Talk:Yao people

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[edit] Language

the article needs to tell what language they speak. --Gringo300 08:07, 23 Jun 2005 (UTC)

I've added something about the Iu Mien language one of the main languages they speak. Carl Kenner 16:42, 8 December 2005 (UTC)
I'm not convinced that the written standard described in the Iu Mien article is the same as the one used in China. This is just a guess (see User_talk:CarlKenner), and it should be clarified. — Babelfisch 01:50, 9 December 2005 (UTC)
I've just reverted the three changes made by CarlKenner:
  • "they speak several different languages: several languages called Mien (Chinese: Miǎnyǔ 勉语) (such as Iu Mien language) and Bunu (Bùnǔyǔ 布努语) [...]; Lakkia (Lājiāyǔ 拉珈语) and Zhuang [...]; and Chinese. (CarlKenner's insertion in bold face)
  • "The lowland-living Lanten of Laos are related to the Mien. There are also many Yao living in the United States, mainly refugees from Laos who speak the Iu Mien language." (CarlKenner's insertion in bold face)
Two things: First, it is not necessary to have three links to "your" article on the Iu Mien language here; seconde, the status of that language is not clear at all. On your own discussion page you said that you "guessed" that this language is identical with the written standard used in China. A guess is not sufficient evidence, and the only souces you quote are two websites of Yao people in exile in the US.
  • "research results of a Yao-American scholar (Yuēsè Hòu 约瑟·候)" had been reverted by CarlRenner to "research results of the Yao-American Yuēsè Hòu 约瑟·候".
The original sentence was my own translation from Chinese: 中共十一届三中全会后，广西民族学院、中国社会科学院共同创制了一套新瑶文方案，结合旅美的美籍瑶族华人约瑟·候博士的研究成果，制订了适合于各支瑶族的拉丁字母瑶文，新瑶文声母30个，韵母121个，声调8个。(emphasis added) I later changed it because "Yuēsè Hòu 约瑟·候" is obviously a transliteration into Chinese from another language, probably English or Yao or a combination of those two, and it isn't the scholar's real name. I was so far unable to find out the original name. I don't think that he would like to have his name distorted in that way; that's why I changed the sentence in the way I did. For comparison: "CarlKenner" would become something like Kǎ'ěr Kěnnà'ěr 卡尔·肯纳尔; that wouldn't make much sense either. The alternative would be to drop his name altogether, but I was hoping that someone could do some research and provide his real name.
  • "Yao refugees who came to the United States from Vietnam and Laos use a written language called Iu Mien. This might be similar to or identical with the standard Mien language used in China." had been reverted by Carl Renner to "For an example of how the unified alphabet is used to write Iu Mien, a common Yao language, see Iu Mien language."
I made this change because as I've said before, I haven't seen any sources that suggest that the language described as "Iu Mien" is a standard used in China, Vietnam or Laos; it's not clear at all that "Iu Mien" and the "unified alphabet" mentioned here are identical. I've just tried to clarify the facts in accordance with the sources quoted.
Remember: this discussion page is the place to argue for or against such changes - please don't just ignore it. And: abuse is not appreciated. (see Talk:Iu Mien language) —Babelfisch 06:25, 9 December 2005 (UTC)
I've now added more detailed information about other languages they speak. -- Carl Kenner 15:53, 10 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Deletions by CarlKenner

I've reverted Carl Kenner's extensive deletions on this discussion page: see comparison of versions before and after his deletions: first phase: deletion and slander; second phase: inserting a comment. Then I re-inserted his comment. You can't just delete discussions, that's vandalism and you can get blocked for that. Don't forget that you can't mask your deletions, the version history of this page will show them. Stop that nonsense. —Babelfisch 07:06, 13 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Ming

This is rubbish and I've removed it:

"Many of these groups are noted for their rather tall stature compared to that of some of their other countrymen, as evident by perhaps the most famous Yao national, NBA player Yao Ming."

The name of this nationality and Yao Ming's surname (瑶 and 姚) are both pronounced Yáo, but he does not belong to that group. — Babelfisch 01:16, 5 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Yao and Iu Mien

It has seemingly become apparent that the "ethnicity", "Yao" is no more than a longstanding term used by the host Chinese. These peoples traditionally do not call themselves "Yao". The term has grouped peoples together that may or may not have had related ancestry. As stated here, there are different languages spoken among distinct cultures. Although they share festivities of the same creation story, PanHu (Pien Hung), it is hard to determine what the relations are beyond that fact. It is a comparable scenario to group Jew, British, German, Spanish, etc. peoples together by common belief of Adam and Eve. This term "Yao" became official in 1945(?) by classification for Government purposes.

The Yao nationality is constituted after 1949. Rossl

Recent History: The Mien are primarily refugees of the US "Secret War" occupation in Laos. Most arrived in Laos/Vietnam/Thailand from China during the late 1800s. After communist victory and political escape, many were sponsored to western countries such as the United States, France, Australia, New Zealand, etc. This group is also under the "Yao" classification in China.

Historical, International contacts have been made between American Mien and Chinese Iu Mien. Although there were some that spoke the same language as Mien Americans, such as the famous Professor Pan Chengqian and family; there have been others under the "Yao" Classification that do not, with unintelligible conversation, clearly distinct cultures, food, dress and more.

It is extremely difficult to find history behind Mien origin when the term "Yao" is used. So many sources (both Western and Chinese) describe the "Yao" history, yet the particular language is never defined.

Yes, this makes any study of Yao material difficult. In fact, the Bunu, who speak a Miao language, has different traditions and culture from the Mien. Rossl
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