User talk:Fergananim

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Fergananim Archive I Fergananim Archive II Fergananim Archive III

Welcome!

Hello, Fergananim, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:

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Contents 1 Award 2 Rónán mac Colmáin 3 Archive? 4 Carricks and Tyrones 5 The Carricks and the Tyrones 6 Usage of "Irish people" category 7 howdy 8 Re: 9 List of years in Ireland 10 Editing guidelines 11 Whoa! 12 RE: Hello Gaillimh 13 The Esteemed Mr Forbes 14 Dubhaltach Mac Fhirbhisigh 15 Nollaig Ó Muraíle 16 Historians 17 RE: Dubhaltach Mac Fhirbhisigh and Nollaig Ó Muraíle 18 Vandalism etc 19 Vowels 20 Over-categorisation 20.1 DEFAULTSORT magic word 21 Slow progress... 22 Saving Sir Richard= 23 Kingdom of Breifne 24 re: Hello 25 Kings of Connachta 26 Leath Cuinn

[edit] Award

		The Black Cross of St. Declan
		You, Fergananim, are awarded the Black Cross of St. Declan for going medieval on our asses with your excellent work on articles of Dark Ages and Middle Ages interest. De réir a chéile a thógtar na caisleáin - "It takes time to build castles" Ciarán of Clonmacnoise 06:16, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Rónán mac Colmáin

Have a peek and check that Rónán mac Colmáin makes sense to you. Imagine being evil enough to have two people called Rónán mac Colmáin in the same place at the same time, more or less. Just trying to make our lives difficult that is! Mac Cairthinn mac Coelboth looks good. Were you planning to write Uí Enechglaiss and Dáibhí Ó Cróinín? I'll try and bodge something up on Brega at the weekend. All the best, Angus McLellan (Talk) 16:54, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

Good to hear from you. We've already got a Cerball mac Dúnlainge article, but it could do with your expert attention! Angus McLellan (Talk) 21:35, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Archive?

Hi Ferg, long time no message etc. Hope all is well. I need some advice. How do you archive old versions of your talk page? Jdorney 10:44, 1 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Carricks and Tyrones

[edit] The Carricks and the Tyrones

I posted this originally for Angus, but thought you too might be interested. Just writing to see if you know about G. W. S. Barrow's new belief regarding the decent of Robert I. The theory is that Nicholas, the son of Donnchad mac Gille Brigte, earl of Carrick, married the daughter of Niall Ruadh O'Neill, giving the following genealogies:

Niall Ruadh O'Neill

• Brian mac Neill O'Neill
  • Domnall mac Brian Ó Néill, the kinglet who arranged the crowning of Edward de Brus

Niall Ruadh O'Neill

• x inghean Neill Ruaidh O'Neill
  • Niall mac Donnchada, earl of Carrick
    • Marthok inghean Neill, countess of Carrick
      • Robert I, King of Scots & Edward, Lord of Galloway/Earl of Carrick

This makes Donal O'Neill the granduncle of Edward, which would help explain Edward's probable fosterage with him. Anyways, Barrow arrived at this conclusion after consulting with a genealogist named B. MacEwen. It's in the new edition of his Robert Bruce book. It would also potentially make King Robert the great, great grandson of Rory O'Connor, as Niall Ruadh's wife was his daughter. It was mentioned here before the publication of Barrow's new edition. I haven't yet decided whether or not I buy it. "Nicholaus" seems a little far-fetched a name for that cultural millieu (... who else would have had that name?), and the idea that "Nicholaus" was just an attempt to culturize the foreign name "Niall" seems a pretty good explanation. On the other hand, the argument has convinced Barrow and does have its strengths. If true, it does make you wonder how "Scottish", as opposed to trans-channel, the Carrick world view really was ... esp. considering Robert's marriage with the de Burgh earls of Ulster. Calgacus (ΚΑΛΓΑΚΟΣ) 21:23, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Usage of "Irish people" category

If an article is in a category of "Natives of county Meath", or other counties, I wouldn't feel it needs categorizing with "Irish people" as well. Since "Irish people by counties" is a sub category of "Irish Poeple". I removed your last category edit on Turlough O'Carolan. I would use "Irish people" only if I didn't know their native county. Please tell me if you disagree. Spelemann 15:48, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

I refer to my comments on User talk:Spelemann. Cheers! Spelemann 19:35, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] howdy

Hi Ferg. A (belated) Happy New Year to you too! Judging by your 'woo hoo' you're obviously in good form?

I tried cutting and pasting my talk page, but the fecking browser won't allow me to. I'll have to do it on another computer if I want to archive all the old talk stuff.

