Talk:Garden State (film)

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Contents

[edit] Current Issues

This talk page is a bit messy, hard to follow, and in some places, totally irrelevant. I've consolidated all of the information on the Themes debate and moved a few items to "Past Issues". I did actually delete a few issues that seem to have been resolved, or at least there's no longer any evidence of them in the article itself. I left "resolved" issues that seemed likely to come up again in the "Past Issues" section. If your comments were among the deleted and you feel they're unexpendable, you can let me know within the next week and I'll restore them. I'll still have the text saved for a while. In general though, I'm going to put some time into editing this article, because it looks like it really needs it. I'd appreciate anyone's input here during the process. --Hurtstotouchfire 05:47, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

School's started and I've been too busy to attempt the redrafting of the plot summary. However, this Friday I have plans to watch the second commentary with a friend, and then I plan to rope him into drafting a new plot summary with me. Yay for geek dates. When we've got something with a better backbone than the current plot summary (which is hopeless) I hope some of you will help edit me. --Hurtstotouchfire 21:12, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Reference style

I'm not deeply familiar with the various different modes of referencing, so I don't know why my reference is in bold with a ' before it. If anyone cares to enlighten me that'd be nice, otherwise I shall dig it out of the portal tomorrow. --Hurtstotouchfire 08:12, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Content Tidbits and questions

I added the reference for Braff's "80% Real Life" line. It was in the making of documentary. I've watched all the DVD extras now except the commentary, so I'm hoping that will reveal the origin of this title, because I actually still haven't figured that one out. I liked the working title "Large's Ark" better myself. Anyone know? Also, I loved the cut scene with Ian Holm, what a pity. I'm almost tempted to work that into the article somehow. We'll see. Perhaps there's some critical discussion somewhere about Holm being underused. --Hurtstotouchfire 08:00, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Cleanup Suggestions

Two things:

  • There's no need to describe the cast. They have their respective pages.
  • Decreasing the plot would be good; it has everything but the kitchen sink. We don't need to know what every frame is like. It would be simpler if it were decreased. Ohyeahmormons 20:33, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
Looking at promoted articles such as V_for_Vendetta_(film) and Blade Runner, it seems that shedding some light on the background of the actors is some what a good thing to do. I think the plot should definantly be decreased to about half of what it is now, and we should ditch all teh images except the rain one, because it shows all three main characters. Thoughts? Sunrise50 08:37, 19 September 2006 (UTC)
Yeah, I'm thinking that the Plot summary should be cut in half (which I'm working on), and the character summaries cut entirely. More alsoer:
  • Summary: I'm thinking "a twenty-six year old actor" should be more like "an aspiring actor currently working as a waiter" or something to that effect. Also think that second paragraph could use a little cleaning up; "all the time avoiding his father" is definitely getting revised, and the whole paragraph needs a little polish. The rest of the summary is peachy. Still, any links to good pre-existing summaries would be nice.
  • Production: I'll try to rustle up a little more info for this section. Think it's useful, but not living up to its possibilities.
--Hurtstotouchfire 06:18, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Themes

We don't currently have a Themes section. I'd like to see it worked into Plot Summary myself, themes being, well, a part of the plot. I would be open to creating a new section if that seems feasible. I'm going to try to work from the themes link provided below by Valet5 and whatever other reliable bits I can dredge up on the interweb. --Hurtstotouchfire 06:18, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Debate History

This article seems like one person's interpretation of the film. Who decided the themes? By whom is this movie considered a major success? And who decided what points of the plot are important or not? Ohyeahmormons 03:46, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

"who decided what points of the plot are important or not?" By the looks of it, nobody. I just watched this movie and I'd be hard pressed to find a single thing that happened in the movie that wasn't in the plot summary. Not to discredit the amount of work that went into this section, but the plot summary would be more useful with less detail and more, you know, summary. 67.170.183.209 06:21, 12 September 2006 (UTC)
Silly comment imo. Garden_State_(film)#Reception states how many awards it won, its popularity, the music, reviews and so on. Its harly an npov statement. The film was a success in terms of box-office/budget ratio as well. Braff has now also been given more films to direct and so on and so on. If you dont like the plot, the use the edit feature. The template in the themes section is fine until someone references it. Valet5 16:27, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

I'm removing the themes section, because what one thinks of the film is not what Braff meant by the film. Ohyeahmormons 20:22, 16 September 2006 (UTC)

A simple search found thison themes. So its not completely original. It just needs expansion and a little tidy up. The section is very important, but it needs a little work. Valet5 16:30, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

I have removed this for now. Its POV, and is not referenced. There is definantly room for a Themes section in the article, but it needs to be worked on here on the talk page, referenced properly and written in a neutral way. So i'm pasting this here, so not to lose it all, if someone wants to use it. Sunrise50 08:28, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

The themes present in Garden State revolve around the development of Andrew Largeman. One of the recurring themes is that one only has one chance at life, and one must take that chance now in the present. The characters comment on this, the earliest example being when Sam tells Andrew to perform an original movement, even though at the time, Andrew did not fully believe in what she was saying.

Come the end of the film, Andrew's outlook on life has changed. After finally holding discussions with his father, Andrew expresses his desire to start living his life now, and asks his father to do the same, despite any problems that may be in their lives. For one of the first times in the film, Andrew makes a spontaneous decision to not get on a plane back to Los Angeles, and instead stay where he is, and live his life now, rather than trying to sort out whatever he needed to do in Los Angeles.

