Talk:Calday Grange Grammar School

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Contents

[edit] Peter Dodd

One question: Peter Dodd was only acting headmaster (having been deputy) in 1978 and wasn't confirmed head until 1979 at the earliest (possibly 1980, though I am not sure about that). Certainly in September 1979 he was still acting. Shouldn't the list reflect that? What is wiki policy on such a thing? Its quite unusual to appoint a head from deputy (especially if they have spent essentially their whole career in the same school). Francis Davey 19:38, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Please be civil

Remember that this is a discussion page about the article Calday Grange Grammar School. Please keep the language civil and don't remove comments made by others. Prometheus-X303-04:57, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Letters for buildings

I went to this school for about seven years, and this wikipedia article is the first place I ever saw the different buildings referred to with letters. That the letters should be the main information, with the actual names in brackets, is jolly retarded indeed.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 212.240.81.165 (talk • contribs) 08:15, March 7, 2006 (UTC). - For all I know, some wikipedia editor has literally invented this information. It would certainly be of no use to anyone ever. Visitors to the school would find the building labeled by their names. Researchers would find that everyone they spoke to would know the buildings only by their names. When exactly would these letters even constitute information? On a map of the school given to first years? Please. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 212.240.81.165 (talk • contribs) 08:21, March 7, 2006 (UTC).

What the fuck are you talking about? EVERYONE at the school refers to the buildings by their respective letters! Examples:
  • "We have english in the E block today"
  • "We've been booked into D25 for todays lesson"
  • "I'm gonna go down to G18 to get a can of STFU for the person who used the phrase 'jolly retarded'
Get the idea?
This may be a practice that has changed over time. Certainly the building letters are relatively new. When I attended (1979-1986) buildings mostly had names, eg Maths in the Glasspool building, Chemistry in the New Teaching Block (NTB) or whatever. Obviously there's been quite a bit of new building, and some renaming. Perhaps contributors here could say when they attended and what system was used; also perhaps what buildings they knew. Incidently, when I was there, doors had letters, though only "door H" was well know, with some use of "door A". Francis Davey 10:38, 10 March 2006 (UTC)
Letters are used plenty in the room codes for sure, but it's never "I have tech in the D building", or "English classes are held in the G building." SOME of the letters are used alone in some circumstances, yeah, but not enough to warrant swear words, the word everyone in capitals, or the listing of the abbreviations as the primary names of the buildings. The E block is probably the only case where the letter would be understood on its own. (I attended until mid-2004 (I'm the original poster))
Time to be constructive. I propose changing the list to things like
  • The Art (A) building
or something like that. In any case, I think we can all agree that most buildings are not correctly referred to as things like "the A building", or "the W building", which is essentially what I take issue with in the article. Hopefully some ideas can now be contributed, as opposed to childish flaming. (O.P. again)
I am a current pupil at Calday and I can assure you that if I tell someone where I have a lesson I will say 'D25' or G4'. I might state 'oh yeah i'm over in glasspool' but I never say Glasspool 4. An old caldain of 86 might be well respected but come back to the school and you'll see it's changed greatly. Unfortunately Mr.Hall is head instead of Big Nige!
Those are room codes, not building names. It's an important difference.

Right the buildings are almost always referred to by letter i.e.(B-block, E-block, GS rooms etc.) I think the notion of referring to buildings by name went out of fashion WAAAAAYYY back into the past(no doubt when these people writing where present at the establishment) but currently after a definate spurt in the activities of school expansion this has been made redundant. move with the times and please don't get pretentious and intellectual about what you yourself remember from the school becasue im sure the school you may once of loved is partly if non-existent for varioous rather obvious reasons. thak you and please stop moaning about stuff you actually dont know anything about.