Yes, I'm getting a bit sick of wikipedia. In one way this is my own fault for getting outside the area which I genuinely know a lot about (early modern IRl) and getting sucked into the modern NI articles. The endless pov battles over these will take it out you after while. I'm also getting a bit concerned that editing wiki is getting in the way of doing other things such as, for example, getting on with my life!

Oh, like the Category:1346 in Ireland, but I think it should be an article 1346 in Ireland not a category page.

A query however, when are you going to resume work on the Irish Bruce Wars 1315-1318 page?? I wait expectantly, as ever...

Tog go bog e,

Jdorney 15:17, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

I mean that the article should have the content and should be listed in the category. Category pages are not supposed to be articles in their own right. So I went and created 1346 in Ireland and categorised it as 1346 in Ireland.

take it handy (as they say in these parts), Jdorney 15:55, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Re:

The only problem I see with that article is that if you were to do it for all years, it take you a very long time and quickly get tedious. :) Calgacus (ΚΑΛΓΑΚΟΣ) 17:29, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

Well, the Four Courts Press boys might sue if you quote too much of their book! Even the UCC stuff is copyrighted is some part, although the Hennessy and MacCarthy edition of AU is presumably long since in the public domain. It seems reasonable enough to me, for whatever my opinion is worth. Off at a tangent, what brought on the idea of permanently banning trolls and the like? In theory it's a good idea, but I suspect the devil would be in the details: who's a troll and abuser? All the best, Angus McLellan (Talk) 17:37, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

You might wanna stick references on particular entry quotations, both to avoid copyright violations and direct the reader, but it's good the way it is already. Is this year special to you, or are you planning on creating similar pages for every year? Calgacus (ΚΑΛΓΑΚΟΣ) 12:07, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

I'm very sorry to hear that. I hope it's only a temporary thing, rather than a permanent thing. I think the year thing is a very good idea, it's just a shame that there is not the manpower among the Scottish or Irish medievalists to complete such a project adequately. Can I ask what sort of thing you've written in the real world? BTW, article David I of Scotland has been rewritten, and is an FAC at Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/David I of Scotland; if you have time to read it and you find any issues, these please lemme know. All the best. Calgacus (ΚΑΛΓΑΚΟΣ) 12:21, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] List of years in Ireland

Hi there Fergananim, it's nice to talk to you again after so long. I have headed up 1347 in Ireland so that it looks similar to the years back in the 19th and 20th centuries as how we had agreed previously. Otherwise, that looks like nice work, and it's good to be able to have a Table of Contents in there as 1347 is covered in a surprising amount of detail.

Thank you for getting in contact and I await your reply. Bobo. 17:43, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Editing guidelines

Hello, I thought I would remind you of a few article editing guidelines:

• Please use an edit summary when making edits. This is useful for other editors to see at a glance what were the changes you made.
• If you make minor edits, please check the "Minor Edit" checkbox right above the Save Page button.
• Please use the Preview button (right beside the Save Page button) when making changes, so that you don't have to make numerous minor edits one right after another. This keeps the history smaller and allows other editors to see more easily what changes you made.

Thanks and best regards, Icemuon 14:01, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Whoa!

Hey! Firstly, how odd to see someone who has such similar interests to my own. I'm currently back in Ireland visiting my family in Connemara (actually in Mullingar at moment) and Donegal etc. Your 1347 is excellent - good job! Have you read Cahill's "How the Irish saved civilisation" ? I thought it was excellent as an intro to the monastic period. Got to see the Book of Kells for the first time 4 days ago...blew me away. Dublin pretty much bored the sh*t out of me (I'm from London so all cities are more or less the same) but I fell in love with the Chester Beatty and National Museum Collections. I might have to pinch a load of your icons off your user page, I'm afraid. Anyhow..nice to 'meet' you...now time to get practising on the fiddle I am determined to play.Iamlondon 01:43, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] RE: Hello Gaillimh

Indeed, I don't think the banner accurately reflects the the IRA at all and is a good-faith, albeit misguided attempt by someone who appears very enthusiastic, but knows very little about Ireland herself. Having said all this, the fellows over there on the WikiProject have been doing good work and I'm sure that once they learn a bit more, they'll see that some of their symbols are not at all appropriate for the scope of their project. Thanks a lot for the message and feel free to get back in touch gaillimh^{Conas tá tú?} 18:15, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] The Esteemed Mr Forbes

I was just reading it and nitpicking over your spelling. If you use Firefox you can get a nifty on-line spell-checker add-on gizmo. It's a bit rubbish, but better than a poke in the eye with a sharp stick. A damn fine article by the looks of it. Hope this means you're feeling a bit better. I'll get back to my nitpicking! Cheers, Angus McLellan (Talk) 20:06, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Dubhaltach Mac Fhirbhisigh

As ever, good to hear from you.

