Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Nooalf

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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was DELET. i WIL aD A LiNK aT SIMPLIFiD SPeLiNG xO, aND MAK IT A REDiReKT. Herostratus 02:07, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Nooalf

Nooalf (edit|talk|history|links|watch|logs) – (View log)

Novel concept, but IPA it isn't. Only people who've written about this are its creators, making this unsourceable through reliable sources. Was deleted via prod earlier but recreated, so it's here. - Bobet 10:08, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Hi. I'm the author of the article. I'm fairly new to Wiki, so forgive me if I don't understand everything. My Intention in posting it is to explain Nooalf in a succinct manner to people who don't want to spend the time reading the Nooalf website. It's also a matter of matching the style to the audience. You will immediately note that the website is not the usual scholarly desertation you would expect for such subjects.

Please correct me if I'm wrong here: Wikipedia is supposed to be the ultimate Encyclopedia. More info and especially newer info than a paper encyclopedia could ever hope to contain. So is it not a good thing that people can get the basic facts about Nooalf here?

I will try to be brief in addressing the above comments:

No, it isn't the IPA. The IPA was made in an era when sound recording was not a practical matter for linguists. Today, transcribing the odd vocalizations of remote tribes is not neccassary, and the entire activity is probably near extinction. Although it is not intended to encompass all possible sounds of the human speach organs, Nooalf does provide ordinary people with a keyboard friendly means to write what they hear. It's based on English, which has more phonemes than most other languages, so it covers most languages fairly well. Plus, sticking to it's basic philosophy, more letters must be added to if needed.

The use of the term 'Unsourcable' seems to imply that something must become widespread before inclusion in Wiki. If somebody searches 'nooalf' I think they would probably want to get the info from the world's foremost authority. Judging from my samplings of the fantastic width, breadth and depth of the information contained in Wiki, you don't require the imprimature of degreed scholars for everything.

I'm not sure why you reference the Dvorak keyboard. However, Nooalf is typable on all ordinary keyboards in either the QWERTY layout or Dvorak.

About Wikifying the article. I would appreciate it if you could add it to the appropriate catagories and lists.

  • Merge and redirect, per Iridescenti, I looked at some web pages written in Nooalf, reminds me of my daughter's IM chats. =killing sparrows 04:30, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

I've read the guidelines for articles to be included in Wiki and can see how Nooalf could fail on the source requirements. Although Noo alf is discussed in many places on the web and the chart is available from at least 1 other source, there is no real paper coverage that I know of. I don't know how much leeway you have in your decisions, but maybe you could take a few days to consider this. Maybe listen to Closer To The Heart by Rush. But, Merge and redirect is OK by me.````JO 753

  • Comment: The reason I brought up IPA is because it is widely used, and has been for a long time. It doesn't matter if you think nooalf is a great invention, what matters is that no one's written about it, making it not only non-notable, but also unverifiable. Merging novel original concepts into another article is not a good option. - Bobet 11:15, 28 March 2007 (UTC)
  • Delete doesn't seem to be in wide use, nor does it look like it will be anytime soon. Just 44 unique Google hits. Andrew Lenahan - Starblind 00:24, 29 March 2007 (UTC)
  • Opinion Upon further reading of Wiki guidlines, I can see that there is a problem with how to consider notability and sourcability. The definitions become unusable when the subject is obscure. This is pretty much the case with any current English spelling reform effort. Since the entire field of endevour has never been very well known, newer attempts, no matter how well known in the spelling reform community, have virtually no media coverage. The only 3 organizations in this field are the Simplified Spelling Society, the American Literacy Council and the Saundspel discussion group.

I first researched spelling reform on the internet in 1999 to see what was already in existence. Joining the Saundspel group and getting critiques from the other reformers is currently the highest level of peer review you can find on this subject. You may be able to find archived discussions from 1999 thru 2001 about Nooalf. (I don't seem to be able to do anything with Yahoo. If you forget your password and secret answer, you're screwed!) Also, you could check with Joe Little at ALC. ````JO 753 3-30-2007

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
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