The W-block? The D-block? The G-block? You're still failing to make the distinction between a room name and a building name. I, the O.P., only left the school a few years ago (in the range of two or three), and while I was there I saw the place change more than it had before or has since. And I can safely say that it has had absolutely no effect on the way people refer to the existing buildings. What is different is that the new buildings are referred to differently. But it's a new practice, it's not universal, and it doesn't apply to most buildings.
Having said that, if you can think of a better way to word the Buildings section, please say something. Can it be done more accurately than "The Dodd building - Technology"? If so, contribute your ideas. Until then, please keep your insults to the playground. The amount of warnings on this page is starting to become embarrassing.82.27.48.57 15:58, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

Well..........The D-block/Tech. Block was never referred to in me time at the school as the Dodd building ever!!!!!!!!!!!!! I think we should try and make distinction betweeen recent departies who think they know what they are talking about and those of us who actually have a clue!!

[edit] Tom Whelligan-Fell

Should clarify. There are <10 hits on Google for his name. It seems like a vanity edit, so I'm removing him from notable alumni unless someone can prove otherwise. Attakmint 00:28, 27 February 2006 (UTC)

For that matter, same with Francisco Esteves - "francisco esteves" wirral returns <10 hits Attakmint 00:34, 27 February 2006 (UTC)

Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Calday_Grange_Grammar_School&oldid=41388613 (added May 2006)

-Just incase anyone is interested, both of them are ex-caldeans who are now in their first years at liverpool uni. As you can gather from the edits, both are wannabe liberal 'politicians'and as a result, think they're better than everyone else. Fransisco is currently campaigning to be president/chairman e.t.c of some organisation at Liverpool Uni, perhaps this would explain the vanity edit? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 88.109.251.24 (talk • contribs) 09:26, March 10, 2006 (UTC).

  • Francisco and Whellie-Fell both should be watched for their pure vanity edits

I think this type of vanity edit is disgraceful and insulting. i don know who these people are but i bet they have no friends. I just can't believe the cheek and insulance of these characters to deface the site in cinjunction with the oversized nature of their ego. If anyone actually knows these scoundrels tell them from me that they are not worthy of a place on this Schools page and never will be and that they should go back to their made up positions in whatever fantasy political movement they are part of.

I have it on good account that Thomas Whelligan-Fell is (Personal attack removed) and that Francisco is bald. Need I say more?

  • Ah mate!!!! thats proper bad talk there, lets stay nang and big up the crew.

[edit] Why?

Why was the last comment deleted? This is a DISCUSSION page, to DISCUSS things! If you didn't like what was said, then make yourself heard rather than cowardly deleting comments that you don't like! -Modulus86 19:09, 21 November 2005 (UTC)


Ha! Spectacular hypocracy, modulus86. You may remember me from the Calday Grange subpages I made in october last year (technical crew, and lesserly, CCF) In which you on more than one occasion deleted my and my friend's comments on talk pages. I see you're happy to get irate when others do it, but continue to do it yourself.-vwozone 22:23, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Nah, it's not quite the same. I just did that to piss you off. Modulus86 19:50, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

I agree Rachael Howey's 'Lucky 7' was the sickest thing that happened in 2004.

[edit] Ray Holmes

Hey, thanks for adding Ray Holmes back onto the page, he was already on it until some canadian (Personal attack removed) deleted it. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 88.104.12.252 (talk • contribs) 16:11, November 27, 2005 (UTC).

[edit] Paton Fields

Can whoever noted about the Paton house being abandoned because Paton would be remembered through the Paton Fields tell me where they are??? A current Calday pupil who hasn't a clue where the Paton fields are lol

Opposite Caldy Rugby club, the other side of the houses. I've no idea if they are still in use. If you look at Prothero's book Calday owned even more land way back, but sold it off. We used to get a bus down to the Rugby club, change in the changing rooms and then walk across the road, through a snicket and onto the fields. Better players (I think) stayed and played on the club's fields. Boys with bus passes found it easier to get back than me (I lived in West Kirby so had to walk). I was there 1979-1986. Francis Davey 20:28, 21 March 2006 (UTC)


ohhh yeah. Thanks. Not sure if they're ever called that but they're still in use for most things seeing as the school sold off half of the fields opposite the school itself. Cheers --81.79.159.6 00:28, 22 March 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Mr. Sagar

