Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Iruthayapuram massacre

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. — Nearly Headless Nick ^{C} 10:38, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Iruthayapuram massacre

Iruthayapuram massacre (edit|talk|history|links|watch|logs) – (View log)

No independent sources are cited for any of these claims. The only sources that even mention this incident are strongly allied to the LTTE, the rebel group fighting the government in the North and East of Sri Lanka. Human rights groups such as Amnesty International or Human Rights Watch haven't even mentioned such an incident in any of their annual reports. Unless reliable sources are provided, this article completely fails WP:V and should be deleted snowolfD4^{( talk / @ )} 06:04, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

• Keep: Article needs improvement, not deletion. AlphaShroom 06:08, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

If you have reliable sources, by all means go ahead and improve it. But if this incident is just a fabrication by the LTTE (which, note, is banned as a terrorist organization by 31 counties including the US, Canada, India and the EU) and websites related to it, and no neutral organization has reported about it, we shouldn't have a article about something that never happened. --snowolfD4^{( talk / @ )} 06:38, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

Understood and agreed. Delete.AlphaShroom 06:44, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

• Comment Delete - I don't feel comfortable saying it never happened (as it is a fact that Sri Lankan security forces have commited a number of human rights violations), but there is a lack of reliable online sources (perhaps someone could investigate the presence of book sources?--I will try tomorrow). Unless additional (and reliable) sources are found, I would say the subject-matter fails WP:Notability. I am withholding a vote until I can further investigate. By the way, is UTHR (University Teachers for Human Rights) also pro-Tamil and non-reliable (they seem to be a national organisation)? Black Falcon 08:18, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

• Comment Black Falcon, as a newbie into these issues, I need to bring you uptodate about these issues UTHR is a neutral organisation whose foiunder members were killed by the LTTE only the Ranjan Hoole one of the founder is still alive and his security is provided the Sri Lankan state. It was created to counter the terrorism of the state and the LTTE against the civilians. Infact extreamsit on both sides consider it to be biased to the other side. RaveenS 14:28, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

• I am actually rather familiar with the Sri Lankan civil war (note my rather strong comment ("it is a fact that...") regarding the HR violations committed by the Sri Lankan state), but mostly through academic books. I was, however, unfamiliar with UTHR beyond knowing that it's Jaffna office closed soon after opening (I followed a link from the source provided in the article). Thus, as I have little doubt the incident did indeed occur (and the UTHR source adds credence to this), the only question becomes notabiliy as demonstrated through a multiplicity of coverage. I possess a few books on the Sri Lankan civil war and will look through them for references to the massacre. If I find anything, I will post it here or in the article. In any case, thanks for the clarification regarding UTHR. Cheers, Black Falcon 06:21, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

• I have been unable to find any sources on this to establish notability, and am, therefore, supporting to delete. -- Black Falcon 18:08, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

• My two cents on this...If anyone who comes here to vote should take a look at the articles talk page..Not only the sources are dubious ,they also gives us (UTHR) the impression that there was indeed an LTTE leader among the death..And some eye witness even recall a noise of a bomb explosion!! Which means the forces were clearly attacked so even if we believe these sources(which seems impossible), I don't know why the Author of this article wanted to defame the SL forces alone ?? Ohh..about the UTHR ,they do contradict a lot..Esp when it comes to reports which they made in the early 1990's, when they were extremely pro LTTE or very much sympathetic to their course!! I have followed their paper publications even before the start of the internet era,and let me tell you , there is a clear bias towards tamils and for LTTE..They became anti LTTE after 1995 ,when LTTE started killing their leaders ,such as DR Rajini Rajasingham Thiranagama..They nearly killed Dr Raja Hoole too..And UTHR recent reports are some what neutral (except for the issues regarding SL history) .we can take it as a neutral source ONLY when we talk about incidents happened after 1995 ..BTW, since you seems to be interested in our issues , i would like to recommend you the Books written by

