Talk:Dredging

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Dredgers was a messy article that didn't seem to contain anything that this article didn't have, and it included a link to a commercial website that seemed to be spam, so I redirected it and Dredging here. If anyone disagrees, they can revert my changes, I suppose. GregoryWeir 19:09, 30 Dec 2004 (UTC)

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[edit] dredge versus dredger

That last revert wiped out several of my editing sessions. I also found in Altavista many more "dredge" than "dredger". But most of the uses of "dredge" did not mean "dredger ship/boat", even after weeding out cases where "dredge" meant cookery / pop musicians / a golfer / etc etc etc. Anthony Appleyard 18:16, 22 August 2005 (UTC)

Googe very clearly indicates that "dredge" is the more common term for the ship. Dredge yields 827,000 results, while dredger yields 91,100 (both without quotes). Attempting to weed out as suggested, "dredge" "ship" returns 173,000, and "dredger" "ship" returns 39,000 (all terms in quotes). Sorry about screwing up the later edits, but the article does need to reflect the common usage of the word. siafu 18:27, 22 August 2005 (UTC)

A dredger is a sort of ship, so the combination "dredger ship" is less likely to occur because it is tautological.

I have just searched in http://www.altavista.com for "dredge", and in the first 100 entries I found only one where "dredge" certainly meant the ship rather than the digging gear that it carries, plus many where "dredge" was a verb gerund (dredge pump, dredge site), and cookery - and an astonishing amount of pop musicians and competitive sportsmen. Anthony Appleyard 20:21, 22 August 2005 (UTC)

I didn't search "dredger ship" it was "dredger" and "ship" given that it's less likely to have the two words in one phrase as it is in seperate places on the page. The pop musician is "dredg" without the final e, and if you search on google with the terms "dredge" -"dredg" you still get over 800,000 results, and amost all that pop up refer to the ships. The word "dredger", as far as I can tell, is much more rarely used-- I've certainly never heard it, and all the folks over at GLDD (both American and British) use the word "dredge" exclusively. siafu 21:39, 22 August 2005 (UTC)

Using http://www.altavista.com/ I have just found 216000 for dredger and ship, and 367000 for dredge and ship. Of the 376000, many were with "dredge" as the verb, or verb gerund compounds (dredge gear, dredge pump, etc etc), or definitely meaning only the submerged digging gear, and a few were definitely with "dredge" meaning the ship. GLDD = Great Lakes Dredge & Dock Company. Here in England the television news etc always seems to call the ship a dredger. Anthony Appleyard 22:17, 22 August 2005 (UTC)

We seem to have yet another case where British and American word usages differ. Americans and British people meeting likely can keep on arguing about the difference between potato crisps and chips and French fries, and likely similarly here. Anthony Appleyard 05:56, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

I'm a long-time employee of GLD&D, and I would say that the article now has it right, Dredge is the US usage, while european usage uses both dredge and dredger to indicate the vessel. - Robert Ramsdell

[edit] On Splitting, Clean Template and Such

  • One compromise on the learned internet babble above might be to focus on the output--dredging-- the process of getting a deep channel. Terms for machines can then be redirected to the article on dredging in general without needing to slight either societies variant.
  • Splitting the article seems contraindicated. I agree that it needs a severe style and organizational overhaul. I'll add it to my TO-DO list, but it'll likely be a month or two.
  • It would be helpful to have a list of percieved shortcomings below, as we all don't see with the same eyes. So I'll add a section for that discussion below now as well. FrankB 19:56, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

I would suggest splitting the article. I edited the page somewhat to improve (I think) the descriptions of the various machines, added and reorganized links, etc. However, the types of dredging, and types of machines probably each deserve their own pages, as much more could be said about them. I don't think that it is helpful to argue about terminology, rather we should note where US and European (and others, although I'm not familiar with them) usage differ. - Robert Ramsdell

Would someone who knows what they are talking about please split this article via a disambig page?

Maybe:

  • Dredging
  • Dredge (device)
  • Dredger (vessel)/Dredge (vessel)

+ assorted other definitions. -- TheMightyQuill 16:55, 17 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Specific Shortcomings (We can 'S'-thru) during A Clean Effort

  1. Focus the article on the process of dredging and it's importance to world wide navigation, not on machines. FrankB 19:56, 4 April 2006 (UTC)
  • Maybe this should be the first split. One article to focus on the types of dredging, benefits, etc, and another to focus on methods and machines. I suspect that the article is presently weighted towards machinery because the authors (including myself) are from the dredging industry, thus practitioners of dredging rather than 'consumers'. - Robert Ramsdell, 16:22, 4 April (CST)
  • Do not split this page. But, if e.g. someone writes a long description of bucket dredgers, it can go in a separate page Bucket dredger which would be pointed to from dredge#Bucket dredger. The main reason for splitting a page is if it gets too big, like I had to do with frogman. Anthony Appleyard 16:54, 17 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Environmental effects

Could someone add a section highlighting the controversy surrounding the practise of dredging and its impact upon marine habitat? Tug201 06:12, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

yes this article is very unbalanced....really just a treatise on dredging hardware. needs a lot of work on worldwide occurrences and environmental impact, disposal, controversy etc. Anlace 05:16, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
i have now added a small amount of information on environmental effects. article is still highly unbalanced toward the hardware of dredging. by the way wouldnt a better name for the article be Dredging? Another idea would be to create a subarticle on the hardware of dredging. regards. Anlace 05:40, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Water injection dredging

"Water injection results in a lot of sediment in the water"

This is not normally the case. Quoted from document in link below..

"The interaction between the density current and the surrounding physical environment has also been monitored during the research. It confirmed that the density current, that actually transports the particles, stays relatively close to the bottom and creates virtually no turbidity higher in the water column. It can be stated therefore, that dispersion of sediment into the surrounding water is negligible."

[1]

[edit] Proposed article name change to Dredging

  • Support name change. This seems like a logical move, since the article should be about more than the hardware. Anlace 05:55, 4 February 2007 (UTC)
  • Support MadMaxDog 11:56, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

Admin is needed to make this uncontested change, since page Dredging is occupied. thank you. Anlace 04:35, 5 February 2007 (UTC)

Hi. Please see WP:RM for help. Thanks. Xiner (talk, email) 05:00, 5 February 2007 (UTC)

I've completed the move request, and swapped the history previously at Dreding with the history at Dredge, because there was some material there that was previously merged into the current article. -GTBacchus(talk) 14:12, 5 February 2007 (UTC)

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