Talk:Etymology of the name of Julius Caesar
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Two points about this:
"This story is probably untrue, as the name "Caesar" had already been in the family for generations before the famous Caesar's birth, without even considering the medical likelihood of a successful Caesarean section having been performed in 100 BC."
First, Caesarean sections name maybe has his origins from Caesar, so doesn't matter if the name has been in the family in previous generations, this is obvious. Second, the legend says that the Caesar mother died when pregnant and then somebody did the Caesarean section to get Caesar out of the died body, so the medical likehood is probable. I dont know if the legend is true or about his proofs, but I think that this paragraph must be changed.
This article also says:
>>the Rosetta Stone contains a hieroglyphic cartouche transcribed as "k-e-s-r-s" and supposed to be related to the Latin sense.
However, myself and others have been though the text and can find no such reference. Can someone please indicate if this is true or not, and where on the text such a cartouche is to be found? ralf.ellis@virgin.net
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[edit] Shah?
What's the source for the Persian shah being derived from Caesar? From everything I can find (in sources both offline and on), it comes from the Old Persian xšāyaθiya and is in now way related to Caesar. I've never even heard that theory before. --Patrick T. Wynne 09:20, 21 November 2005 (UTC)
- You're right. Shah has been used since the days of Cyrus the Great, centuries before Ceasar. --Countakeshi 01:55, 13 December 2005 (UTC)
[edit] references needed
Other derivations suggest that the root of the name may not be of Latin origin; the Rosetta Stone contains a hieroglyphic cartouche transcribed as "k-e-s-r-s" and supposed to be related to the Latin sense. Another suggested foreign derivation is the Persian Kasrá (pl. Akásirah), the title of four great dynasties of Persian kings, via Ahasuerus (i.e., Khshayarsha, better known as Xerxes I, the grandson of Cyrus the Great); eventual relationship between kisri and kasrá is seen as less meaningful, mostly referred to later times (Sassanides).
because it needs references. Even if there's such a cartouche on the Rosetta Stone (and there is reason to doubt this assertion), who thinks that the Egyptian name is the origin of the Roman? Who thinks it's more than a coincidence?
Similarly, who suggests the Persian derivation? How do they think an old Persian word became a Latin family name? Does the meaning of the Persian word remotely resemble any of the theorized meanings of the Latin? Does the Persian word even sound anything like Caesar, or does it just look similar when romanized?
I couldn't find a reliable reference for these theories; if anyone turns one up they should of course restore the text. —Charles P. (Mirv) 19:32, 17 January 2006 (UTC)
oh dear. these were first added to Julius Caesar in March 2002 (without reference, needless to say) and were just removed, so they've been in search engine results for almost four years. Any outside reference will need to be dated before that time if it's to be considered credible. —Charles P. (Mirv) 19:38, 17 January 2006 (UTC)
In subsequent times, some authors think that "Caesar" entered Eurasian folklore as Geser of Rūm or Khrom, Geser Khan, or, much later, Geser of Ling (after a province of eastern Tibet). Geser became a war god especially popular with central Asian military societies, known to have spread from the Seljuk Turks and Sassanid Persians to Tibetan, Mongolian, Manchu and eventually Chinese mythologies by the time of the Qing dynasty. Who are these authors? Recent archaelogy have disproven Gesar being Caesar. [1] I think this whole page should be merged with Caesar (title). --Countakeshi 12:20, 5 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Elephant coin
It would be nice to have an image of this silver denarius featuring an elephant defeating a snake over the letters CAESAR. I do not find it in Commmons. --Error 04:55, 5 March 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Transliteration
The article uses “KUY” as a transliteration for the first syllable of of CAESAR, saying it rhymes with “sky”, and “KAI” for the first syllable of Καίσαρ, saying it rhymes with “guy.” Are these supposed to represent different sounds? -Ahruman 17:29, 12 May 2006 (UTC)
- No, the vowels (diphthongs, actually) in question are the same. In my opinion the article would be better off with just the IPA transliteration.
--Haruo 20:27, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
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- Julius Caesar suggests [ˈgaːius ˈjuːlius ˈkaisar]. Apparently GAIUS should be pronounced in three syllables. I don't know Latin, so I'll have to leave it to other people to get this right. However, I've removed the ad hoc pronunciation as I think it can only serve to confuse the reader, especially non-native speakers of English. (Is "KUY" pronounced like Cuy?!) Hairy Dude 22:29, 28 January 2007 (UTC)
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- Yes, it indeed seems that GAIUS should have three syllables (hence not [ˈgaːjus], which most think, nor [ˈgajjus], which I'm afraid I was responsible for). This is supported by Sidney Allen, Vox Latina, page 39, footnote 1. I have made the change. Alatius 13:41, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
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[edit] Etymology of Julius? Where?
Although the article contains some theories on the etymology of "Caesar", there is nothing on the etymology of "Julius", which is what I was actually looking for when I came here. Further, most of the article is not on etymology at all, but on orthography and phonology and Roman naming customs. --Haruo 20:27, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