The Themes section has been removed because it was in violation of Wikipedia's no original research policy. Nothing in the section seemed to have come from any kind of source except the minds of editors, which is original research. To address the themes of this film, find reliable sources to cite so observations can be verified by other users. The fact that there is a dispute about the film's themes on the talk page with no source being discussed clearly indicates that this section was original research. --Erik (talk/contrib) @ 21:49, 7 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Past Issues

[edit] Silent Velcro

Silent velcro currently redirects to this article. --Hurtstotouchfire 05:47, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Votes for deletion

[This text was copied from the Silent Velcro talk page, which no longer exists]

This page was recently nominated for deletion, and the consensus decision was to keep it. The deletion debate is archived here. ugen64 03:58, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Um, you meant merge and redirect, at least, that's what it says. ed g2s • talk 01:11, 11 September 2005 (UTC)
I find it confusing that "Silent velcro" redirects here, but when I search for "velcro" in the article text it doesn't find anything. --60.225.3.7 09:18, 17 May 2006 (UTC)
The issue is this: Imagine somebody sees the film, and then goes on Wikipedia to search for "silent velcro". They'll then see that this directs them to the Garden State article, meaning that silent velcro was simply something from Zach Braff's imagination. It doesn't matter that there isn't any more info on it (nor that it isn't even mentioned in the article), as there's nothing else to say about it. -- Kicking222 21:32, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

Silent velcro *is* mentioned in the "Velcro" article, albeit only very briefly. Still, since it's at least mentioned in that article, and is not mentioned at all in this one, perhaps "silent velcro" should redirect there, instead? Or maybe there should be a link from here to there? While I agree that most people will search for it because it was mentioned in Garden State, as I did, the status quo seems unwise, as there actually *is* Wikipedia information on this topic, as I found when I Googled it. --ABPend 01:10, 19 January 2007 (UTC)

I agree. Go for it. --Hurtstotouchfire 11:19, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Use In Film

The section of the film itself, that this page and or user refers to is a small piece that is not really worth mentioning. If someone develops a Trivia section or something similar to that on the Garden State page, then this should be put in their. Otherwise, it's really not that worthwhile. --Matt von Furrie 07:46, 30 May 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Redirecting Redirect

I've posted Silent Velcro to Wikipedia:Requested moves#Uncontroversial proposals. To the best of my ability to determine, that was the appropriate place. (appreciate wisdom otherwise)--Hurtstotouchfire 21:09, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Such Great Heights

This article lists Such Great Heights, in the soundtrack, as made by Iron & Wine. It's really made by The Postal Service, is it not? --Spug 00:47, 17 July 2005 (UTC)

I think so. I've never heard this song before The Postal Service edition and have never heard that it was a cover. I haven't seen the movie, but if I remember right, the trailer was using The Postal Service edition. I think it's a safe bet to change it. Cookiecaper 06:21, 17 July 2005 (UTC)
I have the soundtrack, which lists the song as by Iron and Wine. That is consistent with information at, e.g., the amazon.com page for the soundtrack. I don't actually have the CD on me right now, but I'll double-check when I get home. Neilc 05:01, 18 July 2005 (UTC)
The Iron & Wine version is a cover of the original, which was indeed done by The Postal Service off their debut album "Give Up". Pwv1
The Iron & Wine version is both in the final movie and on the soundtrack. The full trailer uses The Postal Service original and another song left out of the movie/soundtrack. Viewdrix
The other song used in the trailer is Love Will Come Through by Travis. It may have also been picked out by Braff, as it fits in with the other songs in the film.

[edit] Film Locations

It's probably just me, but as a resident of the locations which were used for filming in New Jersey (specifically South Orange and Maplewood), shouldn't Maplewood also be placed in the film location section? It's true, my experience is anecdotal, however I was able to pinpoint several spots throughout the movie which could be considered sections of Maplewood, and not just South Orange. For example, the drive-by past the high school (Columbia High School), which is officially in Maplewood, despite being a part of the combined Maplewood/South Orange School District.

That would be great if you could fix it up. Cvene64 22:35, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Ricky Moody's 1992 novel!

It says on the Rick Moody (an author) page, that he wrote the novel of Garden State back in 1992, so this film is obviously based on that book...it even says it on the Rick Moody page, so I think that this article should mention it, although I'm not certain on whether it is true that this is based on the book, could someone please confirm that it is? RaptorRobot 13:30, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

There's no evidence that it is. More likely than anything, someone edited that page, which wouldn't be as popular as the article for a film of the same name, and no one noticed. Let me guess, it's not sourced? -- Viewdrix 14:46, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

"Garden State" is a term to describe the state of New Jersey; it's not necessarily a unique phrase. If you read about the book at Amazon.com, it doesn't sound very similar to the film. In addition, due to the lack of citation between this novel and the film, I removed the information. --Erik (talk/contrib) @ 15:25, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Spoiler in opening paragraph?

"...when he accidentally brought about his mother's paraplegia". This text is in the opening paragraph. This is not made known to the viewer until a decent way into the movie, and therefore I think it should not be included in this section, but maybe in the one below it which has a spoiler warning. It seems like a bit of a spoiler to me.

It's not such an important factor of the movie, so I don't see why moving it to a spoiler would be neccesary. --Chitomcgee 05:04, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

I disagree. That is definitely an important factor to understanding the protagonist and the build up of the viewer not knowing why Large has been on drugs, why he is estranged from his father, why he says his family is "way more fucked up" than Sam's is all crucial to the effect of the movie. It's also unnecessary in a general description of the movie. I'm getting rid of it. Dwinetsk 21:35, 7 November 2006 (UTC)
I actually think this seems resolved and can be deleted from the talk page, but since it's pretty recent I'm leaving it up for now. We ok with deleting this soon? --Hurtstotouchfire 05:47, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Cast

I have deleted the cast section, because I doesn't add anything to the article. It wasn't a cast section all together, it were small descriptions of the lead characters, already explained in the plot section. I think someone was trying to be helpful, but it is a bit pointless to add it twice. --Soetermans 22:27, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

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