Talk:Indonesian slang language
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[edit] earlier unsigned comment
In my opinion, the Indonesian slang, as many street languages, has phases and influences. I believe that ProKem existed well before Gaul and perhaps another type of slang existed before that. Even now, there is Gaul, ProKem, and 'Common Slang'. Usage of the language typified the age of the person. Gaul will be spoken by the newer generation, the ProKem by the older, and common slang will be spoken by all.
Common slang is more to the contraction of words (tidak -> nggak-> gak) Prokem will use a different word or take the contraction further (gak-> gara) Gaul uses a completely different word (bencong -> binan). I have no idea on the entymology of this...
First is the original slang from the various dialects that make up Indonesia. Such as from the Javanese insult: "matamu, endasmu" similar to the Batavian "muke-lo". Then from such common insults "Anjing" which later evolved (and softened) by the prokemization to "ja-ing" by inverting letters (much like Pig Latin). "Goblog" -> "blo-on"
Then the 60-70's saw the contraction and acronym phase. Such as the "wakuncar" a contraction from WAKtu KUnjung paCAR (time to visit significant other). The 80's took its cue mostly from Jakarta, which had become the defacto source of "cool" for teens and pop culture. Most notably Radio Prambors, one of the first popular radi stations. Prambors had a radio show called "Catatan si Boy" (Boy's Diary) which truly spread and popularised Jakarta's version of slang (noted as ProKem). Most radio stations across Indonesia created their own version of Catatan si Boy and propagated the Jakarta slang, sometimes intertwined with their own local slang. (Radio Oz of Bandung, Jogja etc). Originally, prokem, was a language used by the underground, the leather jacketed, tough gangs. As usual, wanting to be considered as part of a rebellion or as part of the hormone driven teens, the underground language permeated itu mainstream teen talk.
The 90's still used a form of 'prokem', however it had already evolved from being a language between gangs and rebellious teens, to becoming a mainstream teen language.
The early 00's saw the influx of the "bahasa gaul", absorbing a lot of the language of the transvestites that had been put into the media. During the 80-90-00, it was becomming more and more common to have a cross dresser a-la Ru Paul on a comedy show. Soon the language the cross dresser had became the language that the real transvestites used on the street.
One common thread of the slang through the ages saw no logical steps, no commonality.
[edit] What's slang? Some of this is standard usage
Some things described here are standard usage in Indonesian, and I believe would be better placed under the heading Spoken and informal indonesian on the Indonesian language page. E.g. Makasih is equivalent to Thanks.
In particular pakai (use) into pake - many or most Indonesians pronounce ai at the end of a word as e. In informal settings such as email it may be spelt as it's pronounced - does this qualify as slang. It's common usage - at some point it's so common that it's not appropriate to call it slang (and I think that shouldn't depend on comparisons with the national official standard language and the Kamus Besar Indonesia - which have probably never reflected the way most Indonesians speak). Singkong2005 04:26, 8 November 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Fixing English
I should say at the outset that I don't know any Indonesian, except a few words.
The information in this article is fascinating, and I read it with interest. Obviously the editors are mostly native Indonesian speakers who really know what they are talking about. This is exactly the kind of expert work Wikipedia needs.
I went through about the first half of the article fixing obvious English grammar errors. Every time I do this I am reminded how hard English is for foreigners, especially little details like when to use "the". Please, Indonesian-speakers, don't let that discourage you from doing more work like this! Please continue to share your expertise about your language, and we silly editors with nothing better to do can come by and put "the" in all the correct places.
(Having said that, I found the section about regional usage in Bali utterly incomprehensible. Can somebody please clarify it?)
Thanks again. I'm adding this article to my watchlist and am looking forward to watching it evolve. ACW 04:41, 26 March 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Attention: Slang Glossary policy discussion underway
Slang glossaries violate the following policy:
Wikipedia is not a dictionary or a usage or jargon guide. Wikipedia articles are not:
- Dictionary definitions. Because Wikipedia is not a dictionary, please do not create an entry merely to define a term. An article should usually begin with a good definition; if you come across an article that is nothing more than a definition, see if there is information you can add that would be appropriate for an encyclopedia. An exception to this rule is for articles about the cultural meanings of individual numbers.
- Lists of such definitions. There are, however, disambiguation pages consisting of pointers to other pages; these are used to clarify differing meanings of a word. Wikipedia also includes glossary pages for various specialized fields.
- A usage guide or slang and idiom guide. Wikipedia is not in the business of saying how words, idioms, etc. should be used. We aren't teaching people how to talk like a Cockney chimney-sweep. However, it may be important in the context of an encyclopedia article to describe just how a word is used to distinguish among similar, easily confused ideas, as in nation or freedom. In some special cases an article about an essential piece of slang may be appropriate.
Due to the many AfDs which are initiated to enforce this policy and due to the resistance to such deletion by defenders of the glossaries, I have started a discussion at Wikipedia talk:What Wikipedia is not#Slang glossaries to rewrite the policy in order to solve this problem and to readdress this question: should slang glossaries by allowed on Wikipedia? --List Expert 23:27, 4 August 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Some items are not slangs
I think we need to clean up those which doesn't belong to everyday slang. Some phrases fell under 'idiom' (two or more indonesian words put together) rather than 'slang' (e.g. mata keranjang), and some other are plain Indonesian words which doesn't necessarily categorized as 'slang'. And most of the terms in the list are borrowed words (like in Javanese for example)
Some slangs are not coherent in terms of the history of the slang. for example, bokap was said to be the contraction of 'boss kakap' while in the middle it was said to be the abbrevation of 'bapak' with an infix '-ok-' and the last two letters are deleted. Which one is true?
Hi there, as with all etymology it can be hard to pin down the true root of the word... I'm inclined to believe that boss kakap post-dated the use of bokap; Indonesians are very fond of deriving false acronyms for words... In future, it would be helpful if you could sign your posts by typing tilde ('~') four times... Mr john 07:34, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
[edit] This should really be moved to wikibooks
This is a great resource with lots of useful information, but it's really not a wikipedia article... I would say this article should include a list of commonly used slang forms, possibly split by region e.g. euy particle used in Sundanese speaking areas, Jakarta habit of changing a to e at the end of a word to sound more Betawi, and whatnot, and maybe a few examples. Having hundreds of examples is really not what wikipedia is for, this should be migrated to wikibooks. Mr john 07:30, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
