Talk:Airgíalla

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Airgíalla and Oriel should be merged Airgíalla is for the IRish Wikipedia, as Gaeilge

Support Oriel being moved into this article/Airgíalla. El Gringo 01:56, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

Do not support Oriel being moved into this article/Airgialla. (1) Oriel is not contemporaneous with Airgialla and (2)"Oriel" is not equivalent to "Airgialla". Suggest the Airgialla article refer to Oriel article, and that (3) Oriel article be edited. (1) "Oriel" is an Anglicized name that stems from Airgialla, first used after Anglo-Norman invasion of Ireland in 1169. (2) "Oriel" is not equivalent to "Airgialla". "Oriel" (and "Uriel") refers to only a portion of Airgialla territory, the portion comprising Counties Louth and Monaghan. The rest of the Airgialla tribes never thought of themselves as belonging to Oriel. (3) The bones of the Oriel article are: Peadar Livingstone, in The Monaghan Story, says "The Ui Nadsluaig family of the O'Carrolls was pushing into Louth at this stage [1100's]and, under Donnchadh O'Carroll, a strong new Airgialla kingdom was established with Louth as its centre." This new kingdom was called Oriel. Oriel was short-lived. R. F. Foster explains, in The Oxford History of Ireland, that “John, lord of Ireland and later king of England (1199-1216) divided the O’Carroll (O Cearbhaill) kingdom between Gilbert Pipard and Bertram de Verdon on the death of King Murchadh in 1189. Louth, or Uriel, was rapidly colonized at the same time. Other Anglo-Normans were given grants all over Ireland in the 1200’s.” The Ua Cearbhaill (O’Carroll) family were Lords of Fernmaig in County Monaghan prior to expanding into County Louth and establishing the kingdom of Oriel. The MacMathghamhna (or MacMahon or McMahon) family, also of the clan Ui Nadsluaig, became dominant in County Monaghan after the Anglo-Normans dominated the O'Carroll family.66.202.22.217 20:47, 8 June 2006 (UTC)