User talk:Angel77

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[edit] Warning

You may be under attack by cheese dreams and his army of sock puppets. Victums should report any abuse to Angel77 discussion page.

[edit] Report new violation

[edit] User:Slrubenstein

Three revert rule violation on Jesus (edit|talk|history|links|watch|logs)

Slrubenstein (talk • contribs):

  • 1st Revert at 20:10 [1]
  • 2nd Revert at 20:24 [2]
  • 3rd Revert at 20:26 [3]
  • 4th Revert at 20:34 [4]

also additional reverts within the last 2 hours

Reported by:20:45, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Comments:

  • Sl was reverting edits by a new user (Fish Supper) with edit summaries "Naughty", and "Mouse error". Guettarda 21:06, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
  • "Naughty" was referring to Sl's blanket unwarrented reversions earlier in the day which looked like they had already broken 3RR.
  • "Mouse error" was referring to Fish supper's thinking he had reverted back to the wrong version, not having realised that Slrubenstein reverted it back in the mean time.
Fish Supper 21:11, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
  • Given the BT IP address, it's hard not to suspect that this is CheeseDreams. Rhobite 21:14, Apr 19, 2005 (UTC)

Possibly, but in any event Fish Supper (talk • contribs) and 81.156.92.196 (talk • contribs) are likely The Rev of Bru (talk • contribs), which would push the revert count much higher. Jayjg (talk) 21:57, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I'm in east ham (london), and Im guessing the Rev of Bru is in glasgow, as thats the only place the Church of Bru (Irn Bru) really operates. Fish Supper 22:07, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Everyone I know is on BT, but we are going over to bulldog soon - its much cheaper. Fish Supper 21:41, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
  • It is actually Fish Supper who has violated the 3RR (see below). Fish Supper accuses me of violating the 3RR. The first revert according to Fish Supper was actually when I reverted a one sentence change by Rev of Bru at 20:10). Fish Supper's first revert, on the other hand, changed the entire introduction, and I reverted this change only three times. Slrubenstein | Talk 21:21, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
  • No, The first revert was 18:53 as I mention above. Slrubenstein had made 6 by the time I reported this. Which is a clear violation of 3RR.
  • I believe it is relevant that I explained all my edits on the article's talk page, and Fish Supper provided no explanations for his/her revert. S/he characterizes my reverts as "unwarrented" when I provided detailed explanation for my changes. Needless to say, Fish Supper never responded to my explonation, or provided his or her own. Moreover, Fish Supper's edit summaries ("Naughty" and "Mouse Error") suggest vandalism. Clearly, Fish Supper is not concerned with the article contents, but only with reverting my work. Slrubenstein | Talk 21:21, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I am concerned with the acts of bullies. Maybe I should concern myself with you more. Fish Supper 21:41, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
You are the bully. All you have ever done is delete what I have written, and you have never explained your actions, nor responded to my explanations. Slrubenstein | Talk 21:57, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
You are the bully. You started it. You reverted what 2 other people wrote, and ignored their arguments. Don't try to turn this into a slagging match. Fish Supper 22:02, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)


[edit] Alert

Slrubenstein has started making personal insults against me in the edit summaries.

This is a lie. When have I ever made any personal insult against you in any edit summary? Slrubenstein | Talk 15:41, 29 May 2005 (UTC)

[edit] User:Fish Supper

Three revert rule violation on Jesus (edit|talk|history|links|watch|logs).

Fish Supper (talk • contribs) alias 81.156.92.196 (talk • contribs):

  • 1st revert at 20:22: [7]
  • 2nd revert at 20:24: [8]
  • 3rd revert at 20:28: [9]
  • 4th revert at 20:38: [10]

Reported by: Slrubenstein | Talk 21:21, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Comments: This user came to Wikipedia only today, [11], [12] and may be a sock-puppet or a friend of another user. At 20:22 Fish Supper reverted a number of changes I made, back to an earlier version by JimWae.

