Talk:Conflict of laws
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Hi... just thought I should say that I'm kind of working round all sorts of international private law-related articles at the moment. My interest in it is that I've just sat my Honours exams in it. By contrast with other legal topics it doesn't seem to have had too much interest. I hope I'm not stepping on too many people's toes here. If someone could provide a North American input though, that might be helpful. Most of what I know concerns Scotland (my own lex domicilii and lex patriae!), England and the European dimension. --Killiedaft 22:32, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)
A good overview. I agree this is much undervalued area of the law, and poorly understood by many practitioners. I hope to contribute (carefully) to this page in due course. I am domiciled in Indonesia so I hope the perspective will help
We are always pleased to see new helpers — there is now a reasonable coverage of Conflict so your comments generally would be appreciated. David91 02:52, 25 November 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Material removed
"=Non-geographical conflict of laws== Certain states apply multiple systems of law in one geographical area. For example, Sharia and national law (for ex-pats) co-exist in several Gulf states where common law has influenced the commercial code; also in several Indian states customary laws of certain castes and religions are enforceable on group members. Courts in such states apply principles of private international law (appropriately modified) to resolve the conflict."
- This strikes me as controversial. In many states, there is a need to reach an accommodation between customary laws and modern municipal laws. This becomes more difficult where, as in Islamic countries, the religion may have the status of ordre public. I have not peviously encountered the idea that the relationship between the customary/religious laws and a secular system would be regulated by a Conflict system. The systems that I am familiar with have simply produced a statute regulating the relationship in line with contemporary culture rather than having a meta-system such as Conflict in place. I am also confused at the idea that one sovereign state might permit "ex-pats" (whoever they are?) to use their domilicary/habitual residence laws to regulate their own behaviour. Quite apart from the constitutional problems, this would seem to introduce major elements of uncertainty into the ordinary commercial dealings within that state. Is it supposed to apply to visitors from every other state? Thus, before letting this go live, I must ask you please to give some detailed explanation of how this works in the relevant countries and cite verifiable authority so that we can all reach a proper understanding of this material. Many thanks. David91 13:59, 2 April 2006 (UTC)
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- This is a well-known phenomena in PIL. There are: 1) territorial conflicts of laws in federal states (like in USA - interstate conflicts); 2) temporal conflicts (conflict between previous and succeeding legal act); 3)ethnic (personal) conflicts of laws (between muslim, christian laws). For example, we know very well that in Israel questions of marriage are left for rabbis. They are subject to judaism, and rabbis therefore couldn't marry muslim arabs or christians. The same is true about Saudi Arabia and Jordan, where marriages are made according to muslim law only. As for India, they have separate laws for Christian, Muslim and Hinduism marriages. Please also note that Joseph Story was touching that issue in his Commentaries on Conflict of Laws when he was discoursing on the differences between Christian civilised nations laws and others. While his "comments" are abusive for non-Christian nations, he meant this Muslim and Hinduist poligamy issues too. European scholars from multinational Switzerland(!!!), France (Arabs and French), Poland (don't have to tell) recognise these ethnic (personal) conflicts of laws and have respective dedicated passages in their textbooks. Ethnic (personal) conflicts happen not only in federal states (Switzerland), but also in unitarian states (France). Also in Early Medeival Europe during Franc Empire rule, individuals where adjudged according to their personal law, e.g. Roman was adjudicated by Roman law, and Barbarian - according to the law of his tribe, whether Gall, or Celt. See Franc truths texts. Vlad fedorov 09:05, 18 March 2007 (UTC)
I imgaine what is being referred to is the phenomenon of legal pluralism. I understand in some states the personal law applied (e.g. in matters of fmily law) can vary according to e.g. the religion of the person to whom it is applied. Like David91 I've not heard before of a direct comparison being made with private international law. In dualist states (i.e. states in whcih international law does not ipso facto form part of the muncipal law) those states may, to an extent, transform international law in to norms of domestic law (e.g. in the USA by allowing treaties to form part of US law but only so long as they do not conflict with the US Consititution) but I would not have described the rules that govern when this occured as a "conflict system". --Lucifer(sc) 14:24, 2 April 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Hello collegues
Hello guys,
I have noticed that we have:
- two large bias on common law system. Everything is taken from the common law POV.
- too small section dedicated to the COL/PIL history.
- too small section on European PIL and International conventions in PIL.
Anyway, it is nice to meet collegues in Wikipedia. :-) Vlad fedorov 08:53, 18 March 2007 (UTC)