Regardless of how true the story is there is no need in a display of this fact. Wikipedia isn't a tabloid newspaper Jimmy C 23:03, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

There is every need for a display of this fact. 88.110.66.41 13:37, 7 May 2006 (UTC)

What reason is there for that fact to be displayed? Jimmy C 22:28, 7 May 2006 (UTC)

Hey fellow contributors! Quick note: If this can't be resolved, feel free to contact an admin. They can help determine what is appropriate. PrometheusX303 00:24, 8 May 2006 (UTC)

-The article is about the school and its history, and Sagar is part of that history. Twix Of Doom 15:27, 9 May 2006 (UTC)

Hirings and firings of staff are not of themselves encyclopaedic - this inclusion would need to show notability. Also, can only be included if supported by a citation, otherwise it appears like a random libel. --88.108.245.140 17:11, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

  • ********************************************************************************** Although it currently lacks a citation, It should still be included until one is found on the basis that anyone who was there knows it to be true... and it is true.
  • If anyone knows how to find information on people ************************** maybe they could find a reference to Peter Sagar to ensure this remains included.
Are there any media reports on this? These could be cited. If not, I would suggest leaving this out until one can be found, as there is no way to verify the claim. PrometheusX303 13:45, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

Ok, but is there really any need to verify something that is known by thousands of people to be true?

In an encyclopedia article: yes. Remember that Wikipedia is read by people all over the world, not just the thousands who "know the truth". If you would like, I will contact an adminiatrator to get an opinion on the matter. PrometheusX303 22:02, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
I know for a fact that at the time it was featured in the local news (either the Wirral Globe or the Hoylake and West Kirby news) but i don't think there's any way of getting that onto the internet, even if someone did have a cutting of the article. Not that this point holds much water, everyone in the school knows about it. Modulus86 17:40, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
I think that a citation for that article would do for now. Can you do that much? PrometheusX303 22:02, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
Right I've had to take this whole section out per policy at Wikipedia:Biographies_of_living_persons#Safe_Harbor, Wikipedia:Libel and jimbos comments here [[1]] I've also had to take the unfortunate step of removing certain comments on this talk page as well in line with these policies. If a reliable source can be provided to back up these allegations then by all means the information can go back in the article but until then it must stay out Ydam 14:27, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
Sounds reasonable to me. This article is on my watchlist. I will remove any futher references of this nature if re-added without a reputable source. PrometheusX303 14:54, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
Thanks, for a moment then I thought that my harshly sounded warning would just annoy everyone. Wikipedia takes a hard line on unsourced allegations about living people like this (partly because it gets them in to all sorts of legal troubles) and it's good to know that theres fellow editors out there that are supportive of actions like this Ydam 14:59, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

Nice to see someone with some sense and a legal brain to realise that you can't go publicising libellious accusations without leaving wikipedia open to court action. I'll watch out for edits also. Jimmy C 17:54, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

Duh, what's the point in removing 'certain comments' when you can simply look in the edit history to see what has been said?—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 88.110.84.125 (talk • contribs) 20:22, May 22, 2006 (UTC).

  1. The content had to be removed per policy at Wikipedia:Biographies_of_living_persons#Safe_Harbor "Unsourced or poorly sourced negative material about living persons should be removed immediately from both the article and the talk page."
  2. Attempting to hack in to my account like that is a futile venture and doesn't exactly help your case. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Ydam (talk • contribs) 06:00, May 23, 2006 (UTC).

I'll repeat the question: What's the point in doing that when you can just look in the edit history and see what was said? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 88.111.111.40 (talk • contribs) 06:52, May 23, 2006.