I can't say anything personally for the factuality of the article, but it certainly looks comprehensive and is worth seeking the opinions of more knowledgeable editors than myself. The link http://www.comhranadtonn.com/lectures/Mac%20Firbishigh.html doesn't appear to be working, however, and comes up merely as a blank screen on my computer.

I am particularly impressed that, in spite of the article containing sixteen comprehensive sections, you have managed to keep it below 30Kb. That's some good condensing.

All the best, and I hope you find the results you are after. Bobo. 20:12, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

Looks good to me. Have you finished it, or is it still in a process? If you're aiming for FA, you'll need to use footnotes, and prolly put one or two pictures. In case you didn#t know, there is an article on the ODNB, Nollaig Ó Muraíle, ‘Mac Fhirbhisigh, Dubhaltach Óg (c.1600–1671)’, Oxford Dictionary of National Biography, Oxford University Press, 2004 , accessed 22 Feb 2007. Regards, Calgacus (ΚΑΛΓΑΚΟΣ) 01:29, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Nollaig Ó Muraíle

This one needed a thorough copyedit for spelling and grammar, but otherwise it's looking good. So long as I haven't missed any spellings of Gaelic terms, all of the spelling and grammar errors have been wiped out, but the article looks pretty comprehensive considering it's a single person's work. Bobo. 03:27, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

They’re all looking pretty good now. The articles are comfortable to read and comprehensive and enjoyable to read through. Thank you for filling in this corner of Wikipedia. Bobo. 16:18, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Historians

Hi Ferg,

Congratulations on two excellent articles. Well structured, well written and well researched. I once heard NOM give a talk on DMF in UCD. Two very interesting characters in their own right. I think they still neem some minor copyediting though, I'll have a look at them for this.

Jdorney 10:47, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] RE: Dubhaltach Mac Fhirbhisigh and Nollaig Ó Muraíle

Wow, great articles! I gave Dubhaltach Mac Fhirbhisigh a look at did a small copyedit to the first few sections. Unfortunately, I know nothing of Mac Fhirbhisigh himself, but I'd be honoured to work on it with you, providing a fresh set of eyes for copyedits, or digging up some sources. I'll also gladly take at the Ó Muraíle in the upcoming days. Cheers! gaillimh^{Conas tá tú?} 19:58, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Vandalism etc

Yo Ferg,

I read your thoughts on vandalism on the village pump page and more or less agree. Personally I am sick to death of constantly fighting POV battles on wikipedia. Partly this is because of the articles I work on, many of which are contentious. See Kingsmill massacre, for a recent example of a prolonged pov battle (the article not the actual event that is).

However what is really wearying is having to scan all the articles I contribute to for petty vandalism and ill-informed mistakes (eg see recent edits on Taig). I recently lobbied to get he Oliver Cromwell article semi-protected, so that anon and newly registered users cannot edit it. Personally, I feel that all articles should be like this all the time. If unregistered users want to make legitimate changes, let them raise them first on the talk page. If they are genuine, as many will be, then the user can be enabled to edit. Equally valuably, editors can discuss how to integrate new infromation into the text before changes are made. If this was done then articles would not only be safer from vandalism, they would also in all probability be better written and more balanced.

le meas, Jdorney 11:08, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Ideally, what I'd like to see, as I've gone into above, is to have all articles given the protection that protected ones have now.

Jdorney 16:41, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Vowels

á é í ó ú Á É Í Ó Ú. Had to put them somewhere. Fergananim 17:50, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Over-categorisation

Hi Ferganim

I have been tidying up Category:Irish people by removing articles which are already categorised under one or more sub-categories, per Wikipedia:Categorization#Some_general_guidelines #3: "Articles should not usually be in both a category and its subcategory".

I have left some articles in there, per Wikipedia:Categorization and subcategories#Reasons_for_duplication: "When an article is put into a subcategory based on an attribute that is not the first thing most people would think of to categorise it, it should be left in the parent category as well." But many of the articles you have added don't come anywhere near those criteria, such as Ben Briscoe: he was already in lots of appropriate sub-categories ithiut cluttering up the main category.

