Talk:Counter-Strike maps

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This article was nominated for deletion on 10 July 2006. The result of the discussion was no consensus.

has anyone here tryed the new surf maps??

Contents 1 This article is too bloated and crufty 2 fy_pool_day 3 Merge 4 break maps 5 Rats maps 6 Authors of maps 7 Now we have to write an enormous article here 8 Counter-Strike related Links 9 Old official maps 10 cs_bank 11 Contradiction and double statements

[edit] This article is too bloated and crufty

Theres a heck of a lot of chaff in this article, and I'm thinking of getting rid of it, or at least splitting them off. Here are my ideas:

• Keep this page about official counterstrike mapping styles. That is, the current de and cs style maps. Along with mentioning as (which I am sure valve will add back to source) and a section on the obsolete es maps.
• Have a comprehensive list of all maps in the current 1.6 and source versions of CS.
• Have a list of notable other maps officially included with previous versions of CS. ie de_jeeapthon2k, cs_docks, cs_siege, de_railroad and maybe some others.
• Split off custom CS styles into a separate linked article, with some introduction on this page. The most popular 2 custom styles are probably fy and aim maps. ka, kz, pa and surf maps really do not deserve a mention in this article. Seriously, jumping maps in a CS maps article? Let's split that off into a separate article.
• Even after that, theres still a lot of guff left over. We shouldn't be mentioning any quakenet IRC channels here, or community mappers either. That sort of stuff would be for a CS specific wiki, where we can write about toilet bombing tactics in jeepathon for example.

I have never contributed to this article, and I understand there may be hostility about a newcomer trying to tell everyone else what to do. But as a cs fan for many years (started at beta 6.6ish, sure there are people here playing longer) and wikipedian, I think these points will improve this article and make it more encyclopedic. - Hahnchen 19:55, 6 September 2005 (UTC)

I think this article is getting worse by the week; it seems somebody adds a new custom category every week. This was an issue before, but now it's huge. I'm going to slap a cleanup tag on it for now, and when I get the chance, I'll move the custom types to a separate article, or remove the custom types altogether (except for the most important ones). --Varco 17:19, 9 June 2006 (UTC)

Done! (Finally) --Varco 01:38, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] fy_pool_day

Does anyone know where I get it for counter-strike:source, if not, than can someone please tell me what the dimensions of the map are? Tnx. mikey Have you tried fpsbanana.com ? --Andeee 21:11, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

Try find a server playing it, and join it, and the map will automatically download as long as you dont have the client cvar cl_downloadfilter set to none. If it is set it to all via this command, "cl_downloadfilter all".--ParalysedBeaver 19:13, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Merge

• Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/De dust

I believe that these articles have too much information to merged into a single or multiple articles. I don't support a merge, but I don't really think I have much of a choice. The maps should be at least divided into separate articles based on the types of maps. --Varco 07:02, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

The articles listed in the AfD (and perhaps some others) have got some problems. But AfD has little imprimatur on the final outcome of articles outside deletion. So please don't feel dismayed or forced, the best solution will be one that everyone is happy with. Or at least equally unhappy with. - brenneman ^{L} 07:06, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

There also needs to be addressing of the problems with this article before we think of merging anything into it. Citation, sources, and bias, for example. Proposals for other solutions (or "don't do it and here's why") are always welcome. - brenneman ^{L} 07:10, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

Don't Merge! I agree that it's going to be difficult to fit all of the CS maps into one page. The Counter-Strike_maps page is already exceedingly long. It MIGHT be possible to merge them into Counter-Strike defusal maps and Counter-Strike Hostage Rescue maps, etc, but I really don't see that it offers any additional bonus over keeping individual pages per map (i.e., look at the de_dust page - it only has two maps, and it's of a reasonable length - how long will it be when you add 10 more maps to it?). (also the editor of this and this) Will 15:22, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

