Talk:Baku Metro

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This article is part of WikiProject Azeri, which aims to improve Wikipedia's coverage of Azeri-related topics. If you would like to participate, you can edit this article, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a list of objectives.

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Trains.
	See also: WikiProject to do list and the Trains Portal
	This article lacks sufficient references and/or adequate inline citations.
B	Quality: B-Class. (assessment comments)
Mid	Importance: mid-importance.
DYK	Portal "Did you know" on 2006-09-12.
	This article is mantained by WikiProject Rapid transit.
M	This article is maintained by WikiProject Metros of the former Soviet Union.

Contents 1 Images 2 Template 3 Edit summary 4 good article

Baku Metro

Most information was contained from the following sources:

http://www.euro-caspian.com/baku_metro.htm

http://www.metro.gov.az:8101/eng/index.htm

Permission was granted for using the pictures from:

http://www.euro-caspian.com/baku_metro.htm —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Baku87 (talk • contribs).

These references need to be added to the article text in a References section. See Wikipedia:Citing sources and Category:Citation templates for more information. Slambo (Speak) 20:18, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Few things to note

1. First of all what is the state of the city's sole transfer point? Is it finally compleate (this will be important when it comes to writing templates).
2. Second are the lines officially called anything (in other ex-Soviet Metros we usually name them for the areas they connect eg Arbatsko-Pokrovskaya; Syretsko-Pecherskaya, Kholodnogorno-Zavodskaya, Nevsko-Vasileostrovskaya, Uzbekistanskaya (in Tashkent) Some are named after figureheads (Leninskaya and Dzerzhinskaya). Does Baku have such a naming system?

--Kuban Cossack 17:53, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

No we dont have such a name system, its most of the time based on a famous composer, for example: Nizami, Elmlyar, Narimanov were all world famous Azeris. And the 20 Yanvar Station is based on the Soviet invasion of Baku on 20 January.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Baku87 (talk • contribs).

That is station names, what about the actual line names is it just line 1 and 2 or are they called something? --Kuban Cossack 20:39, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

Also here is another question are the station openings on Metrosoyuza correct? [1]--Kuban Cossack 00:12, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

I'll start on the line templates shortly. --Kuban Cossack 00:12, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

---

Im not sure what the lines are called, so I really cant say that. I dont know what that second map is supposed to be but that definitly not the Baku Metro structure. If I can be at any help just let me know.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Baku87 (talk • contribs).

Click on the lines, I have corrected the link (and my comment)--Kuban Cossack 17:35, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Images

Is amateur photography allowed in Baku, if yes would it be at all too difficult to ask someone to expand the photbank?--Kuban Cossack 17:34, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

What kind of photogrpahs do you need? Grandmaster 19:42, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

ALL of the stations if possible some closeups of decorations. Shots of exterior vestibules would be helpful? Also a scan of the current map would most appreciated (the one that Baku87 gave is slightly outdated, does not have the 2002 extension to Hazi Aslanov). I know I am asking for a lot so even if you do a tenth of that then I'll be more than grateful. :) --Kuban Cossack 20:42, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

I spoke with a professional photographer who I know, and he told me that because of terrorism in the mid 90s, during the war in Nagorno-Karabakh, a special permission is required to take pictures in the metro. I’ll see if I can get more pictures from some other source. Grandmaster 08:00, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

In Moscow it is like this:[2] (despite having quite a terrorist history [3],[4],[5].--Kuban Cossack 13:09, 21 March 2006 (UTC)

WoW those are some strict rules, But I'd like to see similar rules on US soil aswell. I didnt even know Azerbaijan was also experienced in terrorism, isn't Azebaijan a mostly Muslim populated country? So why would Muslims attack another Muslim country? Does it have to do anything with the oil?

