User talk:DeliDumrul

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Welcome!

Hello, DeliDumrul, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Again, welcome! —Khoikhoi 20:37, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

Thanks a bunch! DeliDumrul 20:48, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

Bir şey değil. ;) —Khoikhoi 20:49, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

Hi. I believe you can do whatever you want with PD images, as they're not copyrighted. —Khoikhoi 00:40, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

Well, I'm not sure if that's necessary, but you might try {{GFDL}} or {{GFDL-self}}. —Khoikhoi 00:53, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

Or {{PD-self}}. —Khoikhoi 00:53, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Image:Bizansist touchup.jpg

What, was the sea flooded with macaroni? ;) There are some pretty good images of Turkey in my gallery. My favorite of which is this one:

Yeah, you did a good job, I just thought it was funny. That image is already in the Antalya article btw. —Khoikhoi 04:24, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

I like that too—thanks! —Khoikhoi 04:40, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

Hey, cool! Thanks again, it looks great. :) —Khoikhoi 05:01, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

—Khoikhoi 04:17, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] License tagging for Image:Bursa Anadolu Gymnasium.jpg

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[edit] Yes

I dunno, you guys don't want the Greek name mentioned AT ALL in the intro, while we want it at the very top—I think it makes a nice compromise. We have the Turkish name at Samothrace for example, what's so bad about that? —Khoikhoi 17:45, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

Well, as you said from the naming conventions, the names that are not relevant should be in a separate section. I believe that the Greek name is, but anyways, you might want to see these articles for example:

Sibiu (IPA [si'biw], German: Hermannstadt, Hungarian: Nagyszeben) -- in Romania
Hrodna (Belarusian: Гро́дна, Го́радня, Гаро́дня; Russian: Гро́дно, Grodno; Polish: Grodno, German: Garten) -- in Belarus

The way that I see it, is that it's good to represent all the history of a place, not just its recent history. There are tons of Turkish city articles that have the Greek, Armenian, etc. names at the top, and I personally think they're helpful for historial reference. For example, if I want to know what modern-day city is "Ancyra", I can just type it in, and clearly see it at the top of the Ankara article.

Anyways, I'm very sorry for being rude (unlike where you are, the whether sucks today, and I guess people get mad when it's 85 degrees F.). I hope the dispute ends soon... :) —Khoikhoi 22:10, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Placenames

I certainly have nothing personal with you. But as I can see your countributions to Istanbul article have been significant, yet for a strange reason, you dont seem to follow your own remarks regarding alternative names. You add the Turkish name AT THE TOP of Alexandroupoli article but you dont add the Greek name AT THE TOP of Istanbul article. That of course is totally unacceptable. So i ve discussed with other editors one solution: That is to add names in the article and not at the TOP. This solution seems to work. But I, personally, will not tolerate adding Turkish names on Greek places(AT THE TOP) when there is no adding of the Greek name in a place of such importance to Greeks as Istanbul.Regards.Mywayyy 17:27, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

No offence, but you seem to have a problem on adding the Greek name AT THE TOP of the Istanbul article, cause when someone added it you immediately erased it! Besides that, your statement that if we add the Greek name then we should add the Armenian too is not very correct due to the fact that Greeks and Armenians dont have the same historical/cultural significance for Istanbul the same way one could say that Bulgarians dont have the same significance for Alexandroupoli as Turks. Either way, I think the solution I offered you would stop this reverts-war.I think our articles at the moment are just fine. Agreed?Mywayyy 17:42, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

It is a shame we cannot agree to that. You seem a logical and open-minded kind of person and I really appreciate that. I also cant agree that Greek and Turkish people are friends, though I would like that from the bottom of my heart for the benefit especially of the Turkish people. Unfortunately the situation is more complex than that. And the present situation is NOT due to historical facts as some people wish to think rather than the internal political situation of Turkey and the importance of the Army. For this situation Turkish people are aslo responsible because they tolerate this situation. In Greece if there was a similar situation it is absolutely certain that the public would somehow respond (as in 1974). Greece constanly, and everybody knows that, backs Turkeys effords to become a democratic EU-orriented country plus it tries to maintain a rather calm attitude to various provocations, an attitude many countries wouldnt show and an attitude Greek public opinion is sick and tired (now). So Turkey's policy with the blessings of the Turkish people, since they tolerate it, has achieved (some of) the following:

1. It lags far behind developed countries, beiing a poor country with a medium Human Development Index, a result of stubborn political choices.

