- ---
Hello again,
I thought the google links were like the googlefight one, that's why I did not check them and provided the "fun"/"funny" comparison, my fault. These ones are more appropiate in the context. So you must be right then.
My stubborness came because in spanish we say "paralelismos" rather than "paralelos". One of the many false friends, although a rather subtle one.
Sorry for the trouble.
xDCDx 12:47, 29 Jul 2004 (UTC)
[edit] Dahmer Rumors
I don't really know if you want to add anything about this or not but there are rumors that Dahmer actually posted on a newsgroup called alt.tasteless
Also, there have been a lot of rumors about Dahmer listening to Industrial music. Some claim that he picked up victims at a Skinny Puppy concert and was also listening to an album from Clock DVA called Buried Dreams. Buried Dreams is a concept album about sexual fetishism, sadism, and violence. It was supposedly on his stereo when the cops raided his home. Buried Dreams was also the title of a book about John Wayne Gacy.
Another strange rumor is how Dahmer felt about Star Wars and how he related to the power the Emperor had over others.
Artists discussing Dahmer [1] [2]
Info from alt.tasteless about his posts [3][4]
- Geee, early 90's... The guy was into Internet early...
- Newsgroups have been around for years. They started in 1979 and his address was from a school computer which woud have had access to newsgroups back then.
Newsgroups and forums discussing Dahmer rumors in the Industrial music communities [5] [6] [7]
A strange interview done with Dahmer about Star Wars and how he related to the Emperor [8]
Edit: The Star Wars one is a fact. It's from I Have Lived in the Monster: Inside the Minds of the Most Notorious Serial Killers by Robert K. Ressler.
- There were other movies he was kind of obsessed with, it says in the "American Nightmare" book, the first to be written about him. He identified with the yellow-eyed monster in The Exorcist 2 or one of the Psycho sequels, these crappy movies, and he bought yellow eye lens and wore them, according to the book.
[edit] Rebaptized?
This is the first I've heard of someone being re-baptised. I thought in most cases a person was only baptized once. I know sometimes a person may be baptized a second time if their converting from one form of Christianity to another and the church they're entering doesn't recognize the baptism as valid. In the Catholic Church, that's generally the case. And in the off event that there was a question as to whether prior baptisms were valid, the person would be conditionally baptised. I'm not sure if rebaptism would be an accurate description of what happened or not.
JesseG 06:17, Jun 7, 2005 (UTC)
Being rebaptized is a real thing. I think it tends to be more in the charismatic style churches though, where they are big into the dramatic stuff. It can also creep into other sects now and then too. I remember the church I grew up in had a couple instances where they were going to do it and many people thought it was unnecessary and abnormal. DreamGuy 20:17, Jun 7, 2005 (UTC)
I know two people who were re-baptized. Since baptism obviously has no legal binding, if someone leaves the church and perhaps is then convinced to return at a later date, it's a way for them to re-commit, publicly to being a Christian. -Wikitoddia 23:19, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Simple error that needs fixing
The article states that the 14-year-old victim in 1991 was the older brother of the 13-year-old molested in 1988. This, obviously, is not possible - likely a simple mistake, but it needs fixing, and I've no idea where to look for the information.
- This is actually true. It is a coincidence though, Dahmer was surprised to learn they were related.
-
- This cannot be true: A is 14 in 91, B is 13 in 88, when A should be 11 -- in which case, A cannot be the older brother of B. --84.59.205.95 15:23, 24 November 2005 (UTC)
-
- I get what you're saying, although I think its obvious that the word "older" was accidentally put in for "younger"...
You could have fixed it yourself... [candice dobson]
[edit] Fixing the tables
I am a relatively new Wiki editor and I was just wondering if someone could please fix the tables on the victims. I tried to give them a tribute of sorts by showing their pictures to not make them so anonymous so to speak. If you could organize it by Date/Year, Name, Age, and fix up the pictures including the Potential Victims headline with Tracy Edwards that would be great. Sorry to make it look so bad, but I admit that I am new and am only asking for help. Thanks!