Och, let's do look at de_dust. It has four images, which is at least two more than fair use will probably allow. It's "sourced" only in the sense that it has a section with external links as refernces, with no indication of which bits are actually cited. It's also got about 50% more external links than it needs. A great job has been done on making these articles consistant and looking good. That doesn't mean that there isn't still more work than can be done on making them focused and encyclopedic. Once that's done, the problems with the bulk of the merge will be considerable lessened. - brenneman ^{L} 15:43, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

Since the afd came up, those of us who are involved with the articles have improved them a lot already. We've removed excessive images on some of them, and added at least some citations to all of them (with more to come). The afd was really the kick that (at least I) needed to really get to work improving them, which I've been quite lazy about. I will also work on what you have mentioned here. --Varco 16:14, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

I personally already think that the Counter-Strike maps article is too long, and full of stupid maps that no one plays or has heard of. FY maps maybe. KA? PA? Surfing (Counter-Strike)?! Incidentally, you can find out how popular Valve mods are here, where you'll see GoldenEye: Source propping things up with 5 servers and the Kreedz Climbing (kz maps) not that far ahead of them with about 10. I spotted the article List of Counter-Strike maps as soon as it popped up, and that's an absolutely rubbish article. I have no idea why it contains both Official and Unofficial maps or what standard of inclusion it has, the size, complexity and balance sections are POV and incorrect (cs_siege is complex and balanced? cs_747_cz exists?) I would not support a merge, due to article size, and in part because I feel some of the maps are definitely notable on their own. However, I do have reservations about these articles as I voiced above and in Talk:De inferno. - Hahnchen 17:04, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

oppose merge. I just don't see the reason for merge, other than the perception that these are "cruft." If the articles need improvement, do it. But the suggested merge target is already quite long, and the division into separate articles by map is as natural as can be. — brighterorange (talk) 16:51, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

• Strong merge, though I wouldn't oppose it going to 2 articles or whatever to reduce overly long articles. These are individual maps in a computer game. --Rory096 05:05, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

Stop voting, please.

Having a bold couple of words, or the word "strong" in front doesn't do much, really, that a clearly presented arguement does not. Just a small rant on my part, because if we start acting like we're voting than some one will want to count votes... Anyway, back to our regularly schedualed programming. - brenneman ^{L} 14:08, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

Can we safely say there isn't a consensus to merge? It's been two weeks since anyone's said anything, and there seems to be the same sort of split that was in the deletion vote. --Varco 07:09, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

No. If we put all the Counter-Strike map pages into Counter-Strike, the article would be huge.

No merge. Same reason above.

[edit] break maps

like break floor were u have 2 brake a floor or sumthin 2 get 2 the enemy are commomly played maps

[edit] Rats maps

Jkagalbraith recently e-mailed me in response to my removal of Rats as a custom map type, but I'm replying here as it is of relevance to all involved with this article. His message, which is also on his user page, is as follows:

"I completely disagree with you removing Rats as a specific map type in CS. In the same way as there are KZ servers and Aim/Awp maps, there are many “Rats Only” servers on the net of which ours is one. Just because the map names have a de or cs prefix does not mean they are not a specific map type. Vehicle maps are included in the wiki and have no specific prefix as are “Misc” and as Rats maps are far more specific and MASSIVELY popular in Europe, particularly in the UK and Germany they deserve their place in the Wiki. The fact that our clan among several others I know of have been rats clans for in excess of 4 years only adds weight to the argument. I am reinstating the article edit. I would hope you would see the sense in not removing it."

My removal of Rats had nothing to do with prefix at all. We're currently trying to downsize the listing of custom map types in this article, as it is too long. The Counter-Strike maps have also recently come under attempted deletion because they are perceived as being too crufty. Additionally, the other custom types listed have more significant differences from the official map types than scale... most have different objectives, weapons, or some other feature. The objectives of the Rats series remains the same as the official types. I deleted them for these reasons. I feel you misinterpreted my edit comment. I retract the mention that they are not notable, as I was not aware of their popularity. --Varco 03:29, 10 June 2006 (UTC)

