Talk:Grinnell College

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[edit] Gates Tower

The picture of the dorms labeled "Gates Hall" is erroneous. Through a miracle of remodeling, Gates tower switches floor by floor from being part of Gates Hall and Rawson Hall. Hence, I've renamed the picture "Gates Tower and Hall," which is far more accurate, since, though the tower contains parts of both Rawson and Gates hall, it is universally known as Gates Tower.

[edit] prominent alumni list

someone please alphabetize the alumni list. it's silly right now.

Not only that, it's filled with not-so-prominent alumni.

  • Also, technically Walter Koenig is not an alumnus because he did not graduate from Grinnell College. I believe he attended Grinnell for two years and then transferred elsewhere. (Does anyone care?) I don't think I can find a confirmable source for this, though. It was something I heard pretty regularly when I was a student there (early 90's). TishaStacey 23:32, 28 October 2005 (UTC)
  • Note that the Wikipedia entry for alumnus indicates that anyone who has been a student (or been matriculated) at an institution is an "alumnus," regardless of whether the person has been graduated. --Klmarcus 13:23, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Self Governance

I'd like to see someone start writing a section on self-governance. To me, self-governance was an important aspect of campus life when I was a student there in the mid 1990s. My understanding is that there has been some erosion of this philosophy. Information on how this came about would add to this section as well. Froff22 05:32, 26 September 2005 (UTC)

Will do! It won't be much at first, but let's get 'er going. Andersem 04:26, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Campus

I know it's minor, but I always thought that Chicago and Minneapolis were more like five hours away, not four, and shouldn't Saint Louis be included as well?Kaibab 04:10, 31 October 2005 (UTC)

Chicago and Minneapolis are both approx. five-hour drives -- definitely closer to five than four. TishaStacey 23:33, 14 December 2005 (UTC)

That's really a function of how much like a maniac you drive, and which part of Chicago you're going to. I used to make the drive from Ann Arbor, MI to Grinnell, which took me through the southern outskirts of Chicago, and it was definitely only about four hours from there to Grinnell. I don't have any personal knowledge about the trip to/from the twin cities, but Google Maps lists the trip from there to Grinnell as being about 10 minutes shorter than the one from Chicago. That being the case, I suspect that the two are roughly equivalent. I'm comfortable with the estimate being four hours instead of five. Azriphael 13:43, 29 September 2006 (UTC)
Then again, this thread is a year out of date, and the relevant portion of the article has been removed. I'd call it a wash, and this whole chunk of the discussion could stand to be blown away. Azriphael 13:47, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Prominent Alumni

Other institutions that are similar to Grinnell list alumni that are much less prominent than the one's on the "Notable Alumni" section of the Grinnell page, so I don't see a problem with the list of alumni.

Also, the wikipedia page of almost every other prestigious liberal arts college mentions the college's overall academic reputation in the opening paragraph of the article. It is important to comment on Grinnell's academic reputation in the introductory paragraph because it gives brousers a better idea about Grinnell and the type of school that it is.

[edit] Academics

"Nearly 100 percent of Grinnellians who apply to either law or medical school gain admission." Is this really true and verifiable? How much is "nearly" 100 percent? Does anyone know? What about Heyhey, who added this information? --Babcockd 12:51, 21 January 2006 (UTC)


Heyhey seems to be interested in spinning everything about Grinnell in the most positive light. I've had to cut much of his or her work for NPOV reasons. --Exeunt 16:43, 21 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] GrinnellPlans

I just dumped some text in here for a merge...someone familiar with the subject should clean it up more thoroughly. NickelShoe 18:05, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

My opinion would be that little more than a one-sentence reference is worthwhile here. GrinnellPlans seems to be a not-particularly-remarkable text-based virtual community. It would seem to have WP:NPOV#Undue_weight here. -- Gnetwerker 22:48, 2 February 2006 (UTC)

There is an incomplete sentence in the GrinnellPlans section. It looks like it might have been interesting in its full state. Does anyone know about this? -- Maleficarum 16:41, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

Here is the diff where it was originally added. -- Gnetwerker 17:44, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] page could use a photo or two

This page could use a few photos. Any of a number of buildings would be interesting to include. Alumnists who are not recent may be interested in seeing photos of new construction such as the science building, the arts ceter, East campus, other buildings that I have no idea about. If you get very ambitious, the Grinnell city page could use a picture of the bank as well. Pdbailey 22:22, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

Ask and received. I have more, and I put up the ones that I thought were useful, but I could always put up others if there's a request (I drive through the area a lot, and I wouldn't mind stopping off again since it's really not out of the way if there's a request for a photo that I didn't take). Madmaxmarchhare 06:28, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] wealthiest liberal arts college?

