Talk:Brooklyn Bridge

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Contents

[edit] Cold War Bunker / Copyrighting

This is my first time editing a Wikipedia article, so I don't know how to do it all. The original section took copyrigted parts of an article from CNN and used them directly without attribution. I don't know how to mark it as a copyright violation or how to credit it properly. I added the link to the article, but beyond that, I cannot add one of those "this section needs to be cleaned up" banners. Can anyone help? (Feel free to delete this discussion when this issue is resolved).


[edit] Suspension Bridge vs. Combination Suspension and Cable-Stay Bridge?

While many people mistakenly refer to both types of bridges as suspension bridges, cable-stayed bridges and suspension bridges are constructed very differently. As far as I can tell, the Brooklyn Bridge uses both approaches.

Since most of the sites that I can find on the bridge don't bother to get into the technical details, I'm having a hard time finding out the details of the cable stays. If they are there simply as a redundant safety measure, I don't really have a problem simply calling the bridge a "suspension bridge." If they are an integral part of the bridge nessecary to support it, I think that we should explain that the bridge is a composite of these two designs.

Does anyone know more about the cable stays? Skylark 23:51, 4 August 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Cost?

Article lists the bridge was built at a price of $18 million. Can anyone verify whether this was 19th century dollars or inflation-adjusted 2005 dollars? I have a hard time believing *anything* could cost millions of dollars back then. -Kasreyn

I'm moving this here unless someone can provide a citation for it, or until I can verify that it's false.

"One source, possibly apocryphal, claims that the bridge's architect became disabled and communicated in code to give instructions on the bridge's completion." Vicki Rosenzweig

Nothing apocryphal about it at all, quite a wonderful, albeit tragic, story. The bridge was designed by Augustus Roebling. His son, Washington succeeded him, but was stricken with caisson disease (bends, due to working in compressed air with the sand hogs) and was unable to talk or move. His wife, Emily Warren Roebling, trained herself in engineering so she could communicate his wishes to the builders. Roebling was unable to leave his home and watched the construction via binoculars. Not sure about the code, but he was rendered speechless by the disease. Ortolan88
Yes, I thought that fact was pretty well known. here's one reference http://www.scc.rutgers.edu/njwomenshistory/period_3/emilyroebling.htm David dePaoli

[edit] John A Roebling Suspension Bridge

This is the only place I can find which equates the Brooklyn Bridge and the John A. Roebling Suspension Bridge, which I thought was in Cincinnati. Can you tell me a source for the statement: "(The Brooklyn Bridge) was renamed the John A Roebling Suspension Bridge in July 1983."?

This question is prompted by my intention to write an article about the bridge in Cincinnati.

Thanks,

Rdikeman 18:49, Apr 6, 2004 (UTC)


It's false. It would never have happened in New York, since 2.5 million people in Brooklyn would be up in arms. I think whoever wrote that is confusing it with this [1]. -- Decumanus | Talk 18:54, 6 Apr 2004 (UTC)

anonymous may 1 2004

Some years ago I read several books about the brooklyn bridge and believe one remark in the article is not quite right.

It is correct to say that Washington Roebling added the diagonal stays. He then claimed that even if all four suspension cables were to fail the bridge would still not fall, though it might sag in the middle. However, it can not be said that, "Roebling solved the problem that collapsed the

Tacoma Narrows Bridge (in 1940)
by designing a bridge truss system that was six times as strong as he thought it needed to be".

That implies that without the stays the bridge would be in danger. Engineers believe that they are unnecessary,though they are such an identifiyng feature of the bridge. Later bridges did not incorporate them into the design.

It is ironic that a few years ago one of those stays snapped and killed a tourist walking on the bridge.

Also I believe that the comment about the bridge being 'six times as strong as it needed to be' was made by John Roebling to his son during the original design and had nothing to do with the diagonal stays.