2. It starts pissing off ,other than Greece, European partners because they see no progress but a I-dont-give-a-shit attitude.

3. It starts pissing off Greek public opinion (Greeks 2 years ago were split evenly to whether they support an EU Turkey- now 68% is against).

So you see Greeks and Turkish people are not so friends after all, although I wish someday to become.RegardsMywayyy 19:01, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Turkic peoples

I still think there should be a section about Pan-Turkism, as it's a closely-related subject. Let's call it an overview, then. It doesn't necessarily have to be a "summary", per se. —Khoikhoi 19:23, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

The section should still remain, you can reduce it to a small stub if you want until it is expanded.

As for Ararat, you can just add {{fact}} tags for things that need sources. I think information about the people that lived near the mountain past and present is totally relevant. Mount Everest mentions the Sherpas, why can't this article talk about the Armenians and Kurds? When you say "contraversial and disputed pages", do you mean the Armenian Genocide article? No one disputes that Armenians lived in Eastern Anatolia before 1915, it's just what happened to them that remains debated. I also see no reason why you deleted the exernal link about Kurds, I personally found it to be interesting. —Khoikhoi 19:37, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Hmmm, how about we create a new "People" section and talk about the historical and present demographics? I see what you're saying for the crescent, however (you can remove that). As for the Kurds, I don't think the name of the website has anything to do with calling the Kurds "bastards", that's just their name. —Khoikhoi 19:55, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Ok, how does this look? BTW, I found some interesting pictures of the Ottoman Empire here and one of Turkey here. Let me know if I should upload any of them. —Khoikhoi 20:08, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Lol, no problem. :) —Khoikhoi 20:16, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Hehe, I bet they're all PD, I'll upload them sometime, but I'm too lazy right now. —Khoikhoi 20:48, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Sounds good, but you're aware that there already is one, right? —Khoikhoi 21:02, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Well, I guess I'm looking foward to seeing how it looks! I had Photoshop briefly once, and I was amazed at how much you can do with it. How long does it usually take to colorize an image? —Khoikhoi 21:27, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Well...have fun then. ;) —Khoikhoi 21:33, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Wow, that looks pretty good! ~~What article do you think it should go in?~~ Ooops, kinda obvious. —Khoikhoi 22:14, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

I don't see any difference yet... I guess we need to wait awhile. —Khoikhoi 22:24, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

I see it now. Alright then! —Khoikhoi 22:39, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Ummmm...

The recent move you made to İshak Paşa Sarayı is against Wikipedia:Naming conventions (use English). That's why we have the page at Mehmed Talat Pasha, not Mehmet Talat Paşa. —Khoikhoi 23:12, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

I think the original name is fine. There's an interesting debate going on over at Talk:Imbros and Tenedos btw. —Khoikhoi 23:19, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Heh, I meant the name before you changed it. ;) —Khoikhoi 23:28, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Category:Istanbul images

I just saw your comment. I see you've figured out how to create categories, the name is fine. I would prefer "Images of Istanbul", but it doesn't make much of a difference. I'm not sure if there is a tag for images of Turkey, but you might try uploading them to the Wikimedia Commons next time so that all Wikipedias (including the Turkish one, Vikipedi) can use them. Cheers! —Khoikhoi 02:53, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Friendship

DeliDumrul, you know it wasnt my intend to offend you or destroy anything. Since you ve lived in the U.S Canada and Europe you would know what I m talking about. Also, all you need to do in order to see that i m not offending anybody is to check per capita incomes in EU or US or Canada and compare it with that of Turkey. You believe that a HDI that places Turkey in no 94 behind Sri Lanka is something to be proud of? All I wanted to stress is that Turkish people, if they realize the situation and not close their eyes at it, can find the power to change things. And maybe then we can say to the world that Greeks and Turks are friends for the good of the whole region. My best regards.Mywayyy 05:35, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Gökçeada and Bozcaada

Hi, thank you for your message. It is true that Septentrionalis' argument was partly based on the naming of the islands in older literature (such as Shakespeare). However, that does not mean his argument is invalid. If the "average" speaker of English knows the islands best from historical texts, then those would be the most common names of the islands. I don't know if that is the case here; it's a judgement call that I have not made; I've let the voters decide. Yes, I can decide which votes are valid, but in this case, I see no reason to invalidate any votes. Both the arguments for and against the move are reasonable, in my opinion.