According to an edit by 130.221.182.61, "Darthmouth has the largest [endowment] of a liberal arts college." With and endowment of 2.7 billion, Dartmouth College does have a larger endowment at nearly twice that of Grinnell. However, there is an issue in semantics as to weather a school such as Dartmouth that grants the degrees of Doctor of Philosophy and Doctor of Medicine is, stricly speaking a liberal arts college and not a university. Given the massive resources that must be dedicated to a medical school and graduate students, the distinction seems appropos. Pdbailey 04:05, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

Grinnell is the wealthiest liberal-arts college (as you point out), but also has the highest per-student endowment, which is in itself significant. -- Gnetwerker 06:24, 24 April 2006 (UTC)
If you are talking undergraduates then Caltech has the highest per-student endowment. I've been to both campuses and there is no comparison. Though I must admit Grinnell's total is crazy big. --vossman 02:19, 11 May 2006 (UTC)

Dartmouth College isn't a liberal arts college in this context. Liberal Arts college refers to a college that has been classified as such by the Carnegie Foundation. That's why Dartmouth does not appear under the liberal arts college rankings in the US News and World Report list.

Right, the Caltech endowment is about the same as Grinnells and it has fewer undergrads, but (1) it's not a liberal arts college by any stretch, (2) endowment/student is smaller then at Grinnell when you count all students (i.e. do you really believe that Caltech's endowment is being used only for the college students?), (3) Caltech has a lot more money flowing threw it than Grinnell because it's a graduate school and faculty write huge grants and then spend the money (on research). Pdbailey 18:31, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
Just to agree with the above, the term "liberal arts college" has been more or less defined in the modern era by the US News list. Many of the other Ivy League (which are quite old) have only recently made the formal name change to "university" due to historic nostalgia. Dartmouth is listed, like the other Ivy League schools, in the National University category. Anyone looking down the list of highest endowments is quick to notice the inexplicable presense of Grinnell. --Bobak 05:25, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
I'm not sure what you mean by "recently". None of the Ivies has changed its name in decades, at a minimum. I wouldn't be surprised to learn there has been no such change in 100 years or more.
Dartmouth is a university by just about any reasonable definition of that term. The only reason people often mistake it for a liberal arts college is that it calls itself "Dartmouth College" rather than "Dartmouth University", but it does so for historical reasons -- New Hampshire long ago tried to seize the college and turn it into a public institution called "Dartmouth University", and Dartmouth does not want the name that was almost forced upon it -- and not because it lacks any characteristics of a university. (Note that Boston College is also a university; it kept its original name as it expanded because "Boston University" was already taken.) Dartmouth has liberal arts programs, but also has schools of business, engineering and medicine. It offers Ph.D., M.B.A. and M.D. degrees. A liberal arts college only offers liberal arts -- and only at the undergraduate level. Schools that depart modestly from this definition are given some leeway, but Dartmouth has gone too far to still qualify.

[edit] Hancock's alumni listing

Whoever keeps deleting the part about Herbie Hancock attendeding Grinnell for one year, stop. He was only enrolled for one year. I think it's significant that Grinnell considers him an alum considering he never graduated from the college, he transfered. [unsigned comment of 132.161.189.63]

It's also possible that he considers himself an alumnist. Read this inverview, [1] a search shows that he is often listed similar to this [2] page which reads, "He attended Grinnell College, majoring in engineering for two years, then he changed his major to music." Please provide reference to his single year attendance. I'll also note that the college lists him as '60 Pdbailey 23:23, 16 May 2006 (UTC)

Hancock spent four years at Grinnell (not one) and graduated from the college in 1960. Elephant11 21:36, 4 June 2006 (UTC)Elephant11

Elephant11, can you give a reference for this? Pdbailey 04:04, 9 June 2006 (UTC)

Not Elephant 11, but the Grinnell Alumni Directory lists Hancock as a graduate of the class of 1960, with a BA in music.

It should also be noted that according to Merriam-Webster[3], an alumnus is "a person who has attended or has graduated from a particular school, college, or university". Note that this includes people who have attended, regardless of their graduation status. Azriphael 19:37, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Should how Grinnell ended up with its mega-endowment be included?

