Talk:Denys Defrancesco

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The article is still being written. What is the problem?—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Hot Legs and Feet (talk • contribs) 02:31, 26 May 2006.

First of all, please sign the messages you leave on talk pages by typing four tildes (~~~~). That way people know who said what and when. Secondly, the problem is that right now you're not creating an encyclopedia article, you're just writing a puff piece about the guy. Please read Wikipedia:Welcome, newcomers and especially Wikipedia:Five pillars before you do anything else. Mind you, I'm quite willing to believe that Denys Defrancesco is a topic notable enough to deserve an article of its own, but what you're writing right now simply won't do. Are you by any chance Mr. Denfrancesco yourself? If you are, you are not an even remotely neutral party and probably shouldn't be writing this article at all. -- Captain Disdain 02:41, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Also, right now you're simply copying and pasting content from [1], which is not acceptable -- it's a copyright violation. Please remove all material that has been copied from another source from the article at once. (I realize that you may actually be the copyright holder, and if so, that's another thing, but even then the material is not appropriate for an encyclopedia, as indicated above.) I realize that this may be a pain in the butt for you, but please don't be discouraged by these setbacks! You can still create and edit articles here, you just need to learn the right way to do so. -- Captain Disdain 02:49, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Hot Legs and Feet 02:58, 26 May 2006 (UTC)no, I am not Denys Defrancesco but I have worked for him in the past and still do on occasion. Denys only speaks french. Yes I took some parts from the ddfprod.com site because that article was written by a past freelance writter outside the ddf production company for Denys (for which we have all the rights to use, hence on the ddfprod.com site) which I believe would be ideal for here too. I can remove the "puff" parts but need to be more specific. Also, I've been looking at others in the same category and if my previous article on one of his sites (hot legs and feet) was spam, then you need to look at others because I've seen direct porn sites being advertised unlike what I am doing here talking about Denys Defrancesco and his glamour photography career. He also directs XXX porn movies...see here

http://poll.imdb.com/name/nm1589657/

I have no doubt that there is more spam on Wikipedia than there should be, but that's kind of beside the point (though if you would care to point these articles out, I'm sure they can be evaluated). Now, if you or your company are affiliated wiht Mr. Defrancesco, then there's likely to be a serious problem with neutral point of view, which is a key tenet of Wikipedia. Furthermore, you need to cite references for the claims you make in the article. For example, "He is now recognized as one of the greatest living talents in nude photography." Is he? By whom? Where does it say so? I mean, I'm willing to believe that he is, I'm hardly an expert on the subject, but you can't just say it, you need to provide a reference for it. This is all very easy to do with Hugh Hefner, for example, because his name is all over the internet, and the TV, and magazines, and everyone already knows who he is. It gets a little different with Mr. Defrancesco, because he is not as well-known. Anyone can claim anything, but it's not enough that something is correct, it must also be verifiable from reliable sources. The material you have copied from your site is not written from a neutral point of view. Furthermore, it's also written in a very conversational tone of voice, which is not appropriate for an encyclopedia article. -- Captain Disdain 03:15, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Just to be clear on this, though: I'm not saying that he shouldn't have an article, because it appears to me that he's easily notable enough to meet the criteria for inclusion, as listed in the guidelines at Wikipedia:Notability (people). But the article needs to be written in a way that fits Wikipedia. -- Captain Disdain 03:18, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Hot Legs and Feet 03:24, 26 May 2006 (UTC)I'll do my best to remove the "fluff" parts that seems like self-selling (parts that I can't provide a reference to) like you say and hopefully neutralize the article as much as I can. This guys really deserves a spot on wikipedia. Thanks for your help.

No problem. I know it can be a little overwhelming to deal with all this stuff at first, but I'm sure you'll get the hang of it after a while. And please remember that we also like it when people are bold, so you're not doing anything wrong here. =) -- Captain Disdain 03:27, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Cleaned up

This current version meets WP:NPOV. IMO, none of the content I excised did. Compare to Helmut Newton to see what is suitable biographical content for wikipedia, if you like. That article is non-congratulatory, disinterested and referenced. Please, continue to improve this article and the encyclopedia. With thanks, Colonel Tom 12:06, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Hot Legs and Feet 13:52, 26 May 2006 (UTC) wow..almost nothing left...ok I will check with the newton guy...also, can we remove the discussion threads . I surely don't want to leave these personal discussions for all public viewing. It has nothing to do with user information. Thanks.

They can't be easily removed (they could be blanked, but even then they could be seen in previous revisions of the talk page). An administrator could delete the talk page entirely, but there must be a very good reason for that. And in any case, it's not like these discussions are terribly personal, really -- we're not discussing any personal matters. -- Captain Disdain 16:28, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Please do not blank this talk page

Perhaps I was unclear above. It is not a great idea to blank pages on Wikipedia without a very good reason -- it can be considered to be vandalism. There is absolutely no personal information listed here, nor is there anything else that could be considered confidential or infringing on someone's privacy on this talk page. -- Captain Disdain 15:32, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] The author speaks

I am the author of the text on [2] which was borrowed here, i.e. the "past freelance writter outside the ddf production company" whom Hot Legs and Feet refers to above. Let me add that I was in fact a full-time employee of DDF Productions in Budapest when I wrote that publicity text for a promotional website. I worked for DDF for a period of several years.

I too feel that Denys Defrancesco deserves a good and complete article on Wikipedia, but that the text from [3] is not appropriate for this context. It is not factually authoritative or detailed enough, and it lacks the longitude and balance which would be needed for a good encyclopedia article.

Writing this article properly would mean ploughing through a mountain of biographical and bibliographical information. I'm sure anyone who has seen Defrancesco's own sprawling library of his work would appreciate what I meam.

I don't have the time or ability to do a thorough job of cataloguing Defrancesco's work, but I'd like to put out a call to the many fans who do have a fuller knowledge of Defrancesco's career to make this article more complete. I can't think of anyone more qualified to do this than Hot Legs and Feet, so I'd like to encourage him to start putting down what he can for the record, and we'll all pitch in how we can. This is a collaborative effort after all!!! 84.0.159.94 06:48, 19 August 2006 (UTC)