Fish Supper accuses me of violating the 3RR. I have made more than three reversions total, today, but concerning different passages (I reverted a one sentence change by Rev of Bru at 20:10). Fish Supper's first revert changed the entire introduction, and I reverted this change only three times.

  • The 3RR rule clearly applies to reversions of a PAGE, not a portion therof. It is EXPLICIT about this. Fish Supper 21:42, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I believe it is relevant that I explained all my edits on the article's talk page, and Fish Supper provided no explanations for his/her revert. Moreover, Fish Supper's edit summaries ("Naughty" and "Mouse Error" suggest vandalism. Clearly, Fish Supper is not concerned with the article contents, but only with reverting my work. Slrubenstein | Talk 21:21, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Note also the connection with User:The Rev of Bru [13], which would indicate even more reverts. Jayjg (talk) 22:00, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Note also that the Rev of Bru appears to be logged on at the same time as me, so its not really posible for us to be each other. Fish Supper 22:10, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Of course it is; all it requires is two browser sessions. Jayjg (talk) 22:12, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
How do you do that? Fish Supper 22:16, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Don't do it. :-) Jayjg (talk) 22:17, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
How do you do that AND get two different IP addresses at the same time? Fish Supper 22:18, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Fish Supper continues to revert any edit I make to the article. If this goes on, the effect is the same as if I were blocked from the article. Since I have always provided reasons for my edits, and sources when necessary or requested, and Fish Supper never does, this amounts to harassment. Slrubenstein | Talk 22:04, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)

It would be a striaght forward 3RR by Slrubenstein however you are allowed to revert banned users. CheeseDreams is currently under an abcom ban. If Fish Supper is indeed a sock then Slrubenstein's actions are legit. I will open the question on WP:AN/IGeni 22:08, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Slrubenstein made 4 reverts BEFORE I got involved. - at 20:10, 19:11, 18:53, 18:15 He should then be penalised for this alone, let alone the 4+ after I got involved. Fish Supper 22:15, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)

You are denying being that IP adress? I will leave this on to be decided on AN/IGeni 22:27, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I swear absolutely that I am not the Rev of Bru. I have no wish to live in glasgow. Fish Supper 22:30, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)

No problem; there's no evidence that the Rev of Bru lives there either. Jayjg (talk) 22:39, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Barr the fact of his being in the Church of Bru (going by his username). Fish Supper 22:49, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
LOL! Yes, it has been definitively proven that he is a member of the Church of Bru, therefore he must be from Glasgow. By the way, I'd never heard of the Church of Bru before, but you seem awfully familiar with it. Oh, and since it appears you know how to comment on Talk: pages, instead of arguing here why don't you mosey on over to the Talk:Historicity of Jesus page and start commenting there, rather than continually reverting that page while studiously avoiding the conversation regarding the article contents? Jayjg (talk) 22:54, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
There was a thing in the press about it a while back when there was a big story about Irn Bru in Russia, but if your not from the UK then I guess you won't get the same press. I haven't touched "Historicity of Jesus", so I have no idea why I should comment there? 81.156.177.21 23:16, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Rather than taking my good advice, I see you have reverted yet again. I've blocked you for 24 hours so you can think about ways of interacting on this article that involve more discussion and less reverting. Jayjg (talk) 23:04, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
(a)I haven't touched "historicity of Jesus", why do you think I have
(b)Why did you just block only me? When Slrubenstein made 4 more reverts - this makes you look corrupt.
Wrong article name, but the reversions keep rolling in. Slrubenstein was at least involved in discussing things on the Talk: page; you refused to. Jayjg (talk) 23:19, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
What about (b)?
What about (b)? As I said, at least Slrubenstein was discussing his edits on the Talk: page. You, on the other hand, refused to discuss your edits, and in any event are a sockpuppet who was created for the purpose of violating Wikipedia policy (in this case, the 3RR). I could have banned you permanently on those grounds alone. Jayjg (talk) 23:32, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
So? That is irrelevant. The 3RR policy is not "do not revert 3 times, unless you mention it in the talk page in which case you can revert as much as you like". It is DO NOT revert 3 times in one day, ever. So what about (b). Stop trying to come up with flimsy excuses and sidestepping of the issue and actually answer the question.