Back when I was involved in the administrative politics at a major US research univerity, I reviewed the list of the largest US university endowments. I was surprised to see Grinnell on the list (just below the University of Washington and above CalTech). My curiousity demanded that I find out why the small, relatively young school in Iowa was so, ahem, endowed. Then a friend mentioned that a co-founded of Intel was an alumnus...
(From the article on Robert Noyce, co-founder of Intel and alum)
"While a student at Grinnell College, Noyce stole a pig from a nearby farmer for a college luau and then slaughtered it in Clark Hall. The prank nearly earned him expulsion, if not for the intervention of Grant O. Gale, a physics professor at the time. He later returned the favor by allowing the college to invest in Intel at an early stage."
Should this be adapted and included? I mean, considering the section on rumors, this is actually fascinating and true! --Bobak 05:32, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

Bobak, I think it might be a bit revisionist to say that Noyce `allowing the college to invest in Intel.' I think it is often told that Joseph Rosenfield saw that Robert Noyce was going somewhere with the company, invested and donated the investment to the college. Rosenfield was a briliant investor, and friend to Warren Buffett, who also became a trustee, perhaps because of thier friendship (I don't know). [4] Pdbailey 04:17, 9 June 2006 (UTC)
Interesting! I was just saying it would be fascinating to hear how the endowment turned out the way it did. I clearly heard what must've been an urban rumor (or the academic-circle version thereof...ivory rumor?), whatever the real story is I think it would be notable enough to include. Grinnell is an exceptional case with its endowment (sort of like how Kamehameha Schools ended up with the 7th largest endowment in the country... and it's not a college!). --Bobak 15:20, 9 June 2006 (UTC)
I seem to recall learning that Grinnell was very wealthy almost 25 years ago when I was deciding where to apply. I doubt that Intel stock had much to do with how Grinnell became rich in the first place, even if it did help the endowment soar more recently.

[edit] Advert tag

Some Anon has messed up this article with a large number of edits that have turned a solid encyclopedic article into a brochure. I created and greatly expended the category on for-profit colleges and universities, and this article now reminds me of the ones for DeVry and ITT Tech before editors undid the articles that were clearly written by shills of those (far, far less respectable) institutions. --Bobak 20:37, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

I took the tag off, but meant no general disrespect for doing so without discussing it here first. As an outsider, it doesn't seem that bad to me, in fact, not really out-of-line at all. Maybe a few edits here and there by Bobak can get it clearned up, and if not, then the tag can be replaced at any time. Madmaxmarchhare 06:26, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

that's fine with me. There's no set rule as to who should remove it. I think it's been touched up well. --Bobak 15:22, 9 June 2006 (UTC)

the fact that Grinnell has a social justice emphasis doesn't need to be mentioned in the first sentence. Please keep the intro direct and to the point. Also, it should be clearly stated that Grinnell has the highest endowment of any liberal arts school, regardless of what the Chronicle for Higher Education says.Elephant11 04:40, 20 June 2006 (UTC)Elephant 11

Not sure what you mean. I think the `social justice' is a more centeral focus than `lots of money.' The Chronice was to add a source for the claim, esp. after it was removed by someone claiming that another college had a higher endowment. Pdbailey 05:40, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

I did some heavy-duty editing. It seems like every once in a while someone comes in and inserts items from the brochure. Judging from the information, it's either the same person or they are employing the same brochure.--Exeunt 04:29, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

It's probably the latter. Thanks for your work! --Bobak 23:35, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Edits by User:Exeunt

The history page needs substantial work. A lot of it repeats useless tidbits from the college's pamphlets.

Also, the prominent alumni list seems suspect. About half the list can probably be purged.

Also, I would like to know where the current enrollment figures are from. I took mine from the the colleges Common Data Set for the year 05-06. Exeunt 22:04, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

