Talk:Cabinet of Canada

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Canada, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to articles on Canada on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article attached to this page, or visit the project member page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.
A	This article has been rated as A-Class on the quality scale.
High	This article has been rated as high-importance on the importance scale.
	This article is part of the Government of Canada WikiProject, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to the Government of Canada on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, you should visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.

"A cabinet shuffle occurred on July 20, 2004."

Is 'cabinet shuffle' the right term for the reassignments in a new Parliament? Especially as this is now a minority? I'm not completely certain of the terminology, but I wanted to raise the question. Radagast 17:23, Jul 20, 2004 (UTC)

-- Sorry for the rather delayed response. Yes it is a shuffle because it is the same ministry. -- Jord 01:22, 7 Nov, 2004 (GMT)

Contents 1 Jay Hill 2 Names of ministries 3 Ministers of State 4 Status of Department of Social Development 5 Right Wing cabinet 6 Ongoing Saga of Social Development 7 Cabinet now in the Gazette 8 Titles of Senators

[edit] Jay Hill

Should he be included on this page at all? He is neither a member of the cabinet nor of the ministry, the fact that his is a privy councillor is irrelevant as Martin's whip and parliamentary secretaries were such but were not included on this page (and rightfully so). Moreover, there is one privy councillor (Garth Turner) in the government caucus who has no formal role, as well as countless PCs in opposition. - Jord 00:40, 8 February 2006 (UTC)

Where should the other government roles go then? The role of the government whip and the strong tradition of party MPs voting in line with the decisions of the PM and cabinet doesn't seem to be represented. I made a stub page Chief Government Whip, Canada. There is also an inconsistency since the Official Opposition Shadow Cabinet (Canada) page lists the opposition whip. Rakerman 16:32, 12 February 2006 (UTC)

There is not an inconsitency, sometimes the whip is in the cabinet and sometimes not. Mauril Belanger recently served as whip while in cabinet. That said, the whip is almost always in the opposition shadow cabinet. In terms of where to put the whip, perhaps a section on the 39th Canadian parliament page for the officers of each party would be appropriate. - Jord 17:37, 12 February 2006 (UTC)

Actually, Belanger was never in Cabinet while whip. While he may well have been sworn in as a Privy Councillor, as I believe also happened with his successor Karen Redman, he was not sworn into Cabinet until after the 2004 election, when Ms. Redman took over his duties as whip.

Untrue: "The Chief Government Whip will join Cabinet as Deputy Leader of the Government in the House of Commons, helping to ensure the representation of parliamentary concerns in government decision-making." [1] - Jord 20:17, 12 February 2006 (UTC)

I stand corrected. I do believe, however, that this was the only time the whip has served in Cabinet (unless the role of whip was given to a Minister with an actual portfolio).

You may be right federally, however it has happened quite often provincially, particularly in Ontario. That said, what remains is that the whip does not belong on this page. - Jord 02:24, 13 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Names of ministries

Please note that just as when Paul Martin took office, Stephen Harper realigned and renamed some of the ministries; please use the correct and official NEW names. See these links to the PMO site for the correct names: List of Ministers, Backgrounder on departmental changes - Jord 20:10, 8 February 2006 (UTC)

We've stuck with legal names in the past, which are defined by legislation, not Prime Ministerial whims. The "Department of Human Resources and Social Development" quite literally does not exist until the Department of Human Resources and Skills Development Act and the Department of Social Development Act are repealed. The Tom 02:23, 9 February 2006 (UTC)

That is fine Tom, and I did not change that but "Canadian Heritage and Status of Women" and "Minister of ACOA" etc should be what we go with here. We are not talking about names of departments, we are talking about names of ministers. It is worth noting that there is no Department of International Trade but we have a Minister of International Trade. Also, I am quite sure that Anne McLellan was never listed here is as Solictor General but instead as Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness, this is depsite the fact that she was sworn in as Solicitor General [2] and that the Department of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness did not exist until March 23, 2005 [3] - Jord 14:58, 9 February 2006 (UTC)

It should also be noted that under the provisions of the Public Service Rearrangement and Transfer of Duties Act, the Cabinet can essentially restructure things however they want. This is how the Martin government operated a Department of International Trade, despite the fact the the acts splitting DFAIT were never adopted. On February 6, Harper's government issued an OiC that "pursuant to paragraph 2(b) of that Act, amalgamates and combines the Department of Social Development and the Department of Human Resources and Skills Development under the Minister of Human Resources and Skills Development to be styled Minister of Human Resources and Social Development and under the Deputy Minister of Human Resources and Skills Development to be styled Deputy Minister of Human Resources and Social Development." [4] While, legally, there is no Department of Human Resources and Social Development, there is also no longer a Department of Social Development. The listing and related articles should be updated. On an unrelated note, Jord raises an excellent point with respect to the SolGen, and the article on the post of SolGen should probably be updated to reflect it didn't in fact dissappear until last year.

[edit] Ministers of State

I believe the section concerning Minister of the Crown vs. Ministers of State needs to be revamped and reworked. Ministers of State are not necessarily junior ministers. They are essentially a Minister whose responsibilities do not correspond to a department. The current Ministry has at least four ministers of State (some of whom also hold proper Ministerial portfolio). The current Ministers of State are Verner, Clement, Emerson and Chong, and there may very well be others.

[edit] Status of Department of Social Development

In the order in council here [5], it is shown that there is no Minister of Social Development, that Diane Finley is Minister of Human Resources and Skills Development styled as Minister of Human Resources and Social Development with all of the powers of minister of Social Development delegated to her without her actually being minister. - Jord 16:43, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

That is 100% correct. While there does legally remain a Department of Social Development, it is nothing but an empty shell. It has no Minister, no Deputy Minister, nor any administration, all of this having been transferred to HRSD.

[edit] Right Wing cabinet

Just a comment. Harper's cabinet is (politically) right-wing, yet has anyone noticed the number of Ministers who are left-handed? GoodDay 23:28, 13 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Ongoing Saga of Social Development

I have again removed it from the list. My reasons are twofold. First, despite the fact that the Department of Social Development Act remains in force, there is no Minister of Social Development. The Act establishes the department and bestows authority for that department on the Minister of Social Development. However, the Public Service Rearrangement and Transfer of Duties Act allows the Governor in Council to transfer that responsibility to any other Minister. Harper's government did that on February 6, effectively eliminating the position. This power allows the Governor in Council to act notwithstanding any Act presently in force. This appears to be somewhat difficult for some to understand, but it is a fact. Secondly, even if you remain unable to grasp my first point, the list in the article is of the current Cabinet. Not current departments, not portfolios -- the current cabinet. Whether the portfolio is vacant or does not exist, the fact remains that the current Cabinet does not have one, and it therefore does not belong in this list.

[edit] Cabinet now in the Gazette

FYI - the official titles of ministers (verses what they are styled as) is now available as the cabinet is in the Gazette [6] - Jord 15:27, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Titles of Senators

I added "Senator" to the names of Senators. Im not sure if Hon. Senator John Doe or if Senator the Hon. John Doe is correct, I've seen it both ways. Keeperoftheseal 22:21, 29 March 2006 (UTC)

A Senator who is not a privy councillor is know as "Hon. John Doe, Senator", one that is is known as "Senator the Hon. John Doe, P.C."... that said, you shouldn't include Senator on the table unless you are going to include the MP post nominals as well which I think makes it look cluttered. - Jord 22:30, 29 March 2006 (UTC)

I just did it to distingish which Senators were in cabinet, however, since the layout is awkward to say the least, ill take them out (if it hasnt been dont) - Keeperoftheseal 02:59, 30 March 2006 (UTC)