ChrisSimpson 05:39, 2 February 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Something weird going on?
The following sentence struck me as a little strange, factually questionable and grammatically atrocious:
"Later live 2 year old boys were found starck naked in his closet, with poopy underwear wrapped around their head. "
-Anonymous 03:27, 2 May 2006 (GMT-5)
I removed the following passage from the Early Life section. It looks like vandalism.
He then went to work for The Waltos Group, in Newport Beach, California. When later asked as to why he sought a rewarding career, he replied, "...it was a difficult time for me, and I thought it was best to join a team of upstanding citizens who resembled circus clowns."
--JChesley, 2/9/2007
- Such vandalisms happen several times a day. I figure, just revert 'em and mark it as minor; don't bother to log them or recount the details, as it will waste your time and clutter the archives.--Orange Mike 16:04, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
- That nonsense was posted before my edit on the 8th, and I missed it somehow. I usually check those things. >:( Wahkeenah 16:06, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Steven Hicks
Perhaps a brief description of how Dahmer got away with his first murder would be in order
If you mean a description of how he disposed of the body, I can probably do that, with sources, but I'm inclined to think it's a bit sensationalist and unnecessarily graphic. Would anyone else care to weigh in? 24.131.12.228 18:10, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
Did anyone else notice the repulsive fact that at the end of Trial and Imprisonment, there is a sentence which is something along the lines of "I like little boys"? I find this extremely disturbing, and a little unnerving that someone is altering this article in such an inappropriate way.
- That was standard vandalism of the sort this page seems to attract; it's long since been removed. --Orange Mike 16:54, 20 December 2006 (UTC)
I just read the article and am completely confused as to whether or not he got away with the first murder, and how and when it was ever found that he was the murderer. Peoplesunionpro 02:22, 16 January 2007 (UTC)
i know the answer seeing as to the fact that steven hicks was my mothers cousin dahmer admitted to the murder and directed police to where he had scattered the remains. further more he was stopped by the police of bath township with the body in garbage bags in the trunk when the officers inquired about the oder he replied o thats just garbage and they let him go seems to me had the investigated further 15 deaths could have been avoided don't ya think? dst stratford ct69.120.197.36 03:02, 19 January 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Tracy Edwards
Just edited the table for Tracy Edwards, could someone check that it's correct, cheers. --Tarzipan 11:02, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Serious re-write
I re-wrote a lot of the section about Dahmer between 1978 and 1987 (between first and second murders) because it seemed really incomplete and you'd have thought he sat in a box for nine years. Also re-arranged section about his early life and made a couple small changes here and there. Just wanted to make it flow better and offer more explanation (to the degree possible) about Dahmer's progression as a person and the course of the slippery slope to his trial. I did make a lot of changes, hope folks aren't upset. Obviously feel free to change what you don't like but I might come back and do likewise. It was a very interesting article. Cheers. -01:41, 2 July 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Konerak
"Jeffrey forked over his ID and told the cops that the kid was his 19-year-old gay lover. Dahmer said that his boyfriend had gotten hammered on booze and just wandered away. Despite the protestations of witnesses at the scene, the cops figured this was just a fag thing and escorted the kid back to Jeffrey's apartment.
Somehow the officers failed to notice any of the corpses and dismembered body parts stashed around the place, not even the one which had been decomposing for three days in the next room. Or, for that matter, the hole in the boy's skull Dahmer had made with an electric drill. The police chalked it up to "a homosexual lovers spat" and left. As soon as they were gone, Dahmer strangled the boy, raped his corpse, and ate some flesh from the carcass. It was his twelfth victim."