I modified a fraction of these to include them back in the article. I'll start with what I didn't add back. A good poriton of the history was taken from verbatim from the Grinnell website, which I presume is not a compatable copy right at the best. It's also a questionable source since it's essentially an autobiography. However, I added back two high profile media outlets claims about the college, you might want to read the wikipedia verifiability policy before trying to dispute this. I will point out that the U.S. News source is a more common source for 'rankings' which Americans are addicted to, but their publication is just one source of comments on colleges, adding in others gives more depth and flavor.
I'll also point out that I did a double rv because the version you changed back to had some bad gramar, such as, "Grinnell is ranked fifteen for liberal arts colleges" and a request for a fact check on the claim, "Grinnell's $1.4 billion endowment is the largest of any liberal arts college." added by user:Exeunt shortly after user:Exeunt removed an appropriate citation in another edit.
user:Pdbailey, your comments in no way addresses the fact that your edits are stylistic ballast, and they misrepresent facts (see the Newsweek article, which used "buzz" as its main criterion). The fact that you comment on my bad "gramar" is laughable, when that sentence is not only sound, it's much more precise.
Also, I hardly think it's appropriate to rearrange a talk page with a section dedicated to my edits.--Exeunt 23:36, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
First, I think we can both agree that (1) there is a reference for the endowment so there is no citation required. (2) one can not be "ranked fifteen." (this is gramar) (3) Newsweek did write an article where they said what is attributed to them.
Given that (which you don't have to give me) argument is reduced to removing the Newsweek quote. And according the Wikipedia policy (see above) your only remaining argument against it's inclusion is only that it's not encyclopedic. I would argue that it's exactly as encyclopedic as the U.S. News rankings. The USN rankings have the viel of being hard science because they use numbers, but they do so in a completely indefinsible way. No particular weight in their ranking scheme can be defended. The fact that Reed College droped in their rankings after failing to report some inputs make the scheme laughable. In contrast, Newsweek tries to put their finger on something that is much more real and a much better target for a journalist (and not a Social Scientist) "Buzz," as you say. It's like being rated best band by Rolling Stone, it means something and nothing at the same time, and the reader can understand that. Pdbailey 00:56, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

--

The usual grace period for a response is 24 hours, and it's been 6 days, so I'm going to change the top paragraph back to my edits. 68.252.245.24 15:29, 4 July 2006 (UTC), didn't realize I wasn't logged in. Pdbailey 15:42, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

--

readded newsweek link. Pdbailey 22:16, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] edits by unknown editor

To whoever did the last round of edits: First, thanks for cleaning up my poorly worded budget stuff. Couple questions, though: Why was the reference to Clay removed? And as far as the reasons for the increasing fees, while I do not have any document I can point to, through personal discussions with Osgood and many of the VPs, as well as meetings (both Trustee meetings and ones w/ administrators), I know that these are the reasons for the ever-growing comprehensive fee. Is this enough, or should I not include these types of facts unless there is a document I can point to?

I wasn't the one who did the edits you mention, but as a general policy of Wikipedia, you should not include information for which you don't have a published source. It's not that I don't believe you (and I doubt other's fail to believe you, either), but that relating your personal knowledge, as compared to paraphrasing and citing a published source, contravenes the "No Original Research" policy. Azriphael 19:42, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

The faculty count is mentioned here: [5]

[edit] business

I think it's fine to delete the stuff about business. I've never seen facts to support it (though it may be true), and this shouldn't be a place for rumors or disenchanted former students trying to get back at the college. Also, I updated the financial stuff posted by 12.105.22.1 to something that is actually accurate. If anyone wants me to expand it, I could make as lengthy a section out of it as desired. - Matt Cleinman/1matt 15:08, 5 August 2005 (UTC)


[edit] edits by 12.105.22.1

I've unceremoniously altered a number of contributions by 12.105.22.1, not because that person isn't welcome but because parts of the contributions weren't balanced, relevant or, in a few cases, factual. Even now, I'm not entirely sure that the bit about students being driven away from business is relevant - without hard numbers on the number who do go into business, this is essentially gossip - but as a leftist myself I didn't feel qualified to judge. - Andersem 05:12, 5 August 2005 (UTC)

Later: after consulting Wikipedia's entry on citing sources, I'm even more uncomfortable with my "some argue" formulation. I don't feel the sentence is necessary, and unless someone objects in the next few days (or adds some more authoritative source) I'm inclined to delete it. - Andersem 05:23, 5 August 2005 (UTC)

12.105.22.1, please review the guidelines on citing sources and neutral point of view. If you think it's important to record that some students feel professors provide "hard-core leftist indoctrination," I think a standalone section dealing with academic freedom would work better. If you don't know how to do that, make a note of it here and someone else can. Also, if you think there's a link between campus politics and student careers, find some statistics or authoritative testimony that support this idea. Andersem 16:50, 5 August 2005 (UTC)


[edit] figures on faculty and students good?

Does anyone have exact figures for faculty and students? This information is usually printed in college literature.

