Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Luzzatto & Luzzatto
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- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. Borderline, but Dun & Bradstreet's web directory is not a leading indice, and the article doesn't pass WP:CORP, which is the rule of thumb used. Proto::► 10:26, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Luzzatto & Luzzatto
Non-notable Israeli intellectual property firm. Fails WP:CORP (Criteria for companies). Edcolins 19:26, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
- Keep. I think it qualifies on the basis of the statement: "Luzzatto & Luzzatto is ranked second in the Dun & Bradstreet 2006 annual ranking for Israeli Patent Attorneys' firms." --Eastmain 20:46, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
- Being listed on Dun & Bradstreet web site is not a sign of notability. There are actually 100 millions businesses listed on their database. [1] D&B is well-known, but this very specialized, regional ranking indice is far from well-known. Examples of well-known ranking include Fortune 500 and Forbes Global 2000 (WP:CORP). --Edcolins 21:20, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
- Delete - not notable per WP:CORP and lack of reliable sources (I can't find much through Google or Google News). Jayden54 21:45, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
- Delete per above, and may even be a WP:COI for the creating editor. ju66l3r 21:46, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
- Keep Company meets WP:CORP 2 The company or corporation is listed on ranking indices of important companies produced by well-known and independent publications. Compared to the world, L&L is a small firm, but in Israel it is not. Yes, D&B might be a very specialized, regional ranking indice, so what? That's one of the local leading indices. If Forbes bybasses Israeli, Nigerian, and other small country firms, then they are all NN? --Shuki 22:46, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
- You pretend that the Dun & Bradstreet 2006 annual ranking for Israeli Patent Attorneys' firms "is one of the local leading indices." Please cite reliable sources to support the assertion that this ranking table is well-known. There are plenty of rankings around, especially for law firms. Wikipedia is not a business directory. --Edcolins 17:30, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
- You've unilaterally decided that the D&B indice is not notable and then tell me that I have to prove with sources that it is? Gee, that's fair. --Shuki 22:23, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
- Being the authority in knowing what is notable and what is not, I can unilaterally decide if the ranking is notable! Of course not... I am simply questioning the notability of the ranking, that's all. "A topic is notable if it has been the subject of multiple, non-trivial published works from sources that are reliable and independent of the subject itself and each other". (WP:N) --Edcolins 19:38, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
- Are you getting into semantics now? WP:CORP states that the indices need to be well-known and independent. In the Israeli business world, D&B is well-known and independent. --Shuki 21:57, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
- Being the authority in knowing what is notable and what is not, I can unilaterally decide if the ranking is notable! Of course not... I am simply questioning the notability of the ranking, that's all. "A topic is notable if it has been the subject of multiple, non-trivial published works from sources that are reliable and independent of the subject itself and each other". (WP:N) --Edcolins 19:38, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
- You've unilaterally decided that the D&B indice is not notable and then tell me that I have to prove with sources that it is? Gee, that's fair. --Shuki 22:23, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
- You pretend that the Dun & Bradstreet 2006 annual ranking for Israeli Patent Attorneys' firms "is one of the local leading indices." Please cite reliable sources to support the assertion that this ranking table is well-known. There are plenty of rankings around, especially for law firms. Wikipedia is not a business directory. --Edcolins 17:30, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
- Delete I don't think the ranking is nearly enough for CORP. Strikes me as a "dime a dozen" firm crz crztalk 21:43, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
- Keep I am not really sure what all this WP:CORP is. Of course a good encyclopadiea should have articles about all the leading firms in each area and Luzzatto seem to be one of these. There is good information here for anyone to use. 212.179.46.6 12:43, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
- Keep This is a small, non controversial entry. There are 1000s of similar entries in all of wikipedia: see for example Yigal Arnon, Pearl Cohen Zedek Latzer, Eitan Law Group or S. Horowitz & Co. all law or patent attorney firms of standing in Israel or LeBoeuf, Lamb, Greene & MacRae, Baker Botts, Fulbright & Jaworski in the USA. If you delete this then you must delete most of the other 1000s of similar articles on other similar firms or businesses from all around the world. Why the discrimination? Our consumers (= the people looking for information on a myriad of topics) have a right to the information provided in this article, it is of specialist interest (patents in Israel and the Luzzatto family and also of general interest (a firm keeping up a family tradition from Italy to Israel, head of firm an author of novels). Keep it. Benqish 20:54, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
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- Comment: Non-controversial is a) not a criteria for keeping an article and b) not true, since it's here being discussed for deletion. The existence of "1000s" of other similar articles does not affect the decision for any other article to remain here. In fact, I thank you for bringing some of those to my attention, I am submitting at least one of them for deletion per their inability to be verifiable nor meet the notability and source requirements for an article. Finally, Wikipedia is not a repository of all information nor is it personal webspace meaning if the information is important (but not applicable to this website) it should be hosted somewhere else and not here. Maybe you could start a LawyerWiki or WikiFirm. ju66l3r 22:45, 11 January 2007 (UTC)
- Oh please! Don't compare Luzzatto x2 with LeBoeuf Lamb, seriously. - crz crztalk 01:35, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
- Please crz do not be americocentric. en.wikipedia is an English language web encyclopedia NOT an American encyclopedia. LeBoeuf Lamb is merely ranked 36 in the USA for law firms (see http://www.ilrg.com/nlj250), Luzzatto & Luzzatto is ranked 2 in Israel (albeit of patent attorney firms). An Israeli business can be on wikipedia and so can a US business - as long as they confirm with the rules set in WP:CORP. I (and many others seem to agree with me) think there is a place for the likes of Luzzatto & Luzzatto here. Benqish 09:30, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