About the timeliness of the closing of the debate: the usual duration of such a discussion is 5 days (see WP:RM). This one already lasted 8 days, and did not draw any votes in the last 4 days, so it really was time to close that discussion. You may of course continue to discuss the name of the article (in fact, I encourage you to do so); but unless there are signs that the general consensus swings your way, I would not open another formal move request. Eugène van der Pijll 15:31, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

Bu arada dilimizn suyu mu çıktı güzel kardeşim bana da mı ecnebice yorumlar? Cık cık cık... :) Kertenkelebek^Ⓣ 18:21, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

I'm also trying to fix those twisted POVs but they just keep on reverting, take a look at the page history, you can revert to my version too. Kertenkelebek^Ⓣ 18:42, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] I do not understand

Sorry! The statement you droped on my talk does not have a clear question (example=so, so, so; I want to; what do you think?). My default response generally goes like this; There are three pages because Greeks and Turkish people can not agree even on the name, forget about the history... I see no reason for you not to add historical info under istanbul as long as it is after 1453. If it gets too big, it will have its own page. --OttomanReference 19:19, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

Btw, if you are editing Istanbul: when did it reach its present boundaries? 1930? In Ottoman times it was only to the west of the Strait. Septentrionalis 21:50, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

There's been built-up area all around the Bosphorus since late antiquity; I am asking about the boundaries of the legal city, which was certainly limited to the area between the Golden Horn, the Straits, and the Sea of Marmora (if you will permit me to use my native language ;->) in 1453 - and I believe very much later. If you happen to see the facts, do put them in. I haven't bothered to do research, so I'm not asking you to. Septentrionalis 22:09, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

Nice, but don't tell me, put them in the article(s). Presumably the paleolithic evidence belongs in Byzantium. Septentrionalis 18:50, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tenedos

Thank you for informing me. I have seen the talk page; and I cannot say that it adds much to the situation. My position is based on the fact that, while I am a literate Anglophone, I had never seen Bozcaada until I first saw the page; Tenedos is what I have always seen it called. I am not a stalwart of any national cause; ask Hectorian.

I did Google searches the first time this came up; many more English pages use Tenedos alone than Bozcaada alone, and the latter are often English-Turkish bilinguals, or the Turkish Ministry of Tourism (and even www.bozcaada.com feels it necessary to include Tenedos - not Τενεδος, but Tenedos - as a translation into Western languages). The Ministry has a right to do what it likes, but it does not establish English usage, which is my only concern here. The same situation, slightly less marked, applies to Imbros. Septentrionalis 21:38, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

As for Kertenkebelek's paragraph: It is neither neutral nor sourced; nor have any of the questions put to it on the talk page been answered. Septentrionalis 21:47, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

I can appreciate sound motives for not putting this discussion on the article talk page; but it will be a while before I get back to you. I agree that the present text is not perfect; neither would a rant in the other direction be perfect. Septentrionalis 23:15, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

There is a source; a piece on the "Istanbul massacre of 1955". I agree that it is tendentious. I forget at the moment whether it's in External links or just on talk; but faute de mieux it has had to do. Signing off for now, Septentrionalis 23:28, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

These are the sources for the article, such as they are. The anti-Turkish polemic is the source for several of the statements you question. I have no idea where the statement about Imbrian wines came from. I thank you for restraint; an edit war between you and Hectorian would not be helpful to anything. Since they are sourced, if imperfectly, I don't think Jimbo's counsel applies.

Since I am going to be archiving my talk page fairly soon, I have set up a page User:Pmanderson/Imbros. This discussion can be conducted there. I will be watching it; but if I don't reply for a few days, I may have missed the edit.Septentrionalis 15:08, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

As you can tell, I firmly disagree. Replacing them, and adding more sources, would be a different matter. Sources don't have to be neutral; the article does. Septentrionalis 19:00, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

What you propose first requires establishing that there is a dispute. If there is a source asserting that Imbros was mostly Turkish, for example, find it. If not, we have a true statement which could be better sourced. Septentrionalis 19:11, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

I cannot speak for you; but my edits have been explained by their summaries. Please don't mention my user subpage; it's not for everybody. Septentrionalis 19:21, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

I tried to undo Kertenkebelek's vandalism by hand, and found it impractical; for one thing, he did additional random collateral damage himself. Please start from where I left it; your edits were much less extensive than his, and I disagree with some of them anyway.