• If I'm not mistaken, the LTTE used that as a tactic--attacking security forces in Tamil-populated villages in hopes they would retaliate (they did this especially with the IPKF). Although I'm inclined to believe that this event took place and that most of the dead were civilians, and although the Sri Lankan security forces have committed their share of human rights violations, the LTTE is certainly no saint! Due to the lack of reliable sources to establish notability, I am supporting deletion of the article. Cheers, Black Falcon 18:10, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Mr Rohan Gunaratne,as he is widely considered as an expert on this.. Thanks--Iwazaki 15:24, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

That is false Rajin Thiranagama was killed in 1989 year after UTHR was founded. Ranjan Hoole had to get out real quickly from Jaffan. The organisation was never pro anybody LTTE or the governmentRaveenS 16:33, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

No raveen, DR hoole was the VC of Jaffna University untill recently.I am not sure what do you mean by "he got out jaffna real quickly " ?? HE was there even in the last year..Only after ,if my memory servers, LTTE tried to take his life away ,he ran away from Jaffna..And yes, they were highly sympathetic to the tamil cause hence supported LTTE initially..thats the truth.--Iwazaki 17:19, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

THe VC is Ratnajeevan Hoole brother of Rajan Hoole who received death threats because he is the brother of Rajan Hoole and had to abandon his job. Rajan Hoole of UTHR left Jaffna in 1989/90 soon after Rajini Thiranagama and the student Manoharan were killed64.201.162.1 17:50, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

• Strong Delete:Non of these references are neutral. There’s nothing to argue with the neutrality of this article, even the author of the article has accepted that in the discussion page. So in that case my opinion is, this article is another blatant attempt to embarrass a sovereign and recognized country and its distinctive special force unit front of the baseless accusation of a terrorist group which is trying to raise a separate state on the Sri Lanka. --♪♫ ĽąĦĩŘǔ ♫♪ ^{Walkie-talkie} 19:42, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Sri Lanka-related deletions. --   ⇒ bsnowball  10:27, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

• Strong Delete: The references are from biased sources which are anti government of sri lanka and are pro-ltte and LTTE frontends. Tamilnation is a well known LTTE frontend and fails NPOV completely. Here is a example[1] by the highly esteemed tamil professor Prof. Ratnajeevan H. Hoole, who exposes one of tamilnations prized contributors as academic fraud and a terrorist suspect in addition to being in association with thugs. With terrorist suspects and academic frauds contributing to it, tamilnation clearly is not a WP:RS. Tamilcanadian.com too is a pro-eelam site and a LTTE frontend, a visit to the site shows that it has a so-called "Eelam menu", with the noted terrorist prabhakaran referred to as the "Tamil Eelam National Leader", although eelam has not being recognised by any country in the world. This more than enough shows its bias and as such fails WP:RS completely.

The major problem with this article is that it does not have a independent non partial reports to support it and there is no conclusive evidence to prove the STF was behind this event either. Since the cited sources fail wikipedia's esteemed standards of WP:RS, WP:Notability and WP:NPOV, the article in question should be speedily deleted.Kerr avon 15:33, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

• Comment DELETE As the creator of this article I have come to have my doubts as to whether it should stay or not because like many have pointed out I still have not found the credible sources outside of pro- LTTE sources except UTHR hence it does fail notability to an extend. I was thinking about renaming it as Kumarapuram incident or something similr to it. I will look around. This incident did happen but unfortunately compared to ther incidents it did not grab the attention of the media or I have not fouynd it yet. We will wait and see, Wikipedia is not gong out tomorrow or me. Only time will tell. Thanks RaveenS 14:28, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

Couldnt find independant attribution outside of UTHR hence fails notability also it may be knwon under a different name, need to go through HRW and AI reports for the time being fully later RaveenS 21:20, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

• DELETE per talk page & per WP:RS--Iwazaki 03:45, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.