Sorry but this is rather Off Topic. We are talking about how to snap shots of the Metro, not about terrorism. --Kuban Cossack 13:09, 21 March 2006 (UTC)

Yes, this is really offtopic. But answering your question, those terror acts had nothing to do with oil, they took place during the war in Nagorno-Karabakh and were implemented by the same people who were behind the terrorism in Moscow metro in 1977. It’s not only Muslims who resort to terrorism. Grandmaster 13:56, 21 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Template

Line 1 of Baku Metro Hazi Aslanov Ahmadly Khalglar Dostlughu Neftchiler Gara Garayev Azizbekov Ulduz Bakmil Narimanov Ganjlik 28 May Nizami Sahil Elmler Akademiyasi Baki Soveti Inshaatchilar 20 Yanvar Memar Ajami

edit

Line 2 of the Baku Metro Darnagul Azadlyg Prospekti Nasimi Memar Ajami 20 Yanvar Inshaatchilar Elmler Akademiyasi Nizami Jaffar Jabbarly Khatai

edit

Ok people this is what I am trying to confirm from you lot. Is the current Baku Metro operating as illustrated on the two schematics i.e. does the large portion of the second line still exists as a branch of the first line?

Also please correct errors in my translits (which I am sure there are).--Kuban Cossack 21:27, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

Have a look at these links. [6],[7] There’s a map there and some pictures of exteriors. Note that Sahil station looks completely different now, there’s a new high-rise building above the entrance, so you enter thru the passage in the building’s façade. Grandmaster 08:37, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

You marked in green the existing stations Khatai and Jafar Jabbarly, as well as stations Nasimi, Azadlyg prospekti and Darnagul, the latter 3 exist only in designs. Could you please explain the reason for that? And there’s a minor typo in the name of the Azadlyg Prospekti station, it should be they way I typed it (l comes after d). Grandmaster 08:45, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

The latter three are shown as under consturction (note the white dashes) as is the connection track between the Jaffar and Nisami stations. This shows that the remaining stations are formally part of the second line but are currentely served by the first one. Thanks for the Photos. Also cheers for the translit corrections. --Kuban Cossack 13:19, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the explanation. It is clear now. Grandmaster 13:35, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

As for photos, if you can take any then please do, but don't make this a priority (it will be a while before I begin on station articles and I mean a while...). --Kuban Cossack 13:39, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

OK. Grandmaster 13:46, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Edit summary

An anon wrote by and inexplicable oversight you forgot to include the russian name in the article about the metro of your turkish commrades, fortunatly I fixed it for you. I believe that was adressed to me. For those who just joined this is about the article Yerevan Metro which I pretty much solely wrote, and this anon three times attacked the Russian heading in the lead. Ok here is my point

1. I did not write Baku Metro article and apart from some minor copyedits did not get to read the whole text yet.
2. I would have defintely included the Russian in the heading regardless, after all in period 1967-1991 that was one of the names of the system
3. However unlike Yerevan Metro Baku is not bilinugual (Yerevan even retained its Russian words on signs and doors along with Armenian).
4. Wikipedia:No personal attacks, Добавлю что мы казаки Кавказ два века стережем и если вы глодки друг другу будите резать то пожалуста, но МЕТРО вать машу зачем трогать? I could not care less about Armenian-Azeri relations, but please keep them out of wikipedia.
5. WRT №4 these so-called turkish commrades are yet to show the WP:Trolling that I have seen from you, as well as deviating from the quite civil Assume good faith.

--Kuban Cossack 01:08, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

Hi Kuban Cossack. Indeed, the signs in Baku metro are in Azeri language only, but I have absolutely no problem with mentioning the Russian name for Baku metro. Baku is a bilingual city after all, and Russian is the second popular language even among Azeris. Also thank you for your efforts to improve this article, I really appreciate your input. Just ignore the trolls and socks, they vandalise my personal page so many times a day, and I could care less. Actually, I think only registered users should be allowed to edit the articles here. Take care. Grandmaster 06:39, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