Do not remove the grotesque nature of his crimes from the article when they are evidenced. This article is woeful. It has a "pretty" copyrighted picture of Dahmer when it should be using the free mugshot licensed under public domain.--I'll bring the food 03:03, 27 July 2006 (UTC)
- There's a lot of weasel words and implied point of view in this article. Also, I think his trial needs to be explained. The way the article reads now is strange and hard to follow. I actually had to go to the BBC site to make sense of parts of it. Sarah Ewart (Talk) 08:35, 2 August 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Fixed a repeat and a few other things
The song "213" by Slayer was mentioned twice, fixed it. Also switched Literature and Attempted Victims. Cleaned up a few grammar errors. SamuraiFez 05:11, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
There is a serious problem with the later murders. I am watching an A&E documentry on him at the moment and a lot of what is stated does not match with what I'm seeing and A&E is a pretty reliable source.
[edit] Childhood Signs
As we all know the main sign of a possible serial killer is the act of torturing and mutilating animals. This usually occurs in the pre-adolecent stage. This degree of abuse can range anywhere from simply killing an animal or going so far as to remove innards and sometimes even consume them. Such as Richard Trenton Chase, AKA, The Vampire of Sacramento. He would kill an animal and then remove it's insides, Take them home, Place them in his blender and consume them with the belief that his heart would shrink and he would die if he did not complete this ritual at least once every day. Jeffrey Dahmer showed signs of animal mutilation in his pre-adolecent years mainly consisting of beheading and impaling. Dahmer could be compared in some ways to Chase but their ways of ritual were different. The obvious reasoning for Dahmer's killings of young male's was because he was homosexual. Sometimes in a situation of a man realizing his sexual orientation he may become violently confused, Therefor maybe holding a grudge of some sort against other male's without conciously realizing it. As it states in his document he had an incredible fear of abandonment which stems from his parents leaving him alone often. He also like Gacy and many others, Never did stay in one place long enough to aquire any kind of social life.
- Actually the well-known triad of torturing animals, bed-wetting and fire-setting is viewed with increasing skepticism. It's also hardly typical for people to become so distressed upon realizing they are homosexual that they become serial killers/necrophiles/cannibals. The crimes of Richard Chase were superficially similar, but they were very different people. I'm not sure how much of this, if any, you intend to include in the article, but it would be best to refrain until you can provide some references to back it up. 24.131.12.228 18:07, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Capture and death
There's nothing about his capture under this sub-heading.
The subheading might need to be altered. It wasn't as though he went on the run and there was some massive manhunt, which is what 'capture' sounds like to me. He was arrested in his apartment after an escaped victim brought the police right to his door. 24.131.12.228 18:14, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Death
Contrary to popular belief, Dahmer was not killed by a broomstick. His killer stole an iron bar from the prison gym and bashed him on the head with it. Even his father Lionel has confirmed that that was the case.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Amber213 (talk • contribs) 08:12, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
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- You should cite your source (book,news article,etc). Pixelface 00:02, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
I deleted a line in the fifth paragraph about the conflicting reports regarding Konerak Sinthasomphone. The author states that most of the witnesses were "poor and uneducated, so an accurate account of the events would be impossible to ascertain." What does being poor and uneducated have to do with witnessing a crime and being able to relay what one saw? Is it established fact that the witnesses to this event were poor and uneducated? I am sensing bias on the part of the author.
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- REDACTED - Verification of Murder Weapon Scriptor Rex 16:15, 20 March 2007 (UTC)
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-
- Nothing personal Scriptor Rex, but Wikipedia requires verifiable sources (generally of the written variety by reputable publications/websites). Because of the anonymity of user names on Wikipedia, there is no way to verify that you are an employee of CCI. I could claim the same place of employment and disagree with you, but it would not be true. Ward3001 00:13, 17 March 2007 (UTC)
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[edit] Random content blanking
I am restoring the content to this article that is repeatedly being blanked by DreamGuy. No valid reason has been given to remove the content in question, while retaining other similar content, so the attempted removal can only be viewed as an act of random vandalism. --Centauri 12:42, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
With the statement
IN "who's on the microphone" Notorious BIG say "Cannabilistic like that nigga Jeffery Dahmer,"
that seems to border on vandalism (or maybe grafitti)?
--76.184.94.111 09:22, 17 November 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Why was his picture removed?