I've blocked Slrubenstein. If FS is a reincarnation of CD, it's up to Slrubenstein to show that before violating the 3RR. --Dante Alighieri | Talk 23:26, Apr 19, 2005 (UTC)

FS is someone's sockpuppet; ultimately it doesn't really matter whose. Jayjg (talk) 23:32, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
No it isn't. Edits by banned users may be reverted on sight. Mulitple editors think FS is CD. I have pulled the block.Geni 23:47, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Sockpuppets are not prohibited.
The distinction is important in that if Slrubenstein had proved that it was, indeed, a sockpuppet of a banned user, he wouldn't be blocked at the moment. --Dante Alighieri | Talk 23:34, Apr 19, 2005 (UTC)


It doesn't matter if these are all ultimately sockpuppets of the banned Cheese Dreams; Fish Supper (talk • contribs) is in any event clearly a sockpuppet created for the purpose of violating the 3RR. Look at her edits in relation to those of 81.156.92.196 (talk • contribs) and The Rev of Bru (talk • contribs). The Rev of Bru uses up her reverts on Jesus, and within minutes a new user is created and starts reverting for her, using the same IP address that fixes vandalism on the Rev of Bru's user page. Slrubenstein could himself have banned her permanently on those grounds alone. Jayjg (talk) 23:42, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)

The Rev of Bru was still editing Jesus when Fish Supper was created, and throughout - check the contributions. The timing is precisely because Fish Supper only stepped in to prevent bullying by Slrubenstein. N.b. the Rev of Bru DID NOT use up their "reverts", they only used one revert, they could still make 2 more.
I remain unconvinced by your reasoning, although I do not deny that you are making a coherent argument. If you like, unban Slrubenstein. I make it a policy of not engaging in ban-wars. If you feel that Slrubenstein should not be blocked, make it so. :) I maintain my personal opinion, however, that the block on Slrubenstein is appropriate, especially given his Admin status. --Dante Alighieri | Talk 23:49, Apr 19, 2005 (UTC)
I make it a general policy not to get involved in ban wars either. Jayjg (talk) 23:52, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
So is that why you unbanned Slrubenstein, even though you dont want a ban war?
I would not consider an unbanning by you to be "warring". I've made my position clear by banning. You would then make your position clear by unbanning. That's one "move" each. The fact that it results in Slrubenstein being unbanned if there's a "tie" is fine as I believe policy is that if there is a dispute as to whether someone should be blocked then we should err on the side of having them unblocked. It is only when one or both of us would seek to reassert our positions (by "reverting" to a different block state, for example) that it would be warring. Thus, you can ublock, but I won't reblock, and we'll be "even". --Dante Alighieri | Talk 23:56, Apr 19, 2005 (UTC)
What I fail to see is why the end result of Fish Supper being banned, but Slrubenstein being free, is considered in any way either a fair or an even handed application of the 3RR policy. This points to total corruption by people such as Jayjg.
This is the template to report violations from now on. Make a ***copy*** of the rest of this template ***above*** the "Report new violation" header, and fill in the fields appropriately. Do **not** edit **this** copy.
Note: "DiffLink" refers to a "diff" link from the history, not a link to a specific *version*; to get one, click the two radio-buttons on the appropriate adjacent history entries, then click on the "Compare selected versions" button, and then copy the URL of the page you are sent to, to get a  DiffLink. Doing this, rather than just linking to versions, makes it much easier for an admin to look at the violation you are reporting. See the example at the top of this page if needed. 