Because whether or not it was said is not the point. Whether or not it was published is. PrometheusX303 13:01, 23 May 2006 (UTC)
  • It's still published though. In the edit history.88.110.52.185 13:43, 23 May 2006 (UTC)
    • The crux of the reasoning is legal. A court of law would view would view it differently than if it were published on the main page than if it was in the archives. If you have any further questions on the policy you might want to try enquiring over at the talk page of WP:LIVING. I'm sure there are people over there more qualified and experianced in these matters that can provide you with more satisfing answers. Ydam 14:28, 23 May 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Look in the History!

Well since someone has taken it upon themselves to try and censor everything in this talk page, i'd just like to point out to those that are interested that they can look in the history to see what's been said! 88.110.229.186 14:52, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Actually, this page is hardly censored at all. The Mr. Sagar issue, however, is as yet unsubstantiated and could land Wikipedia in legal trouble, as discussed above.
Yes, one can always search the history of Wikipedia's pages to see what was said. It's not a secret, it's an integral part of Wikis. PrometheusX303 19:48, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Weatherman

A link for a former BBC weatherman (see diff link) has been changed from a redlink to that of Michael Fish. Can any evidence be given that supports that Michael Fish should be the name on the list and not David Lee? Thanks. Cowman109Talk 23:07, 10 June 2006 (UTC)

I have no idea one way or another. As I said (well, implied) in the edit summary of my first revert, I reverted the anon because his first edit to the article was simple vandalism, and his edit patterns fit the profile of a vandal to a T. The edit summaries he used afterwards did nothing to dispel that suspicion.
If I reverted a legitimate edit, I do apologize; every sign pointed to the edit being malicious. --Ashenai 23:17, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
Yes, I reverted the same IP for the exact same reason. The edit history made the edit questionable. Cowman109Talk 23:19, 10 June 2006 (UTC)

I can tell you categorically that Michael Fish did not attend CALDAY GRANGE GRAMMAR SCHOOL Jimmy C 19:04, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

Don't tell me the above poster is, in fact, Jim Corrigan?

[edit] Buildings

I've just starting cleaning up the Buildings section to correct the name of the drama studio [correctly listing it as part of the art block]. Counselling is listed for the E Block (Is that still the Wirral Able Children's Centre, by the way? Would be useful to note, if so), but AFAIK, is only a Wednesday afternoon activity. If we're including such things as "subjects", would it be appropriate to add Music Technology to the Dodd block (For those who haven't noticed, there's now a music tech room in the old boys' toilets on the top floor of Dodd. No, I hadn't noticed it before the end of last term either =\) and the quiet study room/infamous W5 corridor to Walker (assuming that nothing's shifted around over Summer)? Any info regarding whether we're a Languages College yet would be useful too, since the school site's been defaced and resultantly purged Motz 19:52, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Geography of the school

This article is either superfluous to the aim of this article to inform or needs reforming in terms of a neutral point of view. To describe the area as 'picturesque' is notably far from neutral.


Glad to see someone else apart from me has picked up on thus. The grammatical inaccuracies in the article are notable as well! Jimmy C 18:35, 10 October 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Encyclopaedic nature of list of Governors + NPOV re: Achievements

Is the list of current Governors really encyclopaedic or necessary? Anyone who needs to know can access that information through the school - it just breaks up the readability and without any context [i.e. Who these people are, which certainly isn't encyclopaedic], it adds little interest. Also, does the Achievement section conform to NPOV ['excel' isn't very neutral] or is it indeed of any encyclopaedic relevance? Motz 16:42, 6 December 2006 (UTC)


Anyone wanting to find out about the governors can do so via the school's website, totally unnecessary information.......

ITS OK GUYS IVE DELETED THE INFORMATION WHICH YOU FOUND TO BE OF QUESTIONABLE RELEVANCE :))) I feel sorry for the person who put the effort into contributing this item, so I would like to offer the following advice in appeasement; get a hobby.

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