Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Roy St. Clair

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was no consensus. Mailer Diablo 20:07, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Roy St. Clair

Is a trading card game player, no matter how "top-rated," truly notable if there is nothing else notable about him? I don't think so. Delete. --Nlu (talk) 07:26, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

• Comment To Quote WP:BIO "Sportspeople who have played in a fully professional league, or a competition of equivalent standing in an individual professional sport, or at the highest level in mainly amateur sports, including college sports in the United States." The question becomes, is a TCG a sport? If it is determined it is I would be inclined to keep, and if possible expand the article. EnsRedShirt 07:46, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
• Strong delete - otherwise we will soon have to include champions at Starcraft, Quake III, all manner of computer games and card games like Magic, ie gamercruft.ßlηguγΣη | Have your say!!! 07:56, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

• Very Strong Keep. He came fourth in a world championship for God's sake!!! How much more natablity can you need? This is an example of anti-popular culture bias. It's a very popular TCG and a comptitor playing at international level exceeds notability threshold by far. Loom91 08:44, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
• Merge or delete. If there is an article on the card game in question, put his name up there. There is no reason for him to have his own page. Lundse 10:36, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
• Weak Keep, I contend that the professional Yu-Gi-Oh circuit is probably not a really big draw, but if he came fourth in the world, that's something notable. The game is widely popular enough to make this notable, I think. Lankiveil 13:02, 12 April 2006 (UTC).
• Keep If a precedent is set that top rated collectible card game players do not meet the notability criteria, then we will have to start AfDs on people like Kai Budde, Jon Finkel, and Dave Williams. Then we would have to start considering whether or not being a top player in any non-athletic game is noteworthy, such as chess grandmasters. -- Malber (talk • contribs) 13:05, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
• Keep, barely meets WP:BIO, one of the best in the world, notability established. --Terence Ong 13:58, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
• Delete unlike chess, trading card achievement doesn't sound notable to me. I agree with Blnguyen's comparisons and I'd not particularly want to see the champions of Magic:The Gathering or Warhammer 40,000 having articles MLA 16:08, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
  • Comment Criteria for deletion is not dependent on whether or not you feel a particular endeavor is worthy. The games that the subject plays have referenced articles and would likely survive an AfD nomination. Many people may agree that being a chess grandmaster is more prestigious than becomming world champion in a collectible card game, but that doesn't make it any more or less notable. I believe the subject of this article meets the fourth and ninth bullet points at WP:BIO. I do concede that it does just barely, but the information contained in the article is verifiable per WP:V. I would agree with a vote to merge, however this may be problematic because the subject is a notable player in two CCGs with articles. I'd also like to point out that notable players in Magic:The Gathering have independent articles. -- Malber (talk • contribs) 17:02, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
• Keep per Lankiveil. While I think that many of these "world championships" pan out to overglorified hype, Yu-Gi-Oh is a genuinely popular game, and a Yu-Gi-Oh world championship isn't any less notable than the blizzard of poker championships held on ESPN every day of the week. RGTraynor 16:14, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
• Keep per Lankiveil. JimTS 17:16, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
  • Comment all of user edits are on AfDs.ßlηguγΣη | Have your say!!! 23:35, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
    • Comment true, but have made multiple contributions as guest. Can't prove it, but please do not discount my opinion just because of that. JimTS 15:00, 14 April 2006 (UTC)
• Delete or merge per Lundse. nn except for in the context of the card game.--WilliamThweatt 01:11, 13 April 2006 (UTC)
• Weak keep he is sort of notable Funky Monkey 01:20, 13 April 2006 (UTC)
• Keep as being so highly-ranked in the world at ANYTHING, whether it be a physical sport, a purely mental one (chess) or something in between (collectible card games) is noteworthy. That, and the cheating. He's the MOST well-known Yu-Gi-Oh cheat in existence (upon his official suspension.)--MewtwoStruckBack 06:03, 13 April 2006 (UTC)
  • User's first edit. --Nlu (talk) 06:31, 13 April 2006 (UTC)
• Delete. This is worth a line or two in an article about the tournament, nothing more. Gamaliel 00:23, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.