Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/SNK Boss Syndrome

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was delete. Johnleemk | Talk 14:18, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] SNK Boss Syndrome

• I think it's just stupid... the "symptoms" are just a user's view on what a hard video game boss is... Delete I say... --FlareNUKE 07:51, 11 January 2006 (UTC),
• This afd nomination was orphaned. Listing now. —Crypticbot (operator) 15:29, 11 January 2006 (UTC)
• Delete, the title is barely a neologism and the content is original research. - Bobet 16:21, 11 January 2006 (UTC)
• Delete. Unverifiable and POV. ' ^{(Feeling chatty? ) (Edits!)} 18:48, 11 January 2006 (UTC)
• Delete as original research. —Quarl ^(talk) 2006-01-11 20:52Z
• Keep While the name may or may not be original(An older site called Fighter Mania(which seems to be defunct now) used the term SNKBoss as a group that included many of the characters mentioned in the article), the fact of several of the bosses in fighting games, SNK-made games in particular, being excessively hard for the reasons listed is rather famous among the fighting game community, as noted by posters in this thread, which predates the article by a year . - SAMAS 11 January 2006 (UTC)
  • Another thread from 2004 - SAMAS
  • A review that makes a casual reference.
  • Another review, predating the article. The author mentions: "SNK bosses ain't got nothin' on the CPU in Guilty Gear X2."
  • In this review, we get the following: "Our resident SNK expert in the forums, Shonen_Red has assured me that the level of cheapness in the bosses and midbosses is an SNK staple,"
  • And again: "The bosses are up to the SNK standard... hard and ruthless. Igniz, the last boss, has an SDM that takes off 80% of your life! 80%!!"
  • Remarks another: "And if Omega Rugal's one of SNK's easier bosses, I hate to see what their hardest is like."
  • here, a blogger remarks that the boss of a game called the Rumble Fish is "Almost as bad as SNK bosses."
  • A reviewer at IGN notes: "The game's AI is quite easy through the first three or so fights and at the boss levels, it raises significantly. It's not hard, but if you've played any SNK or Capcom games, you'll remember that the bosses are more cheap that tough. SNK doesn't lose that cheap boss touch here." [1] The review, again, predates this article.
  • and to top it off, a review from 2002 which mentions the cheapness of the bosses of a King of Fighters game under the title of ""the SNK trademark" [2]- SAMAS
• Delete under WP:NOR - there is no such thing as this "syndrome" -- Thesquire (talk - contribs) 04:40, 12 January 2006 (UTC)
  • I see nine links that say otherwise. SAMAS
  • Comment lemme clarify: is the term syndrome used elsewhere for this besides in the title of the article? Are there any publications detailing this "syndrome" out there. Links to reviews comparing games to each other does not a "syndrome" make. As such, this "syndrome" is Original research, which is not allowed. -- Thesquire (talk - contribs) 07:30, 12 January 2006 (UTC)
  • Comment I disagree, as no actual research was done. Damn near everybody in the fighting game fandom knew this information years ago. While perhaps "Syndrome" is the wrong word, it is valid information, and not original at all(ask around Shoryuken.com). Even the "SNK Boss" designation predates the article. - SAMAS
• Not one of those links calls it a 'syndrome'. Delete any and all original research. Proto t c 10:30, 12 January 2006 (UTC)

• I say leave the article. It's interesting and it does have some truth to it. People aren't stupid, they can decide for themselves what to believe. I enjoyed reading the article and I'm sure that many more people will too.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 198.54.202.226 (talk • contribs) 06:18, 12 January 2006.

• Keep. Agreed that this article has a sense of truth to it.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 213.73.168.111 (talk • contribs) 07:31, 12 January 2006.

• Delete. This is just some guys vague opinion on some hard bosses in games. Generic Player 22:35, 12 January 2006 (UTC)
  • Read the links. - SAMAS
• Delete—"SNK Boss Syndrome" is just a colloquial term, shouldn't be here in an Encyclopedia, there are better terms to describe overly powerful bosses rather than saying the words "SNK Boss Syndrome", now that there are Namco and Tecmo bosses that are overly too cheap (i.e. Jinpachi Mishima). — Dark Insanity 04:12, 13 January 2006 (UTC)
  • Namco and Tecmo, however, have not been known to have insanely hard/cheap bosses for more than ten years. That's been the staple of SNK's fighting games since Wolfgang Krauser at least. Much like how a great many non-Konami games use the cheat code Up, Up, Down, Down, Left, Right, Left, Right, B, A, it's still called the Konami Code because Konami started it, they did it more than anyone else combined, and they became (in)famous because of it. This is why, when somone in just about any given forum with members over the age of 18 posts a thread about tough, cheap bosses, it usually doesn't get past two pages before someone mentions SNK Bosses in general. This is why, when a reviewer mentions the difficulty of a boss in a fighting game, he compares it to the bosses of SNK's games(see links above).

While the use of the word "Syndrome" may sound a little too colliqual to some to describe it, I can't say it's inaccurate. Wikipedia's entry on Syndrome says this: In medicine, the term syndrome is the association of several clinically recognizable features, signs, symptoms, phenomena or characteristics which often occur together, so that the presence of one feature alerts the physician to the presence of the others.

The contributors to this thread have done a very good job in pointing out the recognizable features, signs, symptoms, phenomena and characteristics that have made the Bosses in SNK's fighting games so damn tough. While not a medical syndrome, it's certainly one gameplay-wise.

Not that there's not any precedent. See the Stormtrooper effect. - SAMAS

• Delete as unverifiable, among other things. Stifle 18:06, 13 January 2006 (UTC)
  • Facts can be verified by playing the games and fighting the bosses mentioned in the article. - User: SAMAS
  • Then it turns into POV, oops! ' ^{(Feeling chatty? ) (Edits!)} 23:44, 13 January 2006 (UTC)
  • That's like saying a Tiger has black stripes is POV. None of the "Symptoms" in the article(dude, did you even read it?) are done by any opinion. The authors measure it by the actions of the boss(no crouching animation) or the observed effects of it's attacks(a single move that takes off a large chunk of the life meter). If we counted every thing that could be(or had to be) personally verified, we'd have to remove every single movie, book, or video game-related article, and that's just for starters. - SAMAS
• Keep: Methinks that, if it doesn't get deleted, it needs a better name, like merely SNK boss perhaps, and maybe cross-references with List of fighting game terms (which, admittedly, also needs some work, but still), and something clearer at the beginning which explains why this isn't just POV (i.e. the fact that there are several specific "factors" that contribute to the "syndrome"). Admittedly, I suppose there could be some debate as to how many factors you need for it to qualify for an "SNK boss", and yes it does need work to keep it from becoming POV, but for that and the reasons stated above (by people who have demonstrably read the article), I say we keep it. --Yar Kramer 05:09, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.