=== [[User:USERNAME]] ===

[[WP:3RR|Three revert rule]] violation on {{Article|ARTICLENAME}}.

{{subst:user|USERNAME}}: 
* 1st revert: [DiffLink Time]
* 2nd revert: [DiffLink Time]
* 3rd revert: [DiffLink Time]
* 4th revert: [DiffLink Time]



[edit] 81.156.177.21

81.156.177.21


19:28, 10 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Wikipedia:Requests for arbitration (→Statement by James F.)

19:24, 10 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Wikipedia:Requests for arbitration (→CheeseDreams)

02:09, 10 May 2005 (hist) (diff) User talk:Dr Zen

02:08, 10 May 2005 (hist) (diff) User:Dr Zen

02:06, 10 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Now

02:05, 10 May 2005 (hist) (diff) 4

02:04, 10 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Bye

02:03, 10 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Saying

02:02, 10 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Dream

02:02, 10 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Cheese

01:58, 10 May 2005 (hist) (diff) New Testament apocrypha

01:50, 10 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Acts of Paul

01:11, 10 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Acts of Paul and Thecla

00:45, 10 May 2005 (hist) (New) Acts of Thecla and Paul (top)

00:45, 10 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Acts of Peter and Paul (top)

00:29, 10 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Acts of Peter and Andrew

00:25, 10 May 2005 (hist) (New) Acts of Andrew and Matthias (top)

00:24, 10 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Acts of Andrew

00:23, 10 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Acts of Peter and Andrew

00:05, 10 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Acts of Peter and Paul

00:02, 10 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Acts of Peter and Paul

23:57, 9 May 2005 (hist) (New) Passion of Peter and Paul (top)

23:51, 9 May 2005 (hist) (New) Lithargoel (top)

23:50, 9 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Acts of Peter and the Twelve

23:27, 9 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Acts of Andrew

23:20, 9 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Disciple whom Jesus loved (Unfortunately that minor edit is extremely factually inaccurate. The beloved disciple is named MANY times by MANY people, e.g. people who think it was Lazarus or Mary, e.g. King James I.)

23:17, 9 May 2005 (hist) (diff) User talk:81.156.177.21

23:16, 9 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Acts of Andrew

23:15, 9 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Acts of Andrew

22:53, 9 May 2005 (hist) (New) The Martyrdom of Peter (top)

22:53, 9 May 2005 (hist) (New) Martyrdom of Peter (top)

22:52, 9 May 2005 (hist) (New) Acts of Philip (top)

22:50, 9 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Acts of Peter

22:35, 9 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Acts of John


20:42, 9 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Disciple whom Jesus loved ((a) lets not cut out the academic

version of the Lazarus identification - that it was a mystery cult, nor artificially sterilise what to many is a perfectly ordinary phrase - "boyfriend")

20:41, 9 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Disciple whom Jesus loved (→Which John is Which)

20:20, 9 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Acts of Phillip

20:04, 9 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Disciple whom Jesus loved ((a) lets not cut out the academic version of the Lazarus identification - that it was a mystery cult, nor artificially sterilise what to many is a perfectly ordinary phrase - "boyfriend")

19:53, 9 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Disciple whom Jesus loved (→Which John is Which)

19:44, 9 May 2005 (hist) (diff) User talk:81.156.177.21

02:46, 9 May 2005 (hist) (diff) New Testament apocrypha

02:44, 9 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Disciple whom Jesus loved (This is an encyclopedia. All relevant information is to be included, rather than cut because it doesn't suit someone's political or religious bias or bigotry)

02:43, 9 May 2005 (hist) (diff) User talk:81.156.177.21 (→Beloved Disciple)

02:41, 9 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Epistula Apostolorum

01:33, 9 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Gospel of Truth

01:15, 9 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Gospel of Truth


23:06, 8 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Mark 16 (→The ‘Shorter’ Ending)