Also, please do remember to index when you add articles to categories. Thanks! --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 22:57, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

Sorry about that; will keep it in mind in future. By the way, was it you who reverted my edit to Notable Irish people? Cheers! Fergananim 23:06, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

No, not me! --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 23:26, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

Hi, I notice that you are adding Category:Irish people to subjects who are already categorised as Natives of County XX. This is not necessary, in my opinion, as the natives of an Irish county are by definition Irish people.--Damac 11:24, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] DEFAULTSORT magic word

Hi again, I thought I'd drop you another note, after I noticed that in some of your recent edits you were making unnecessary extra work for yourself, because you seemed to be unaware of the purpose of the magic-word "DEFAULTSORT".

It's a relatively new addition to the wikimedia software, which avoids the need to separately add a sortkey to each category entry. So in the article Nollaig Ó Muraíle, in this edit you added sortkeys to the category entries, creating this effect:

{{DEFAULTSORT:O Muraile, Nollaig}}

[[Category:Living people|O Muraile, Nollaig]]
[[Category:Irish historians|O Muraile, Nollaig]]
[[Category:Irish academics|O Muraile, Nollaig]]
[[Category:Irish writers|O Muraile, Nollaig]]
[[Category:Irish people|O Muraile, Nollaig]]
[[Category:Natives of County Mayo|O Muraile, Nollaig]]
[[Category:Year of birth missing|O Muraile, Nollaig]]
[[Category:Articles needing redirects]]

That's just duplication, so (as well as removing the category "Irish people", I have removed the sortkey from each category, to produce this result:

{{DEFAULTSORT:O Muraile, Nollaig}}

[[Category:Living people]]
[[Category:Irish historians]]
[[Category:Irish academics]]
[[Category:Irish writers]]
[[Category:Natives of County Mayo]]
[[Category:Year of birth missing]]
[[Category:Articles needing redirects]]

... which has exactly the same effect, and is both less cluttered and leaves less room for error.

Hope this helps! I'm sorry if the above sounded like a reproach or anything, because it's not intended to be that at all, just a helpful pointer to a way of saving you a bit of work and helping to keep the article source uncluttered, and unfortunately it has not been very well-documented.

Best wishes, --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 11:16, 12 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Slow progress...

...with Flann Sinna. It would be nice to have it on the front page for the 1091th anniversary (significant, no?) of his death. When I get that done, I'm meaning to go back and fix up Áed Finnliath and Niall Glúndub, and maybe write something on Mrs Niall, Gormlaith. Here's a stupid question you'll likely know the answer to: why is Muirechertach, son of Niall Glúndub, called "Muirchertach of the Leather Cloaks"? Hope you're feeling passably well. All the best, Angus McLellan (Talk) 19:12, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

P.S. I bodged up a quick Kings of Brega page, but as it's only based on the table at the back of Frank Byrne's book, it's anything but complete. Do you have a complete list? Angus McLellan (Talk) 20:35, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Saving Sir Richard=

If you would please, have a look at this. Thanks M'friend!--(The IP formally known as Ghost)70.171.22.74 13:11, 12 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Kingdom of Breifne

Yep, it was me who wrote the article. Got lots of questions about it and visited Breffni park for a game recently so decided to write more about it.

Jorgenpfhartogs 12:35, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] re: Hello

Hello! Thanks for your message. It'll take me a little while to respond properly as Ive just had a family funeral followed by a heart attack and hospital procedure, so I nearly ended up with my own version of Sutton Hoo!!!! On the mend now but confined to occasional visits to Internet cafe. Will be in touch ain a week or two. best, Dr Steven Plunkett 10:22, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Kings of Connachta

Thanks for expanding on Angus Mclellans answer to my question concerning Máel Sechnaill, and please give my regards to Donnchadh Ó Corráin if you meet him again ;-)

I was looking at the Kings of Connacht with the intention of writing something about the historical kingdom of Connachta for no:wiki. Two things stroke me: Firstly, might it not be better with this map from commons instead of the map showing the current boundaries of the province and counties. It's a bit to colorful for my taste, but the best I have found so far (If you believe it to be incorrect in any fashion, please let me know - I've used it in several articles on no:wiki).

Secondly, Brian Borus mother is supposed to have been the daughter of Murchad, a king of (western(?)) Connachta. He does not seem to figure on this list though - do you know anything about that?

Regards, Finnrind 22:51, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Leath Cuinn

Made some changes to this article, created by you back in 2005. Propose that the article be moved to Leath Cuinn and Leth Moga, as it is Leth Moga is a redirect to Leath Cuinn. Is it Leath or Leth btw??

If I have gotten anything wrong here, please let me now as I have made a translation of this in no: Yours, Finnrind 19:31, 29 March 2007 (UTC)