Talk:Alveolar approximant

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Does this sound exist in any languages other than English? --Cotoco 19:10, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

Yes, though it's not a common sound. Ladefoged mentions it for Czech, though I've never heard it in that language. English /ɹ/ typically has coarticulation (labialization and pharyngealization) which may not be present in /ɹ/ in other languages, so they may not sound the same. Also, the English sound is often retroflex. kwami 20:29, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

I realize now that the Caipira accent of Portuguese (from Brazil), uniquely amongst all Portuguese accents/dialects AFAIK, also contains this sound. It is realized mostly, if not only, in syllable-end "r", before a consonant, as in "certo", "porta", "carne", etc. I wonder how it developed.--Cotoco 16:45, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

It's in very common use in Swedish as an allophone for /r/, particularly in the dialects around Stockholm, but by now also very common in the kind Standard Swedish of that is most widely used in broadcast media.

Peter ^Isotalo 13:30, 4 February 2006 (UTC)

Just recalled: many dialects of Netherlandic Dutch have it as an allophone of /r/. I can't recall if it's a southern or northern thang, though. Very common in Standard Dutch according to one of my classmates who's a native speaker.

Peter ^Isotalo 13:34, 12 February 2006 (UTC)

Can we have some of this information in the article perhaps? I just came to this talk page to ask about other languages, as I've always had the impression this is quite a rare sound. 86.136.1.31 01:00, 1 April 2006 (UTC)

It's in abundance in Albanian too....add that to the list! As for Dutch, I lived in Amsterdam for a while, and it's certainly used there by virtually everyone in such positions as 'haart' ('heart').Wfructose 22:23, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

I wish there was more information on /ɹ/ here besides strictly IPA classification and cross-linguistic comparative information. In English, /ɹ/ is interesting because it is late to develop and is difficult to produce. Foreign speakers have considerable difficulty learning /ɹ/. /ɹ/ requires a complex tongue posture - it's articulatory description cannot be simply reduced to place (alveolar) and manner (approximant). There are two ways of articulating /ɹ/; bunching and retroflexing (a gestural term not to be confused with the IPA place of articulation). Both postures also require tongue grooving and side-bracing against the teeth. Furthermore, lip-rounding is also associated with /ɹ/ production. Acoustically, /ɹ/ is unique because of its extrememly compressed f1-f3, particularily because of its low f3 value. /ɹ/'s low f3 values result from perturbations at three locations; rounded lips, alveolar constriction, and a constriction around the velum or pharynx. These constrictions cause perturbations at velocity maxima in the third harmonic of the voice signal, causing a sharp decrease in resonant frequency to below 1000 Hz.

Why not add that to the article then?! (Same goes for those who have introduced new information above). It sounds like you're sufficiently familiar with the research in this area that you could add at least a short paragraph to the article and back it up with published sources. I've tagged this article as needing attention from an expert so that someone knowledgeable in this area can incorporate the information you've supplied. 86.134.215.99 04:20, 28 December 2006 (UTC)