Hi. I personally have nothing against Russian language. But it is not an official language in Azerbaijan, nor does it have any official status in Baku. I personally do not agree that Baku is bilingual. But even it was, I do not see the relevance of the Russian name in an English language article. It is a minority language. If we mention Russian then why are we leaving out other minority languages, like Tati for example, which would be considered even native? I don't want to get into a revert cycle, so that's why I'd like it known that, unless it is explained beyond any doubt that mentioning the Russian name is relevant, I am planning of re-removal of the Russian translation. Thanks. --TimBits 02:05, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

Read point №2, the metro carried the official title in 1967-1991 when it was in a country where Russian was the state language, moreover although it is a minority language wrt to the Russians in Azerbaijan (and even less if consider ethnic Russians) BUT Russian is a widespread spoken language, particulary in Baku, as confirmed by my Azerbaijani colleague who do not mind the Russian translation. Moreover I will add that since all Metro systems in Soviet Union were built to the same standard and with similar technology I am 100% certain that Russian language remains dominant on the technical side of the Metro. Hence the title stays.--Kuban Cossack 02:25, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

Point 2 has nothing to do with the current situation and therefore it can not be considered as a factor. It can be mentioned in the history section not in the title. Second, I am not that 100 % sure on things you are sure, but still none of these answer the relevency question. Let's even say taht Russian is the sole internal language of the metro system among the employees, what does it has anything to do with the title? Title is about factual information, and the Russian having no official recognition in either the Republic of Azerbaijan, City of Baku or the Baku Metropoliten, it can not be given equal weight in the introduction section. But of course you can mention it in the historical contest, within the history section. Thanks. --TimBits 03:21, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

Why not let the Azerbaijanis decide on that? They seem to not mind. Like I said the system has Russian as a language of more significance to it than any other. Even the official website is trilingual for that fact. Might I ask why you attack Baku and not say Kharkiv Metro which despite being an almost exclussively Russophone city is located in country where Ukrainian is the only official language. Keeping on that fact Russian does have a status as the main minority language within Azerbaijan and also the inter-minority language. --Kuban Cossack 03:36, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

Why not let the Azerbaijanis decide on that?

First of all, dear Cossack. I really appreciate your interest in these issues and your efforts on improving Azerbaijan related articles are very welcome. I would like you to know that I still consider myself Azerbaijani, just because I am Canadian, does not mean that I can not be considered an Azerbaijani at the same time. Other than that, even if I was not, it would not take away might right as an editor to freely edit an article if I felt that it needs an improvement.

I respect your background, but removing information (which contrary to your statement is clearely the case here) according to WP standards can be considered trolling unless the information is completely irrelevant currentely and historically (which would rule out this scenario) or it is uncited and unreferenced (both of which I have provided) or plagiarised.--Kuban Cossack 15:56, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

They seem to not mind..... Might I ask why you attack Baku....

You didn't understand me right. I do not mind that, it makes no difference to me. I just think that it is irrelevant. And again I am not attacking anybody, please assume good faith, I am trying to improve things.

Improving by attacking such a petty detail, my turn to not being sarcastic, but I would appreciate high-quality contributions prior to making a mess of such a childish issue--Kuban Cossack 15:56, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

Like I said the system has Russian as a language of more significance to it than any other.

And like I said, even if we accept that this statement is true, it is not relevant to the introduction section.

Yes it is --Kuban Cossack 15:56, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

Even the official website is trilingual for that fact.

Many websites are multinlingual. Is the English name for Baku Metro mentioned in the Russian Wikipedia, if there is such an article?

Official websites here in Canada for example, are in English and French and occasianally in other languages such as Inuit language (Eskimo), Chinese, etc. It does not mean that all those languages are cited here in Eglish language Wikipedia. In Russian Wikipedia, you can of course write that in Russian, but this is English wikipedia, only English and the official langauge is relevant.

Well unlike Russian, English has no relevance to Baku Metro historically or technically. --Kuban Cossack 15:56, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

....and not say Kharkiv Metro which despite being an almost exclussively Russophone city is located in country where Ukrainian is the only official language.

I do not have detailed information about Kharkiv Metro or Kharkiv at all. But if the the issue is identical to the one here, I would still hold the same position.

