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Contents 1 Counters, not Measures 1.1 Usage question 1.2 One mistake 1.3 Ban/Bridge ? 1.4 Classes and pages 1.5 To Jag149: it is your browser 2 Missing Transliteration 2.1 Ten phonetically

[edit] Counters, not Measures

I think there's some basic confusion with the content and naming of this page. The Japanese words applied to counts, not measures. A count is a (usually integral) number representing how many individual units of something there is. A measure is the application of a numerical value to a quantity.

A number of entries on the chart are actually measures, and many of them are of foreign origin, which should immediately indicate that they are measures. It should at the very least be obvious why Baht and Dollar don't belong on the list. - - Paul Richter 09:28, 31 Mar 2004 (UTC)

I started the page after reading the Chinese measure word article. I agree there's overlap, but I don't think it's that important. I wouldn't object to a redirect or name change though. Not that many of them are of foreign origin. Exploding Boy 11:51, Mar 31, 2004 (UTC)

I've made the move. Next I'd like to rewrite the whole article... - - Paul Richter 03:17, 1 Apr 2004 (UTC)

I'm not so sure that the counters for hundred, thousand, ten thousand and million should have been removed. Exploding Boy 07:32, Apr 1, 2004 (UTC)

Those aren't counters, they're numbers, and they are properly described in Japanese numerals. Counters are associated with classes of objects. 'hon' applies to cylindrical objects, 'hiki' applies to small animals -- so what does 'man' apply to? - - Paul Richter 07:59, 1 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Along the same lines I've also removed cho (trillions). Next step: flagging the obscure counters (I've never heard fish counted with "bi"...!). Jpatokal 06:58, 20 Jul 2004 (UTC)

I guess you've never gone shopping in a Japanese supermarket. I saw 尾 bi all the time for fish, in the form 一尾２００円 "one fish 200 yen." But it is uncommon in speech. Squidley 21:04, 21 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Yes, I was actually looking for Japanese measures but ended up here. Is there a page with Japanese measures or is that something that I might be getting around to starting one of these days? Jimp 21Sep05

[edit] Usage question

I've never understood the usage of small ヶ in Japanese... since that's used several times on this page, is there a page that explains this? If not, should there be? Bigpeteb 16:16, 12 Oct 2004 (UTC)

At best that'd be a footnote on some page about Japanese writing; it certainly doesn't deserve a page of its own. Squidley 21:04, 21 Jan 2005 (UTC)

It's pronounced "ka" (even though it's a small ke), and it's only used in a few counters. That's pretty much it. — Gwalla | Talk 16:56, 26 May 2005 (UTC)

Kanji? At least, I think that article should have a good coverage of the usage of this character. -- Taku 23:12, May 26, 2005 (UTC)

Except it's not a kanji, as I understand it. It's a small kana. — Gwalla | Talk 00:55, 27 May 2005 (UTC)

Of course, it's a katakana, (what was I thinking), except that it sounds ke instead of ka, as you pointed out. But again it's weird to use a katakana. If it is hiragana, then it makes some sense, though. I suggest Japanese writing. I cannot think of other possible places. -- Taku 02:43, May 27, 2005 (UTC)

Guys, it's an abbreviation of the kanji 箇. Eldh

Exactly. This is what the page says already. It should be easy to confirm this in a dictionary. This is something debated sometimes in the sci.lang.japan newsgroup, so the Google archives of that would be helpful. --DannyWilde 13:05, 24 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] One mistake

There is one mistake on the bottom of this article.

As for "3kai" and "3gai"

When we say "3 times," we cannot use "3 gai."

However, "3rd floor" is said "3 kai" or "3 gai" depending on person.
The preceding comment was added by 134.114.183.163 while blanking the rest of the talk page. I've restored the remainder of the talk page, as well as "signed" it. Mo0[talk] 02:31, 29 November 2005 (UTC))
She says she did it accidentally and she is sorry. :-) --134.114.183.163 05:43, 4 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Ban/Bridge ?

Two things -

• [1] I believe ban (番) means a lot more than indicated at present, it is often used as an ordinal number if I'm using that word correctly. Even non-Japanese speakers have probably heard of ichiban meaning "number one."
• [2] What's the counter for bridges? I tried to ask someone how many bridges were in Osaka and I couldn't figure it out. --Do Not Talk About Feitclub (contributions) 14:25, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

For bridges, simply "hon" (as in counting something with length) works well enough. When talking about bridges in architecture terms, "ka" (as in "Frames") are used as they are considered a frame of sort. "Kyaku" (as in legs) are sometimes used, but not often enough. "Ko" (as in the general counter word) can be used as well but it's often awkward. Traditional "tsu" can be used like "Turn right at mittsume no hashi" (Turn right at third bridge). --Revth 08:00, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Classes and pages

Is it worthwhile to mention that the counters for classes and pages are imports from English? Not everyone who reads this page will be able to see that they're actually English words. It's interesting that there is a kanji (頁) whose official reading is English... -- Myria 09:04, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] To Jag149: it is your browser

It is just your browser that is rendering those characters improperly. It shows up fine in my browser (Windows / Firefox). I changed it back.Kcumming 22:03, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Missing Transliteration

For example, one might say 男一匹なのに ("I am only one man..."). There is no transliteration provided for this sentence. DrGaellon 12:31, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Ten phonetically

I believe ten phonetically is too not tou. (Japanese script does not seem to be available to me in Firefox).

Jonafan 05:03, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

Good catch. Fixed. --Kcumming 14:35, 30 March 2007 (UTC)