Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Kris Clack

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. (ESkog)^(Talk) 01:50, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Kris Clack

Fails WP:BIO. Didn't play professionally and not enough notability as a college player. Delete BlueValour 02:19, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

• Delete delete per nom. — ዮም | (Yom) | Talk • contribs • Ethiopia 02:50, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
• Delete 2nd Team Big 12 = cut from Wikipedia. JChap (Talk) 02:51, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
• Delete Just playing big-time college basketball doesn't make one notable. A well-crafted article would be worth keeping. I'm afraid this is not one of those. --DarkAudit 03:07, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
• Delete per nom -- Alias Flood 03:17, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
• Keep (creator) Sorry but an NBA player is notable.--Summonmaster13 04:05, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
• Delete it should be pointed out that Kris Clack is not and never was an NBA player. He was drafted and failed to play a single game in the NBA. Pascal.Tesson 04:47, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
• Delete per nom Michael 06:12, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
• Delete, fails WP:BIO. -- H·G (^words/_works) 07:26, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
• Speedy Keep. Obviously a bad-faith AFD nomination; discussion worthy of dismissal. 71.101.234.237 12:27, 14 July 2006 (UTC) This is this user's only contrbution. BlueValour 18:52, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Comment Obviously? Care to back that up with evidence? --DarkAudit 14:13, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
• Delete fails WP:BIO at the very least. No brainer. WilyD 12:48, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
• Delete per WP:BIO and per Pascal.Tesson. Barno 14:17, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Changing vote to very weak keep per experience in premier Italian league. Edge of notability for "en" wikipedia, more likely to be notable for "it" wikipedia. Barno 15:09, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
• Delete Didn't even make first team All-Big 12. NawlinWiki 14:39, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
• Keep He was drafted by an NBA team, which is more than can be said about many other college players -- especially during the late 1990s and early 2000s, when high-schoolers and international prospects were in vogue. (And for those who aren't familiar with the NBA Draft, it's only two rounds long, with about 30 players taken in each round.) Zagalejo 18:23, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

Comment A quick Google search shows that Clack has played professionally for teams in Italy, including Pallacanestro Reggiana. Pallacanestro Reggiana is a member of Lega Basket, Italy's premier basketball league. Zagalejo 18:40, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

• Delete fails WP:BIO Very Weak Keep based on euro play not previously in article.--Nick Y. 19:09, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
• Delete per nom and fails WP:BIO Davidpdx 19:21, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
• Delete per nom. Zos 19:42, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

*Keep Some of the worst NBA players ever, were still some of the best in the world. Only 1 in 1000 make it to the NBA. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Summonmaster13 (talk • contribs) . Sorry Summonmaster13 only 1 'vote' per person. BlueValour 21:31, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

• Comment: Please don't attempt to vote twice; nobody will be fooled by that. --EngineerScotty 21:29, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

• Delete barely. If he had managed to play in one counting NBA game or be drafted in the first round, I'd vote to keep. But above-average college players with no professional or international experience aren't notable. --EngineerScotty 21:28, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

Well, he does have professional experience -- just not NBA experience. Like I said, he's been playing in Italy [1] [2] [3]. Zagalejo 22:17, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

• Keep - the stub does not do a good enough job of explaining his accomplishements yet, but he scored 1,500 points as a college player. He is notable enough for his college accomplishments. Johntex\^talk 23:07, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
• Strong Keep -- The nomination is misleading in three regards. Firstly, the article passes WP:BIO, since he was a D-I NCAA player. Secondly, he has played professionally, as noted above. Third, he was a four-year starter at a major college with numbers that ranked him in the top-10 all time among Texas players in several categories [4]. Clearly expandable. -- Mwalcoff 23:37, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

• Comment - not so; since there is a professional level D-I NCAA does not satisfy WP:BIO - 'or at the highest level in mainly amateur sports, including college sports in the United States'. BlueValour 15:49, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

• Comment What we need are some well-established notablity criteria for D-I basketball players. The twelfth man on SUNY-Stony Brook probably doesn't deserve an article, but a four year starter for a major program is probably notable based solely on the amount of media exposure he'd receive. Zagalejo 18:11, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

• Comment - I agree we need more detail. At present D-1 players are /not/ inherently notable but can attain notability if they prove sufficiently outstanding. The Bio guidelines are presently being reviewed and expanded. BTW I have seen no evidence that the Italian league he plays in meets the 'fully professional league' requirement.

• Comment -- I believe BlueValour is misinterpreting the relevant WP:BIO section. Discussions at the WP:BIO talk page and AfD precedent indicate that "mainly amateur sports" includes college basketball and college football. I can't imagine a WP:BIO recommendation would allow for articles on college lacrosse players but not on college hoops stars, who are far better known. -- Mwalcoff 02:36, 16 July 2006 (UTC)
• Comment What exactly do you mean by "fully professional"? It seems like the average players in Serie A get paid about 10,000 euros per month. (here). Is that good enough? Zagalejo 06:50, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

• KeepProfessional player in Italian league and notable college player. Capitalistroadster 02:48, 15 July 2006 (UTC)
• Strong Keep passes WP:BIO per the two above. --Eivind^t@c 08:51, 15 July 2006 (UTC)
• Keep, drafted by an NBA team, has played in the Serie A, the elite competition in Italy. The top national league of a large country is surely significant, whether or not it is "fully professional" (compare the Commonwealth Bank Trophy, one of the world's top two or three netball competitions despite being essentially an amateur league). --bainer (talk) 02:54, 16 July 2006 (UTC)
• Keep per above. Meets standards. --badlydrawnjeff talk 14:06, 16 July 2006 (UTC)
• Keep, though barely. Andrea Bargnani was notable prior to being drafted by the Toronto Raptors, based largely on play in Euroleage and Serie A. Granted, Clack isn't anywhre near as talented as Bargnani. The article should be edited to reflect his European play; as this appears to be the basis by which this AfD likely will be rejected. --EngineerScotty 20:56, 16 July 2006 (UTC)
• Delete made it close to the big time, but not quite -- MrDolomite | Talk 20:17, 18 July 2006 (UTC)
• Keep add the citations as to pro play in Italy an you have two (weak) claims to notability. That's enough in my book. Eluchil404 00:44, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.