Talk:Apostolic Faith Mission
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[edit] You May Need to Make Serious Reconsiderations About Your Choices If . . .
1. There are repetitive teachings that are not biblical and/or that go beyond the teachings of the Bible.
2. You are told that it is like a club, so it can make up its own rules for membership.
3. Extraordinary demands are placed upon you to measure up as a way to cover up the fact that you have been exploited.
4. Leaders keep saying there will be changes, but you never see them happen. You know -- that proverbial carrot on the stick that keeps you hopeful and coming back.
5. You are told to let go of or overlook the promises that have been broken and continue on in the organization.
6. You feel loyalty toward the organization, or persons in it, even though you carry secrets of their damage to yourself, a family member, or others.
7. You feel stuck there in spite of knowing about destructive behavior and/or teachings, but you believe you cannot do anything about it.
8. You keep someone's destructive behavior secret because of all the good things you hope they will do or because of the importance of their position or career.
9. Someone's talents or contributions cause you to overlook the exploitation.
10. Your own talents and contributions cause you to overlook the exploitation.
11. You cannot detach from the organization even though you do not trust or like it.
12. You find yourself obsessing about your relationship with the organization and those who represent it.
13. You hear that others on the outside are horrified by something that happened to you there, but you are not.
14. And finally, you look back with fondness upon the organization, and/or persons in it, who broke their promises and/or did acts you felt compelled to overlook.
How many of these are/were your reality? Was your trust betrayed?
Raina 12:27, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Comments by Wetman and Answer
Entries made 22 August 2004 from ISP 198.81.26.48 should be thoroughly checked for accuracy, as this ISP is consistently a source of vandalism. --Wetman 14:31, 1 Dec 2004 (UTC)
- Actually, I made those changes without realizing that I was not signed in. Later, I learned that this ISP shows up for many writers. I, however, have never vandalized an article here or anywhere else. I attended this church from birth until I was over fifty-years-old and read several books and articles about it, including their own and those not their own. I checked these sources and did not put anything in the article that I had not read in at least three different published writings. Raina 05:59, 7 Dec 2004 (UTC)
[edit] comment about AFC article
Hello, I live just next to the church headquarters in Portland and have many good friends and family there. I can say with confidence that this article is a very accurate and fair summary of the AF Church and its doctrines and history.
Having been raised in the church myself, I want to stress how important the members of the church feel that sanctification and baptism are in the role of being saved--or unsaved. In order to be fully prepared to meet god and enter heaven, you must be saved and have felt the conviction of the holy spirit. You must also be sanctified, and baptized as described exactly in the bible. These are really the major standpoints of their doctrine.
The AFC is a strictly fundamentalist Christian church which interperates the King James Bible in a literal way, and without any exception. The Church does not seem to promote higher learning such as college etc. In my opinion, this is because learning involves asking questions, and asking questions about the bible "might" be the closest thing to heracy; quite possibly a damnible act.
I do believe that a semi-hidden reformation is in the works of the church(Or so I hope).
- Thank you for your comments. They are appreciated. When I was a member there, I first heard, in the year 1968, that specific things were going to change. One of the things mentioned then has not yet changed, although I was assured numerous times through the years, by various church leaders, that it would change. The only things I really saw change, of those items, was the acceptance of television ownership.
- No longer having access to such information, I would really appreciate your informing us of any accepted changes in their rulings.
- Thank you. Raina
[edit] Re Sister Lila's Edits
Sister Lila: Thank you for your edits. I changed one of those edits back to the way it was previously, because "campmeeting" was a direct quote. I added [i][sic][/i] to it, to indicate this. Raina 05:22, 22 July 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Women in Ministry in the Apostolic Faith
06:19, 23 January 2006 Tuscaloosa11 (→Church doctrines and teachings) I have no idea why the words "and women" were removed from the sentence under Church doctrines and teachings reading "These men and women are expected to further educate themselves by reading the KJV Bible . . . ." The Portland, Oregon, church was started by and pastored by a woman: Florence Crawford. There were/are many other female preachers and pastors in it, including others in Oregon, California, Washington, Kansas, Illinois, Minnesota, Wisconsin, and more. Any comment? Raina 13:08, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
Tuscaloosa11 06:59, 16 February 2006 (UTC) You are correct that women pastors were and are indeed a major factor in the church and it's doctrines, AKA Florence Crawford. It was incorrect of me to remove "and women" from the article.
However, I suppose the reason why I so hastily removed the mention of women pastors without really thinking was because I don't ever remember seeing any women preachers or elders sitting on the platform facing the congregation. Please take into account, I find nothing wrong with men and women having seperate roles in the church, as this practice can be interpretated to have a biblical basis.
- Hey, no problem. I could name some of the female pastors and elders who sat on the platform facing the congregation, but it has been a long time, and I have forgotten some of their names. Other than Florence Crawford, whom you mentioned, and without naming those who are active now, only those who have passed on, a few are Dolly Walker (pastor); Sara Hamilton (preacher, elder); Edna Jensen (elder); the lady who pastored the Richland Center, WI, church, whose name I cannot recall; a female evangelist who lived in Medford but traveled in the West Coast of the U.S. as a speaker; Rev. Nella Kostol; Edna Crawford (??); Rev. Edna Damron. Raina 16:48, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
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- Because of recent activity here, I have a renewed interest in this article. Because of this, I looked around the Apostolic Faith's website and found that they have several female pastors listed. If you have further interest in this, you can go to that website at http://www.apostolicfaith.org/aboutus/branch.asp#US, a site listed on the article's page. Raina 23:14, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Comments By M and Answer
In general, I think the article is well-written. As a member (25 years or my whole life), there are a few things that could stand a little explanation from our point of view, but on the whole, not bad. Without knowing what you're referring as far as "things that were going to change," I can only guess. In the last ten or fifteen years, I've seen several changes. Women now often wear pants outside of the church (at least on the West Coast. Anything past Colorado and I don't have a clue.) Higher education is now accepted,with more and more young men and women entering college every year. Wedding rings still aren't accepted, but I would just like to note that I think this is more about maintaining unity with our foreign work and within the organization than anything else. I'm ferociously anti-television myself, but more from my personal opinions (yes, I am college-educated) than from church standards. If you have more questions, I'll see if I have answers! M 23 January 2006
- Thank you for your input. I left this church in December, 1999, after having been a member for 50.5 years, so changes might have occurred in the last five years. There are those from that church, however, who would disagree with you, but that's all right. When I was there, the only foreign works that did not allow wedding bands were those in far northern North America; many of the others outside of the USA and on the east coast and south of the continental US have no problem with them.
- By the way, you can get a name- and time-stamp by typing four ~(tildes) in a row. Nice to have you on board! By the way, why not do a personal page for yourself? Raina 01:50, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Comments Between Justin and Raina
NOTE -- I have removed most (all, obviously) of my original input here in the comments section. You can check the archives, if you must, to review our discussion.
--Justin
- Out of respect toward Justin, I, too, have removed my comments. Raina 16:50, 1 March 2007 (UTC)