Much appreciated. I will endeavour as I find time over the coming weeks to add to the rats maps content and improve on the historical information. I have some of my clan members gathering information as we speak. The popularity of Rats maps was in the tens of thousands of users and I personally have logged over 50,000 seperate steam ids on our dedicated rats server alone, not to mention the numerous other ones out there. Regards. Alex. Jkagalbraith 01:14, 11 June 2006 (GMT)

[edit] Authors of maps

I personally find using internet handles to credit the creator is silly. I personally would credit dust and aztec to "Dave Johnston", and maps like cs_siege to "Justin 'N0TH1NG' DeJong". It looks more formal, to me. Your thoughts? -TonicBH 16:26, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

I took the author's name exactly as they are, straight off of the official map website [1]. I would not, however, object to using their real names. --Varco 07:02, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

Of course, aztec was actually made by "Chris 'n@rby' Auty", not "Dave Johnston". -Johnsto 07:17, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Now we have to write an enormous article here

Might as well delete a third of the wiki by deleting those maps, but I guess that debate is over now. I think it was agreed that the popular maps can have their own section in this article, so this needs to be done now. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Rake (talk • contribs) 09:27, 23 July 2006.

Absolutely. I was one of those who advocated deletion of all these maps. Those who fiercely have defended an article for each map, still need to show what content they are going to fill in, because currently it is a bit scarce... Medico80 08:18, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Counter-Strike related Links

I've provided links to various Counter-Strike related articles, including Counter-Strike weapons, Source, and culture, also editing those their links to said articles. Also, redirected "counter strike maps" to this article, for the common mistake of missing abbreviations and capitalization. SkePtiKaL 17:37, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Old official maps

There was some old official maps mostly de_vegas and cs_747 what about them?

I think adding a list of the official maps (past and present) should be done. From memory, official maps have included (with various versions which have changed the maps drastically, such as completly rearranging cs_office, or changing the light in cs_747 from completly dark to light.);

cs_mansion

cs_assault

cs_siege

cs_estate

cs_militia

cs_office

cs_backalley

cs_docks

cs_compound

cs_facility

cs_italy

cs_dam

cs_tire

cs_wpndepot

cs_prison

cs_desert

cs_alley

cs_ship

cs_station

cs_arabstreets

cs_havana

cs_747

de_foption

de_jeepathon2000

de_rotterdam

de_dust

de_dust2

de_iraq

de_fang

de_nuke

de_aztec

de_port

de_prodigy

de_cbble

de_train

de_contra

de_vegas

de_piransi

de_inferno

de_vertigo

de_tides

de_railroad

de_chateau

as_oilrig

as_arctic

as_forest

as_highrise

as_tundra

as_riverside

es_jail

es_frantic

es_trinity

--66.245.248.89 07:55, 29 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] cs_bank

cs_bank was an extremely popular map back in the beta versions, no mention of it here? 144.134.73.53 06:36, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Contradiction and double statements

"Glass Maps" are very uncommon in CS 1.6 but popular in CS:S. The levels are constructed of solely glass, allowing players to shoot enemies off of their platforms. These maps are common throughout both versions of Counter-Strike (1.6 and Source). Unique to the Source engine, due to its increased interaction with the player's environment, is the glass_ map. These maps are named as such because of the use of a large amount of glass paneling in the foundation of the map, typically the floor. It is also common for glass_ maps to be incorporated into maps of other variations, such as surf_, he_, and aim_.

First it says that glass-maps are uncommon, and then it says that they are common. AND THEN, it says the first thing again, but formulated different. --Ysangkok 16:35, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

I haven't played CS in years, but I don't remember any "glass maps" in the original (pre-CS:S) version. So I'm pretty sure the original statement is correct, unless there was a sudden fad for them after I quit. --Starwed 12:59, 29 January 2007 (UTC)

I just played CS 1.5 (pre steam) at an internet cafe tons of times with my buddies and uh, yeah, there was glass maps. Even before STEAM never mind before SOURCE. this DOES contradict itself and its true they are more popular in SOURCE, as if you play 1.6 on steam you will probably not ever find a glass map even though it exists, however I have found over a dozen servers playing a glass map on source within a week. So there you go. It does contradict and should be fixed! - - - Ryan