Added oct 1, 2005. A BBC feature, "The Brooklyn Bridge" (belonging to "Seven Wonders of the Industrial World" by Deborah Cadbury, 2003) mentions the 'six times stronger as needed'-fact in the following context. The construction board decided not to order the wires/cables from Roebling's own cable factory. Another supplier in Brooklyn was granted the order. W. Roeblin considered this supplier as a man of ill reputation an not reliable. Later on wire samples of very poor quality were discovered, when first cables had already been deployed. Decision to carry on was taken on the grounds that, according to J. Roeblin's calculations, the strength of the cables was initially planned '6 times as high as needed'. Thus the partial defects should be more than compensated.

[edit] History of Brooklyn El connections

This is an offshoot of User:SPUI/NYC Subway timeline to figure out the history of the Brooklyn side of the bridge and its connections to BRT elevated lines.

In 1904, the bridge connections were in place. The Fulton Street Line went to Fulton Ferry, with a stub end branching south of Sands Street end ending at the Main Street-Prospect Street intersection. The Myrtle Avenue Line had a connection under the bridge along High Street to the Fulton Street Line, with the merges away from the river. A station was on this connection just west of the bridge; the bridge station was at High and Sands Streets. After that connection, the Myrtle Avenue Line continued along Adams Street, merging with the old Main Line at York Street towards Fulton Ferry. An alternate route (maybe the other direction) went over Sands and Washington Streets. The former had a station on the old Main Line at Washington and York Streets (just before the latter merged); the latter on Washington Street just north of Sands Street. By 1914, the old Main Line was gone; the configuration at the end of the Myrtle Avenue Line is unclear.

  • September 24, 1883: The New York and Brooklyn Bridge Railway starts operations. [NYT 9-25-1883]
  • May 13, 1885: The old Main Line opens from York & Washington to Gates Avenue. [NYT 5-14-1885]
  • November 11, 1885: The old Main Line opens from York & Washington to Fulton Ferry. "At the same time the promenade connecting the York and Washington streets station with the bridge was thrown open to the public." [NYT 11-12-1885]
  • December 14, 1885: A new (?) pedestrian connection between the Brooklyn Bridge station and Sands & Washington station opens. [NYT 12-15-1885]
  • April 10, 1888: The Union Elevated Railroad (Myrtle Avenue Line) opens from City Hall (Adams Street) to the old Main Line. [NYT 4-10-1888]
  • December 24, 1891: The State Board of Railroad Commissioners approves the application of the Brooklyn Elevated Railroad to remove the old Main Line along Park and Grand Avenues, due to the merger with the parallel Union Elevated. [NYT 12-25-1891]
  • September 29, 1895: The new Brooklyn terminal on the Brooklyn Bridge opens. Myrtle Avenue Line trains are no longer run to the "old station". "All passengers who use the elevated railroad in upper Myrtle Avenue, will have to change cars, as the Fulton Ferry trains will not connect with the bridge, as formerly." The new station on the Myrtle Avenue Line is at High Street and Washington Street, above the bridge. The Fulton Street Line "enters by way of Fulton Street, and a railroad platform, directly above and in the middle of the two bridge platforms, conducts their passengers to the bridge cars." [NYT 9-29-1895] The old entrance to the bridge terminal was on Sands Street. [NYT 10-1-1895] The new terminal was at High Street. [NYT 9-30-1895]
  • June 28, 1898: The connection between the Myrtle Avenue Line and the Brooklyn Bridge opens. [NYT 6-29-1898]

[edit] With opens?

The bridge is featured in SimCity 3000 as the bridge but with opens, and in SimCity 4: Rush Hour as the "Medium Suspension" bridge type for avenues and highways.'

With opens - need a SimCity 3000 expert for this. Needs correction. Leonard G. 01:35, 23 Jun 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Span?