23:00, 8 May 2005 (hist) (New) Freer logion (top)

22:43, 8 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Gospel of Phillip

22:42, 8 May 2005 (hist) (diff) Gospel of Phillip</nowiki>

19:13, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Function word

19:13, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Grammatical tense

19:12, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Ideophone

19:12, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Pleonasm

19:12, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Grammatical particle

19:11, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Metathesis

19:11, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Onomatopoeia

19:09, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Language suicide

19:08, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Prefix

19:08, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Tone (linguistics)

19:08, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Question

19:07, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Relative pronoun

19:00, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Jericho

19:00, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Vashti

18:58, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Esther (→The name)

18:54, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Exodus

18:54, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Leviticus

18:53, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Books of Kings

18:51, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Near sacrifice of Isaac

18:51, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Book of Joshua

18:49, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Books of Chronicles

18:48, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Book of Amos

18:47, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Psalms

18:46, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Book of Ruth

18:44, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Book of Daniel

17:47, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Weapons of mass destruction

17:45, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Wikipedia:WikiProject Countering systemic bias open tasks (→Limited geographic scope)

17:42, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Wikipedia:WikiProject Countering systemic bias open tasks (→Scientific claims to truth)

17:39, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (New) Path Integral Formulation (top)

17:38, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Wikipedia:WikiProject Countering systemic bias open tasks (→Scientific claims to truth - nothing to do with general relativity)

17:36, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Wikipedia:WikiProject Countering systemic bias open tasks (→Scientific claims to truth)

17:01, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (New) Eltham Hall (top)

17:01, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Derren Brown (→Séance)

12:45, 23 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Talk:Jesus (→Historicity Section)

21:27, 21 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/3RR (→User:Fish Supper)

21:17, 21 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Jesus (→Life and teaching according to the New Testament - its mary thats the virgin)

21:03, 21 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Jesus (Venerabilis Bedae)

20:59, 21 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Jesus (→Other perspectives)

20:56, 21 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Jesus (→Hinduism)

20:56, 21 Apr 2005 (hist) (New) Two source theory (top)

20:53, 21 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Jesus (→Historicity - remove duplicate link)

20:35, 21 Apr 2005 (hist) (New) Yeshua Bar Abba (top)

00:12, 20 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/3RR (→User:Fish Supper)

00:10, 20 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/3RR (→User:Fish Supper)

00:07, 20 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) User talk:Dante Alighieri (→HELP)

00:07, 20 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/3RR (→User:Fish Supper)

23:22, 19 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/3RR (→User:Fish Supper)

23:18, 19 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) User talk:Mirv (→HELP)

23:17, 19 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/3RR (→User:Fish Supper)

23:16, 19 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/3RR (→User:Fish Supper)

23:15, 19 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) User talk:Mirv (HELP)

23:15, 19 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) User talk:Lord Emsworth (HELP)

23:15, 19 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) User talk:Dante Alighieri (HELP)

23:15, 19 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) User talk:Angela (HELP)

23:11, 19 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) User talk:Brian0918 (HELP)

23:11, 19 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) User talk:ClockworkSoul (HELP)

23:10, 19 Apr 2005 (hist) (diff) User talk:Fennec (HELP)

[edit] Use of Talk page

This is supposed to be your Talk page — a place for other editors to leave messages for you, and (possibly) for you to reply. The above is at best off-putting, and surely inappropriate. Aside from anything else, it merely duplicates large chunks of material that can be found elsewhere. I've deleted it from Talk:New Testament apocrypha and other article and User Talk pages; you're entitled to do what you want here, but you should be aware that it doesn't look good to those coming to leave a message. Mel Etitis (Μελ Ετητης) 11:36, 29 May 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Arbitration

Melissadolbeer has opened a request for arbitration that involves you as a member of "Party 1" (at WP:RFAR). ~~~~ 09:31, 16 July 2005 (UTC)

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