Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Luna class starship

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This page is an archive of the proposed deletion of the article below. Further comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or on a Votes for Undeletion nomination). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was No Consensus default to Keep. Essjay · Talk 09:10, August 11, 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Luna class starship

Delete A page for a Star Trek starship class that was never seen or even mentioned on-screen and exists only in Star Trek novels (which are considered non-canon by Paramount). AlistairMcMillan 01:46, August 4, 2005 (UTC)

BTW Only one other page links to it. And I believe a lot of the content is speculation. AlistairMcMillan 01:48, August 4, 2005 (UTC)

  • Keep and edit. VfD is not the solution to an editing conflict. Septentrionalis 02:11, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
Uhm... which editing conflict? AlistairMcMillan 02:14, August 4, 2005 (UTC)
  • Delete we don't need material on non-cannon Star Trek. Copy to Memory Alpha if it's not already there, though. JesseW 02:17, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
Memory-Alpha doesn't have an entry on the Luna class, which just proves my point that this shouldn't have an entry here. AlistairMcMillan 03:08, August 4, 2005 (UTC)
  • Delete Non-canon Star Trek, and is Star Trek minutiae really encylopedic? 03:40, August 4, 2005 (UTC)
  • Delete, non-canon fancruft, which is the lowest variety of fancruft. Lord Bob 03:58, August 4, 2005 (UTC)
  • Keep - Even if this was not actually mentioned on screen: mention in a novel is plenty, Star Trek is notable, and includes novels on the subject, since they are able to list about 10 Luna class vessels, it seems the subject is not so minor: whether film producers consider something canon is an arbitrary distinction, about whether Hollywood thought it was most expeditious to pay attention to certain topics in building their own stories, and there are many things that might have not appeared on screen which would still be notable. You have a point about possible speculation in the article, but that is more of an editing matter. If the subject was mentioned in one of their books, it obviously has some meaning in the Star Trek universe. --Mysidia 04:05, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
About the ten Luna class vessels, they are just mentioned in a throw away manner. They do not feature in any of the novels in any significant way. We know nothing about the other Luna class vessels aside from their names.
And please understand what I mean by saying Paramount does not consider the novels canon. If they produced a movie or tv series tomorrow, they would not hesitate for a second to contradict anything in one of the novels. They have already contradicted numerous novels in a number of very significant ways. AlistairMcMillan 05:48, August 4, 2005 (UTC)
  • Keep. Being merely officially licensed, not canon, is not automatically a criterion for deletion. If this was someone's fanfic, I'd vote delete, but some of the books are notable. — JIP | Talk 05:50, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
Every other time a non-canon starship has been added, it has been deleted. AlistairMcMillan 05:55, August 4, 2005 (UTC)
So if I wrote an extensive article on, say, David Gold (Star Trek), who has a major role in pretty much the entire Starfleet Corps of Engineers series, appearing in each of the about 50 or 60 eBooks, it would be summarily deleted as non-canon? — JIP | Talk 06:01, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
It would probably be merged into Starfleet Corps of Engineers, if I had to guess. - A Man In Black (Talk | Contribs) 06:55, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
I'm only familiar with the situation with starship related pages. Sorry can't answer your question. AlistairMcMillan 08:04, August 4, 2005 (UTC)
  • Keep. Being present in a published Star Trek novel (in contrast to fanfiction) does give some "officialness" to this, whether or not it is endorsed as canon by Paramount, so this article is valid. Sjakkalle (Check!) 10:34, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
  • Delete under the fancruft principle. Nandesuka 12:07, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
  • Keep or merge (though article is quite large, and merge here might be considered silly). Kim Bruning 13:37, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
  • Keep or merge. If it's in novels published under the official license that's good enough for me. If it contains speculation, remove that, etc. Christopher Parham (talk) 14:37, 2005 August 4 (UTC)
  • Delete. If it ain't on film, it ain't canon: let Memory Alpha do it. --Calton | Talk 15:04, August 4, 2005 (UTC)
  • Keep, as WP:NOT paper. It's in the books, and we're not going to lose anything by having it on. - ulayiti (talk) 15:59, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
  • Merge and redirect to List of Starfleet ship classes. Non-canon, marginally notable, so it doesn't deserve its own article, but adding it to this list would be a good compromise. Cleanup some of the speculation, too. -- Plutor 16:29, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
  • Keep. This class of ship may not be from the show cannon, but it is from the expanded universe cannon and is the class of ship of Riker's new starship. Worthy of it's own entry as it was implied in Star Trek Nemesis. I also take issue with anyone who says this is "fancruft" as the novels are not fancruft.Gateman1997 17:25, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
By all means, make articles for the books; widely distributed, published novels are notable. On the other hand, objects mentioned in passing in those novels tend not to be notable. - A Man In Black (Talk | Contribs) 03:28, 5 August 2005 (UTC)
By that logic, most of the articles associated with the Harry Potter books, including Hogwarts School of Witchcraft and Wizardry should be deleted as well.Gateman1997 19:32, 5 August 2005 (UTC)
That is completely different. The Harry Potter books are written by the person who created Harry Potter. The Star Trek books are not written by Paramount. Paramount does not take their content seriously or make any attempt to incorporate it into their own Star Trek productions. If Paramount did make a series about the Titan, there is a good chance they would design a new starship class of their own for it and completely ignore the Luna class which was invented by their licensee Pocket Books.
  • Merge and redirect per Plutor. It isn't fanfiction, and although it isn't canon (as opposed to Star Wars, where EU material is canon), it's notable enough to be included on this list. The list is more helpful, anyway. --Scimitar parley 18:16, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
  • Smerge and redirect, I'll let the Trekkies decide where. -R. fiend 18:16, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
  • Normally I'd suggest merging this, but the page is longer than the two line stub I was expecting. With reservations, keep. Sabine's Sunbird 21:48, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
  • Merge & redirect. The people who care about care about all, might as well aggregate.Eldereft 22:15, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
  • Delete. Non-canon fancruft. --Carnildo 22:52, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
  • Delete I love Star Trek but non-canon stuff doesn't belong. --Etacar11 23:54, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
  • Delete reading the keep votes in the voice of Comic Book Guy seals the deal that this is cruft SchmuckyTheCat 23:57, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
I don't know if it's because I had a few beers, but I tried that and it's hilarious. -R. fiend 02:21, 5 August 2005 (UTC)
Me, too. Funny without the beers. Schmucky, you devil. Apologies to all keep voters... ;P --Etacar11 02:31, 5 August 2005 (UTC)
Interesting -- to vote to delete because you can make the "keep" votes funny by speaking them in a silly voice. And they say there's no Cabal. "Vote early -- vote often !!" Simon Cursitor 07:26, 5 August 2005 (UTC)
  • Keep. arj 22:33, 7 August 2005 (UTC)
  • Keep.--Kross 07:34, August 10, 2005 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in an undeletion request). No further edits should be made to this page.

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