^^^^ PitchBlack 20:50, 19 December 2006 (UTC)
- Probably because it was a copyright violation; that's the most common reason for image removal hereabouts. --Orange Mike 21:11, 19 December 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Reference in a Video Game
I added the reference to the video game Shadow Man ... It's not that much of importance but that one more lil thing to add to general knowledge ...
[edit] Oxford Apartments
In the "aftermath" section, the Oxford Apartments are mentioned. I assume these are connected with Dahmer somehow, but the article does not say how. Could someone with knowedge of the connection fix this? If it cannot be fixed, the mention of the apartments should be removed. 137.229.25.181 03:19, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Diana?
Under "Attempted Victims" Diana Wiesnowksi is listed as one. She is not mentioned anywhere else in the article and I can find no other sources mentioning her. Can someone back this up with a source and some explanation? 68.116.143.113 15:33, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
[edit] 8 Year Old Murderer?
According to the victims' list, Dahmer committed the first murder just two days after his 8th birthday (unhappy with the present???), and two more before he was twelve. Is this correct, or has someone confused the dates of the murders with the dates of birth? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Franklludwig (talk • contribs) 00:46, 16 January 2007 (UTC).
some one is confusing the dates. he was in his early 20's when he killed steven hicks his first victem. dst stratford ct69.120.197.36 21:56, 19 January 2007 (UTC)
He was actually either just 18 or not quite 18 when he killed Steven Hicks. It was the summer of 1978, right after he graduated from high school. (this is according to his father's book.) 68.116.143.113 04:10, 25 January 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Pop culture references
Is it just me, or does this section seem way too long? Especially references in music, there's dozens of bands/songs that don't really matter. Perhaps we should shorten this, and only include the three to five most popular/well-known instances in each category? - seinman 17:37, 28 January 2007 (UTC)
- Anything (band etc) that doesn't have an article can probably go. If it's too long consider splitting it off into a separate article and perhaps keeping some of the highlights here. Spearhead 19:10, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
I agree with the pop culture suggestion. Three to four popular musical references tops. But I wanted to comment about the victim list. I can not verify the very first victim on the list "Luke Newton". Also, other websites which go into detail about each murder victim, list murder victims not on this list. As an example "Steven Hicks". This was Dahmers first victim. I haven't gone all the way throught the list. It does appear that MANY are missing though.
[edit] Cops Got Off Easy
It would be nice to know more about why the cops that helped kill Konrack were exhonerated. The evidence supporting - at least- gross negligance seems pretty clear cut. Maybe someone familiar with the case could fill out that part of this article. I'd like to know what kind of mind thinks a 14yo kid with a hole drilled in his head is a "fag thing".
- Milwaukee's police department had a bad history with the local gay community, and had been trying to clean up its act. The two cops claim to this day that they thought it was a mere lovers' quarrel (the severity of the wound was not obvious), and didn't want to get in bad with the local gay community by aggressively interfering in a domestic dispute (Milwaukee's police department also has a spotty record about appropriate responses to domestic violence). Their Association has a great deal of clout with the local conservative authorities (though not with other unions), and successful prosecutions or even disciplines of police here are rare. --Orange Mike 22:33, 8 February 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Susan Voth link
I'm inclined to remove the Liquored Words & Afterthoughts link from the "References in Poetry" section (and, for that matter, from the similar section on the Ted Bundy page): the link appears to have been added by the book's author, the book itself was published by PublishAmerica, Amazon's got no reviews for it and nothing else under the author's name, and so on . . . speaking from admittedly limited experience, I'd say it adds up to non-notability. Given that the links here and on Ted Bundy have been up for a few days unchallenged, though, I thought I'd better mention it on the talk page first. Iralith 21:50, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
- OK, I'm taking it out. Iralith 16:46, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Race of victims?
Could this detail be mentioned in the table? The article mentions some Laotian victims but then mentions Dahmer attacked blacks. This should maybe be fleshed out? Malick78 10:11, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