The figures the college puts in the literature are sometimes incorrect, actually. At the start of the fall semester, there were 1412 students at Grinnell. 1396 in the spring. (Of course, some students take leaves in the middle of the semester.) I could dig out faculty stats from a budget, if it was wanted. - Matt Cleinman

The images look pretty bad. Can someone put better pictures of Gates Hall and the Honor G?

[edit] editits by Minidoxigirli

I removed some very sketchy stuff from this article. Keep in mind prospective students and their parents will be reading this, guys. For example, the quote "Students proceed to take several beers to the face while sitting in the street playing drinking games" is not what I want represented about my school. I also removed the link to the cyrillic (sp?) of Grinnell, as that really didn't give any extra information. I wasn't certain about the link to IowaProgress, but I thought I should put it up here before changing it myself. If I don't hear from anyone in a week either here or on Plans ([woodschr]}, I'll assume it's okay to delete it. Minidoxigirli 02:47, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Myths and Legends.

I made a change in myths and legends. It said the myth about using the railroad tracks as an antena occurred in the 70s and started in the 80s. I was a at Grinnell between 1970 -1972. That legend was very much existant then and was attributed (unverified) to the 50s. So I changed it. Hope that is OK.

[edit] Citations?

I noticed someone added info on AltBreak. Sweet! Now let's get some citations in there.Minidoxigirli 15:10, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

I added a citation for the bit about Grinnell having the most Peace Corps volunteers per capita. Babcockd 04:13, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Controversy section?

Do we need a controversy section, to hold things such as the "Students against Hippies" thing that just got added in the Myths and Legends section? We could add when the college revoked the charter of the local chapter of the Intervaristy Christian Fellowship because of anti-homosexual stances. That showed up in national media. Maybe a list of events that were notable enough to be reported in news sources outside of the immediate area. Blade 03:36, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

I don't know. I mean, it would be cool to add stuff like that, but then do we have to get into the suicides? Right now (speaking from the perspective of a student on campus) it might be difficult to right that in a NPOV. Or maybe I need to go back to editing my paper. Minidoxigirli 04:53, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Television Sets

Since when? That's nonsense. I knew many people who had television sets before 2002 -- NONSENSE. Zweifel 04:41, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

And "mixed results"? Wha? I'm deleting it. If you, oh Grinnell alumn who is angered by TVs, want to explain this, please do so here. Thanks.Minidoxigirli 18:02, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Motto

I like the new motto posted. However, I can't find any documentation that it is actually Grinnell's motto. Can I get some verification? Jacobko 14:22, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

I did a little research (and contacted Grinnell's Office of Institutional Research). I fixed the motto and made the formatting fall in line with other institutions of higher education. Man am I glad that I took Latin in college... Jacobko 17:40, 18 October 2006 (UTC)


[edit] 10/10

Just so you know, I created the article on 10/10. Check it out! Zweifel 07:11, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] New Stuff

Someone added this info on the class of '10 randomly. If it can be better worked in, that would be great. I'm putting it here for someone to do something with.

Class of 2010 Profile
Median SAT Combined Score: 1390
Median ACT Composite Score: 31

26% of first year students were recognized by the National Merit Scholarship Corporation as National Merit Finalists, National Merit Scholars, and National Merit Commended Students. 14% of first year students are Advanced Placement Scholars as designated by The College Board 64% of the Class of 2010 graduated in the top 10% of their secondary school class and 90% graduated in the top 25%
Application for Admission
3,703 students applied for admission
37.8% of those who applied for admission were admitted
406 new students enrolled

minidoxigirli-talk--contribs 16:10, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

I can see the value of this, but more in the college box on the side. Too bad it isn't included. Perhaps a seperate "recent student statistics" box should be developed. I think we would have to look around at other entries first. Pdbailey 19:04, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Iowa Progress

I am reverting stuff about the Campus Democrats for a second time. Unless there is something notable about the organization (and I've yet to hear anything notable about it), I don't think it deserves to be listed anymore than any other campus organization. Please do not re-add it unless you can provide a citation indicating some sort of notability. Blade 00:22, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

I agree. Lbgconfetti has broken the revert rule. minidoxigirli-talk--contribs 06:29, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Social Activites and Myths and Legends

I restored the entire Social Activities and Myths and Legends sections, which had been deleted. This information is fact-based, NPOV, and is of interest to both current and prospective students. --wiscesq 14:42, 28 December 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Myths and Legends, Pt. 2

I removed the myths and legends section due to the fact that none of it was verified. In fact, some of it was not verifiable. As the below myths and legends become verified, they can be moved back to the original page. Jacobko 17:14, 11 January 2007 (UTC)


Like most colleges, a large body of myths has accumulated over the years.

