Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ned (Scottish)1

This page is an archive of the proposed deletion of the article below. Further comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or on a Votes for Undeletion nomination). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was keep, strong suggestion to merge and redirect. Dmcdevit·t 06:54, July 27, 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Ned (Scottish)

See Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/Charva. If variants of chav should be merged and redirected to there, this shouldn't be made to be an exception. Charva allegedly has NPOV issues, but that isn't deletion criteria - these many be ok POV-wise, but its as notable a variant as charva, so it should be merged and redirected per consensus there. Hedley 00:08, 20 July 2005 (UTC)

• Merge and redirect with/to chav in line with Charva VfD. --Sanguinus 00:13, 20 July 2005 (UTC)
  • The reasons given by some editors for merging charva with chav involve the assertion that the two are just two words for the same thing. To be "in line with" that, "ned" and "chav" would have to be two words for the same thing. Is that your assertion? Uncle G 08:49, 20 July 2005 (UTC)
• Merge with townie or chav or whatever. —Ashley Y 02:57, July 20, 2005 (UTC)
• Keep This is an important, if undesirable, part of Scottish culture and should be kept. I do not regard a ned as being the same as a chav although there are some obvious similarities. --Colin Angus Mackay 07:15, 20 July 2005 (UTC)
• This is Votes for deletion. Please don't nominate things here for deletion when you do not actually wish anything to be deleted. Merger does not involve deletion at any stage, and has its own set of tags, separate from {{subst:vfd}}. Uncle G 08:49, 20 July 2005 (UTC)
• Keep. --WikiFan04^{Talk 5:13, 20 Jul 2005 (CDT)}
• Keep Scottish English terms are distinct from English English terms and this is a good article. CalJW 10:36, 20 July 2005 (UTC)
  • We don't have separate articles for things just because there may be two or more distinct terms for them. We don't have separate articles, one for each of the terms, for things for which there are multiple distinct Commonwealth English and United States English terms, for example. We have separate articles when the actual things themselves are different. Is it your assertion that a ned and a chav are two distinct things? Uncle G 12:16, 20 July 2005 (UTC)
    • I would make that assertion. There are many cultural subtlties that make them different. If this article were to be merged into the chav article then either the many of the subtlties would be lost or it would overwhelm the receiving article making it quite much longer than it already is, possibly drowning out other important information. --Colin Angus Mackay
• Merge and redirect to Chav. There are only very minor regional differences between the description for Ned here and how I would describe a Townie in SW England or a Chav in SE England. Just becuase it is a Scottish English dialect word doens't make it any more notable than a Westcountry English dialect word or an Estuary English dialect word. The word Townie has more than one use, but the "Urban context 2" should be merged into the Chav article as well. Thryduulf 12:12, 20 July 2005 (UTC)
• Keep - IMO they are sufficiently different to warrant seperate articles. -- Lochaber 13:40, 20 July 2005 (UTC)
• Keep quite a good article actually and not quite the same as chav. PatGallacher 16:26, 2005 July 20 (UTC)
• Keep I agree with Colin; the cultural differences are big enough to warrant two separate articles. Mendor 19:06, July 20, 2005 (UTC)
• Merge and redirect As an Englishman in Scotland who's seen his fair share of both chavs and neds - they really are just the same thing, but with a different appellation; the minor differences north of the border (Buckfast etc.) can be mentioned in a "Regional Differences" subsection of the unified page. Qwghlm 23:14, July 20, 2005 (UTC)
  • I think you may be missing some of the subtlties. It is like a Japanese person not being able to distinguish the L and R from each other, a Spaniard the V and B, or even many Englishmen with the CH and CK in Scots words. There is a definite difference if you have an ear for it. --Colin Angus Mackay 06:13, 21 July 2005 (UTC)
    • I find it hard to appreciate the subtleties when being threatened at a bus stop at night by them, never mind what side of the border I'm on :| Seriously, though, most of the distinctive features of a stereotypical chav/ned: the clothing, baseball caps, the jewellery, rubbish cars, menacing dogs, anti-social behaviour 'are the same no matter where you are (isn't that the point of the chav stereotype - that they're everywhere you go in the country?), and both articles concerned replicate each other a great deal. There are minor differences, just as there are regional differences within England, but the broad features are essentially the same. Merge the articles, and discuss regional differences within the single one. Qwghlm 09:43, July 21, 2005 (UTC)
• Merge and redirect - all these near synonyms needs to be in the same place. Secretlondon 19:39, 21 July 2005 (UTC)
• Merge and redirect. If we're merging charva we should do the same with this one. They are all regional variations on approximately the same theme. Of course there will be differences, and these can be discussed in the article, but I don't regard them as sufficiently distinct concepts to warrant seperate articles. — Trilobite (Talk) 01:11, 22 July 2005 (UTC)
• Merge/redir as above. Radiant_>|< 14:11, July 22, 2005 (UTC)
• Merge and redirect to Chav, SqueakBox 00:12, July 25, 2005 (UTC)
• Keep Always considered this to be a worthy article. Should chav be merged with white trash? DirectorStratton 23:11, July 25, 2005 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in an undeletion request). No further edits should be made to this page.