Talk:Communities using the Tridentine Mass
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I've restored the title: traditionalist Orders of Men. I think this list ought be divided just by male/female groups rather than their canonical form which would lead you to have separate headings for Institutes of Consecrated Life, Clerical Societies of Apostolic Life of Pontifical Right, &c., &c. Ih hope you agree. I've also added the Militia Templi back under "men" instead of under Lay Association of the Faithful as some of these female communities are also established as lay associations of the faithful and it would follow that they should go under that heading, too. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.235.230.57 (talk • contribs).
- There is an essential difference between Militia Christi and the other organizations mentioned. All the other associations of men include priests who say Mass in accordance with a pre-1973 edition of the Roman Missal. All the associations of women, even if some of them may not yet have been formally set up as religious institutes (and so are, juridically, still only associations of the faithful) are obviously intended to become religious institutes. Militia Christi is, in a way, comparable rather to associations like Una Voce. In short, it is not a traditionalist (religious) order for men. (Its status as a genuine order of chivalry would also be generally denied, since it was not established by a sovereign. But that question is of no relevance to this article.) Lima 09:10, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
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- Lima, it is not Militia Christi but Militia Templi so maybe you are confused. No doubt the Militia is not clerical and I believe their Constitutions forbid brothers from becoming priests ... and there are a lot of male religious communities in the Church which are not priestly such as the Alexians, the Little Brothers of the Good Shepherd, the Brothers of Charity, the Brothers of Our Lady of Mercy, the Congregation of Christian Brothers, Institute of the Brothers of the Christian Schools etc., etc. The Militia Templi is not a group like Una Voce at all: the brothers of the Militia Templi take three vows, follow a Rule, wear a habit and so on. Anyways, these groups of sisters, like the Oblates of Mary are private associations looking to become public associations. How do you know the same doesn't apply to the Militia Templi?
- Yes, I wrote the name wrong. Not my first such mistake and destined, I feel sure, not to be my last. The Militia Templi seems to me more like groups such as the Order of Saint Lazarus, rather than like the non-clerical religious institutes (of brothers) mentioned. In any case, it is clearly distinct from the clerical associations (of priests) mentioned in the article, and this distinction is surely worth noting. Lima 20:43, 4 February 2007 (UTC)
- Lima, it is not Militia Christi but Militia Templi so maybe you are confused. No doubt the Militia is not clerical and I believe their Constitutions forbid brothers from becoming priests ... and there are a lot of male religious communities in the Church which are not priestly such as the Alexians, the Little Brothers of the Good Shepherd, the Brothers of Charity, the Brothers of Our Lady of Mercy, the Congregation of Christian Brothers, Institute of the Brothers of the Christian Schools etc., etc. The Militia Templi is not a group like Una Voce at all: the brothers of the Militia Templi take three vows, follow a Rule, wear a habit and so on. Anyways, these groups of sisters, like the Oblates of Mary are private associations looking to become public associations. How do you know the same doesn't apply to the Militia Templi?
[edit] recent edits and suggested move
I removed the superiors, etc, from the page and the external links. Wikipedia is not a collection of links or a web directory. If an article exists for each society, institute, etc. then that's a perfectly fine place to include the superior and external link. I also made the list use list formating, to clean it up a bit, make the editing page smaller, and conform to the style guidelines.
On another subject, as this page is list, the title isn't very precise. I'd suggest moving to List of communities using the Tridentine Mass in communion with Rome, or something similar. Right now, there are schismatic and other groups using the Tridentine Mass that are not in communion with Rome and have no plans to seek communion, who would be covered by this title but are not included in the page. Gentgeen 23:54, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
- "in communion with Rome" is perhaps not sufficiently precise. SSPX claims not to be out of communion with Rome and can quote a declaration by - I don't immediately with certainty remember who, but it was probably Cardinal Castrillón - that communion exists, but it is not complete. What about "List of Church-approved communities that use the Tridentine Mass"? This too can be improved. Lima 05:19, 16 March 2007 (UTC)