I don't know what Hectorian is thinking of; he may be the anon, and believe you a sockpuppet of K, for all I know. I certainly am not him; I can write English - and to him I am an enemy of the Greeks, undermining their mystic continuity (see Talk:Greeks).

Regards. Septentrionalis 15:46, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Username

You're the second person, in quite a long time, to say that; in any case, it's probably too late to change it now. Septentrionalis 21:55, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Khoikhoi

It was probably a sock of one of the Persian or Turkish editors who always appear to be conflicting with him. In some of the Persian related talk pages there is always talk of a Zionist conspiracy to turn WP into a Zionist propaganda machine. Khoikhoi's alerted me to the existence of off-site Persian forums where there seem to be quite a few people who are angry with him.Blnguyen | rant-line 03:19, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

I don't think I can do anything as it seems to be deadlocked and the result seems to reflect community attitude. As for the rights and wrongs, we seem to use North Korea rather than Democratic People's Republic of Korea and Ho Chi Minh City instead of Thanh Pho Ho Chi Minh, so it seems that the more English and common names are used rather than full technical names not in English. Regards, Blnguyen | rant-line 03:40, 30 June 2006 (UTC).

[edit] Greco-Turkish War (1919-1922)

Greco-Turkish War (1919-1922) sayfasının geçmişine göz atmanızı rica ediyorum, yunanlılar sürekli olarak yanlı yazılarında ısrar etmekteler. Tüm kaynaklarımı sunmuş ve mümkün olduğunca (fazlaca) tarafsız olarak gerçekleri ortaya koymuş olmama rağmen sayfa sürekli saldırıya uğruyor, bir yerden sonra tek başıma yapabileceğim fazla birşey de kalmıyor. Zaman ayırıp yunanlıların ve destekçilerinin yanlı yazısının sayfadan kaldırılmasında yardımcı olabilirseniz çok sevinirim. Kertenkelebek^Ⓣ 10:15, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Gökçeada-Bozcaada

Gökçeada-Bozcaada hakkında gelecekte yapılacak olan oylamalarda size yardımcı olmak isterim. Kolay gelsin iyi çalışmalar.--Absar 11:38, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

I reverted the change u made to mention 1st the name in turkish and then in english (which is also the greek name). btw, i really cannot understand why some users continue to make edits like 'Imbros and Tenedos were the ancient greek names or the names used in ancient times'... the truth is that the names are greek (no matter ancient or modern, since we still use them) and the islands were called as such for a lot longer than 'ancient times'... at least until 1453... I have got involved recently in naming issues concerning greek and turkish placenames, but it seems that it is hard to find a solution (by blaiming both sides). but i am not giving up my hopes... Regards --Hectorian 17:53, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] help me

{{helpme}} Can any online administrator help me?

State the nature of your medical emergency. Sasquatch t|c 04:30, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

Go to WP:RFCU and fill out the appropriate forms. Cheers. Sasquatch t|c 04:58, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

Errr... well... does the revert matter that much to you? If you think there is a sockpuppet and that it's seriously detrimental, then file an RFCU... I really can't tell to tell the truth. Sasquatch t|c 05:07, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] RE: Istanbul

I am going to contribute in so far as I can. By the way, I think both articles must be joined. Doluca 10:56, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Alert

Take a look at this [3], it will be nice if you can vote

[edit] Gelmek

Oy![1]

[edit] List of persecuted Turkish writers

The article wasn't deleted, as you may or may not have heard elsewhere, so I'm canvassing opinions for what to rename it to/merge it to on its relevant talk page. All reasonable suggestions will be entertained. BigHaz 10:49, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Mutlu Yıllar

Onlar da Yeniyıl tatili ister
^{Yeniyılınız kutlu olsun}
Must ^TC 15:30, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Correct spelling

Please correct the spelling error in the name of the picture...Istambul —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Mivodrums (talk • contribs) 05:29, 31 March 2007 (UTC).

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