One of the most persistent was the notion that the Quad Dining Hall, with its high ceiling, dark wood paneled walls, and stained glass windows, was supposed to be a church. The legend claims that money was bequeathed to the college to build a chapel, but the college needed a dining hall, so it built something that could be used as either. The Legend of Quad (which was actually built to look like a dining hall at Oxford College) -- complete with details such as an annual carrying-in of pews for a church service -- was born. Quad is oriented north-to-south, unlike all traditional Christian churches which, like Grinnell's own Herrick Chapel (which had been dedicated several years before Quad was built), face west.

In the early 80's the Campus had several meetings over the hiring of a football coach who actually wanted to win games, and also the restoration, after many, many years, of a female cheerleading squad. Grinnell students at the time wanted none of that.

Another story, apparently started in the late 80s, was that the football coach was fired after being denounced in the student newspaper "for winning too many games." The Scarlet and Black's editors were concerned about what they perceived as an over-emphasis on athletics compared to academics, but the coach in question was not actually fired.

Another myth involves the idea that there are three (and only three) things that will result in instant expulsion from the school irrelevant of any other factor. Exactly what the three things are varies somewhat -- the most commonly mentioned offenses are jumping a ride on a train passing through campus, entering the steam tunnels, and gaining access to the roof of an academic building.

An unverifiable story passed around in the 70's was that sometime in the 50's, students had hooked up the transmitter for the college's radio station, KDIC, to the railroad tracks that cut through campus, and that the station had been picked up as far away as Brooklyn, NY, and Mexico before being shut down by the FCC.

In the early 90s, the college attempted to expel a student for creating an organization called "Students Against Hippies". The controversy ended up on the front page of the Des Moines Register.

What constitutes verifiable when it comes to myths and legends? That they be verified to have actually been legends or myths at Grinnell College? I graduated in '99 and personally heard all of the above but the cheerling squad and the Students Against Hippies ones. Or do they have to be mentioned in some source as 'legends'? Of course, that begs the question whether myths and legends are notable enough for the article in the first place... Blade 02:06, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
1) I don't think myths and legends are notable enough for the article.
2) Jimmy Wales said: "I can NOT emphasize this enough... Random speculative 'I heard it somewhere' pseudo information ... should be removed, aggressively, unless it can be sourced." [1] Jacobko 15:40, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
Fair enough. Blade 21:30, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Keep an extra eye

After catching this article on digg, and how popular it is, I expect an extra eye should be kept on this and any related articles as its related to Grinnell: [6].--Crossmr 06:36, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] List of Grinnell College Alumni

The reason that I moved the List of Grinnell College alumni is so we could have a comprehensive, ordered, well-cited list that did not get out of control. I think that the current "short version" is getting out of control and, as such, should be removed. Comments? --Jacobko 00:08, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] notable alumni

I tried to put a few notable alumni back on this page. an IP address only editor appears to have added a few sections with the same name and a few alumni. I tried to make this section have longer paragraph like explanations of the notability of the people. I think that the names or accoplishments of these alumni are instalyly recognizable. I thought about also including Dr. Coleman but didn't know if the list was getting too long. Pdbailey 19:42, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

I liked having the notable alumni on this page listed by class year since the structure adds information, alphabetization is just arbitrary structure useful mainly for finding names in a list (but you have to know what names you are looking for, and then why are you reading the list anyway?) Pdbailey 23:44, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

Arranging by year sounds good to me. As long as they appear in some sort of order, I'm happy. However, my main problem is that the list keeps growing.
Jacobko 00:55, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
Sounds good, how about seven and we keep Tom Cole, the 4th in charge of the minority in the US House is a big deal. Pdbailey 01:29, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
To be perfectly honest, I'd rather not have ANY of the alumni on this page at all. We started with six "promoted," now we have 9! It's fine by me if we replace one of the above with Tom Cole, but I'd like a hard cap of no more than six. If it makes it easier, let's go with even fewer. How does 4 sound? Jacobko 12:32, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

Let's go with your proposed six and add a commented out note to run any addtions by the talk page first. Pdbailey 23:08, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

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