Issue in Kharkiv is this: Metro opened bilingual and in 1980s became monolingual (Russian); City is exclussively Russophone; Metro is still officialy monolingual (Ukrainian) but only in voice announcements; even the Russian signs are retained. As for the city residents...its Kharkov. --Kuban Cossack 15:56, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

Keeping on that fact Russian does have a status as the main minority language within Azerbaijan and also the inter-minority language.

When it was the last time, you were in Baku? This is not a sarcastic question at all, I just would like you to know that you have an outdated information. --TimBits 04:24, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

Ok imagine this situation an Uzbek, Moldovian or a Lithuanian visits Baku. What language would he be talking with local Azerbaijanis? Azeri? English? or ...? --Kuban Cossack 15:56, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

Hi guys. I think this is not such an important issue to be a subject of prolonged debates. This issue was initiated by some troll, who obviously wants us to deviate from our main goal of improving this article and spend our time on such useless debates. I don’t want him to succeed in that. I personally don’t think that inclusion of Baku metropolitan’s name in Russian could somehow harm the quality of the article, neither would the omission of the Russian title. It’s not so important to start heated debates, I think there are more important contributions we can make to this article, let’s concentrate on them and don’t let the provocateurs (you know who they are) prevail. Grandmaster 12:51, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

I agree, no reason to make such a big issue of such a petty detail. I mean this is not a controversial topic, nor is this a form of chauvism in any case or form. In such a situation I see no harm from such a minor detail. Grandmaster is right this debate is a waste of time and energy and if it is a case of national pride being insulted, well WP:NPOV is the answer to that. Ukrainians will have to put up with Kiev instead of Kyiv, Russians with Moscow instead of Moskva, Azerbaijanis with Russian title in the Metro, the analogy is identical. No offense meant --Kuban Cossack 15:56, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

I also think that we are spending to much time on this issue, but I don't think that it is not important or a petty detail. It is an important issue and it should be addressed.

Improving by attacking such a petty detail, my turn to not being sarcastic, but I would appreciate high-quality contributions prior to making a mess of such a childish issue. It is a good point. I feel that I need to devote more time to help improve the quality of articles. However, I as an editor, do not have an obligation to have a large contribution in order to justify or gain right for tackling issues such as these.

Well unlike Russian, English has no relevance to Baku Metro historically or technically.- However correct, this is a POV.

Ok imagine this situation an Uzbek, Moldovian or a Lithuanian visits Baku. What language would he be talking with local Azerbaijanis? Azeri? English? or ...? or if they don't know any of these languages, they would use another language which both parties are fluent in, if no such language exists, then they would probably use some sort of a sign language as in any similar situation. I don't understand what it has to do with the issue. And by the way, Uzbeks, Moldavians and Lithuanians are not called minorities any more, they are referred as foreigners.

Ukrainians will have to put up with Kiev instead of Kyiv, Russians with Moscow instead of Moskva, Azerbaijanis with Russian title in the Metro, the analogy is identical. I would like to differ. Analogy is not identical. One is a naming convention, the other is the inclusion of the foreign language translation of the article. Analogy would be identical if we were arguing about say, whether it should be called Baku Metro or Baku Subway.

Kharkiv Metro, judging by your explanation, is a very different situation. Russian name is obviously relevant. I have been using this key word- relevancy, too much-here and in other Wikipedia articles-for a reason. One of the biggest deficiencies of Wikipedia as a free edit source, there is too much irrelevant information piled up. Right now we need more cleanup tags than stub articles. This is my position on the issue- keep it relevant.

But having argued against the inclusion of the Russian name in the article, I will offer this compromise solution- Russian name will be included in the introduction section but in a historical context. I will include this in my next edit and hope that it will be acceptable to all the parties.

Oh, and Grandmaster, don't worry, this is not a heated debate. It is always pleasure to work with passionate Wikipedians. --TimBits 03:19, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

I think your last edit should be acceptable for everyone. Grandmaster 05:32, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] good article

good article nice pictures, well done!