The span of the bridge has been changed a few times in the article, but according to Google, all of them are wrong and the real span is 1,595 ft. However I don't want to change this because there may be different measurement bases for the span (eg. span across the river, total length of roadway, etc etc). [[2]] Richard W.M. Jones 18:34, 22 August 2005 (UTC)

But the article also says 1,595 feet. Perhaps you are mistaking that number with the total length. -- Samuel Wantman 22:04, 22 August 2005 (UTC)
Yes,I am confused. But I'm trying to fact check this change: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Brooklyn_Bridge&diff=21577305&oldid=21490000 Richard W.M. Jones 09:03, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

[edit] My opinion.

I don't think the guy who jumped off the Brooklyn Bridge show be merged with the Brooklyn Bridge article, rather stay on its own. Spawn Man 07:20, 12 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Sunrise image poll

Sunrise December 20, 2005, first day of the Transit strike
Sunrise December 20, 2005, first day of the Transit strike

Please vote: Keep or Drop patsw 02:03, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

  • Drop. The image quality is too poor for it to be useful. Postdlf 02:07, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
    • Though I think a poll is premature, considering how there hasn't been any discussion—what's the reason for keeping the image? Postdlf 02:13, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
  • Drop. Irregardless of image quality, this is an unsourced (did you take it, where did it come from?), copyrighted image that shouldn't be in the article, yet alone the file loaded onto Wikipedia. --Aude 02:20, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
    According to the image info:
    The copyright holder has irrevocably released all rights to it, allowing it to be freely reproduced, distributed, transmitted, used, modified, built upon, or otherwise exploited in any way by anyone for any purpose, commercial or non-commercial, with or without attribution of the author.
    In other words, it's my image; I have decided to relase all rights. The reason for keeping the image is that it is what one sees as they emerge from the stairway onto the bridge as the sun rises. As it was deleted without discussion. I could have reverted it without discussion. I invite Postdlf to take a better photo. patsw 05:16, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
  • Comment - The tower is obscured by a street light. I think the bridge should be more prominently featured in the image for it to be in the article. It would be better off in the commons category Category:Brooklyn_Bridge. Bergsten 10:26, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] "Edit" link for sections

I restored the "edit" links for individual sections of article back in place. note, the differnce can only be seen when looking at the article itself, not from the compare selected versions or diff. Shlomke 13:40, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

JFTR: The issues with the ugly/incomplete/technically dubious (pick one or more) infobox made it to Village pump (tech), my talk page, and now also to infoboxes considered harmful below WP:LEAD. -- Omniplex 19:52, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] "I've got a bridge I'd like to sell"

What about the common reference in culture to an immigrant, or other newcomer to NYC, "buying" shares in the Bridge from a huckster?

It's mentioned in the "cultural significance" section. It would be nice if someone could track down the origin of this joke, however. Postdlf 18:26, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
DIdn't the straight dope run an article on this that mentioned that the bridge had been sold a number of times. Hrm it seems not. I know I've read somewhere in a discussion of that phrase that the bridge had been sold a number of times in the early going. I'll keep digging.--Crossmr 19:47, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

References to "selling the Brooklyn Bridge" abound in American culture,

But why?? I've seen this many times, and don't understand the significance. — Omegatron 23:17, 17 June 2006 (UTC)
I've been looking at can't find the article I'd read on it, but it had been something to the nature of the bridge had been fraudelently bought and sold over 50 times--Crossmr 23:26, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Is the bridge the New New York City Icon?

Ever since they were built, the World Trade Center was the visual icon for quickly indicating to viewers "this is New York City". Of course, they're gone now. If you watch carefully, the Brooklyn Bridge is the new New York City icon. I'd put this in the article, but .... it's original research. :-) RussNelson 05:49, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Last photo is not from Pier 17

The current last image in the article, Brooklyn_Bridge_panorama_2006.jpg, cannot possibly have been taken from Pier 17. I was there yesterday and it is much closer to the bridge. This photo looks like it was taken from a boat in the NY harbor.MJ 17:39, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

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