Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Missouri

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Springfield, Missouri Metropolitan Area created.Rt66lt 01:20, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Project Template

Project template is currently on all county talk pages.Rt66lt 00:39, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

Started placing project template on city talk pages. Stopped at Exeter. Will be unable to work on anymore until April 16.Rt66lt 01:29, 9 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] A couple of resources

There's a couple of excellent resources I would like to recommend to anyone involved with this project:

[1] Moser's Directory of Towns, Villages, and Hamlets in Missouri at the Springfield-Greene County Library website
[2] Missouri Official Manual (aka "The Blue Book").

Both are available online and have a lot of information. The Secretary of State's office will mail you a free, hardcover copy of the book (you may have to live in Missouri to get a physical copy for free). Rt66lt 20:15, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the resources! i posted them on the main page. --preschooler @heart my talk - contribs 06:34, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Wikipedia:Version 1.0 Editorial Team cooperation

Hello. I'm a member of the Version 1.0 Editorial Team, which is looking to identify quality articles in Wikipedia for future publication on CD or paper. We recently began assessing articles using these criteria, and we are are asking for your help. As you are most aware of the issues surrounding your focus area, we are wondering if you could provide us with a list of the articles that fall within the scope of your WikiProject, and that are either featured, A-class, B-class, or Good articles, with no POV or copyright problems. Do you have any recommendations? If you do, please post your suggestions at the listing of all active Places WikiProjects, and if you have any questions, ask me in the Work Via WikiProjects talk page or directly in my talk page. Thanks a lot! Tito xd^{(?!? - help us)} 06:35, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tom Pendergast Collaboration

- I used thier online form to ask a librarian. here is what I wrote.

Dear Librarian, I am writing you reperesenting en.wikipedia.org . The reason i am writing you is because i am assisting in the modification of an article on Kansas City mob boss Tom Pendergast. we would like to use your picture of Pendergast, which was found at the URL http://www.kclibrary.org/localhistory/popup.cfm?http://www.kclibrary.org/lhimgs/kcpl/regular/pendergast_reg.jpg#. According to your acceptable use policy, "1. U.S. copyright law (Title 17, U.S. Code) prohibits the unauthorized reproduction or distribution of copyrighted materials, except as permitted by the principles of "fair use." Users may not copy or distribute electronic materials (including electronic mail, text, images, programs or data) without the explicit permission of the copyright holder. Any responsibility for any consequences of copyright infringement lies with the user; the Library expressly disclaims any liability or responsibility resulting from such use." I am writing asking for explicit permission to use the picture on wikipedia. wikipedia is completly non-profit, and is an online free encyclopedia that anyone can write. the picture would be used solely for use on wikipedia, and we would "tag" it to state that it's use on wikipedia classifies as "fair use" and that reproduction elsewhere would be prohibited without the consent of the Kansas City Public Library. thank you for your time and consideration. Sincerely, Austin Roberts Wikipedia user Preschooler.at.heart .

--preschooler @heart my talk - contribs 06:02, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

What is the status of the picture? Have you heard back from them yet? Amalas =^_^= 17:56, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

Umm, images uploaded to Wikipedia are definitely not for use only on Wikipedia. Please read the image use policy. Wikipedia's content is specifically meant to be copied and reproduced by anyone, even for commercial purposes. Images with non-free licenses are not wanted. Fair-use images are accepted only grudgingly since fair-use usually only applies to reproduction within the U.S.

To make sure that you are accurately representing how requested material may be used, you should use or adapt an example from Wikipedia:Boilerplate request for permission in your request. --Kbh3^rd talk 04:48, 5 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Discussion from Project Page

Folks:

I need a little help. I'm a contributor to the Wiki St. Louis. We are having a debate over whether to include a quote by T.S. Eliot on the page. I'm the proponent of placing the quote as a sort of: preamble to the whole shebang.

I am pasting the current "controversy" here. What I am asking is, could we please get some more opinion on the subject? Or any other ideas. I'm trying to find a concensus here, but need your help. Many Thanks: Mark PrestonMark Preston 17:45, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

Dear User:GT If I don't hear from you at this page within 7 days from Friday April 7, 2006, I am moving the quote back to where it came from. It seems to me you were plenty "quick on the draw" to move it, but have nothing to say since Birgitte "corrected" your complaint.

If you do you'll be violating policy as well as breaking layout conventions. Making that quote the "preamble" to the article forces the article (and by extension, Wikipedia) to adopt the point of view that St. Louis is a wonderful city to live in and better than Boston, New York, or London. After all, the great T.S. Eliot said so and we must agree since we think that quote should represents the purpose or basis of the rest of the article (that is what a preamble is for, you know). However, placing it in a Quotations section is fine because then the quote is just presented as information relevant to the city. Additionally, the Wikipedia Guide to Layout prescribes quotations to be placed, if not embedded within the article text itself, in a Quotations section like I have created. And nowhere on that page or any other does it provide any provisions for articles having preambles. You won't find another article on Wikipedia that uses a preamble like what you're suggesting and certainly not one consisting of just a quote. GT 08:26, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

I don't think having a quote about St. Louis from an author "forces" a POV upon anybody or anything. It's a common practice in other neutral documents, such as ... encyclopedias. I am, however, concerned that we'd have this one article with a quote and no others that do, it's inconsistant. Having a little quote box is a common stylistic device to convey information in a more interesting and less academic and dry manner than rote categorization. Bjsiders 14:53, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

I understand and if someone wants to create that box and insert it in part of the article where T.S. Eliot is discussed the same way a graphic would be inserted, I wouldn't have any problems with that whatsoever. However this was discussed and placed as a "preamble", which by its nature gives the impression that the opinion of the writers and of the encyclopedia agree with T.S. Eliot that one would be fortunate to grow up in St. Louis rather than the other big cities. Irrelevant as it is, I don't know if such things are acceptible in other encyclopedias, seeing as though I haven't opened a printed encyclopedia since high school, but on Wikipedia writers are not allowed to make such statements of opinion on the subjects they're writing about. So not only is it inappropriate as a preamble but such preambles don't even exist on Wikipedia. GT 21:15, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

GT Please note that niether Wikipedia:Describing points of view] or Wikipedia:Guide to layout are officail policy. I realize that you do not like the quotation, but please do not tell people they will be breaking policy. As I said before, this quote does not make the article POV. It is obviously an opinion. lets look at it again:

"The City of St. Louis has affected me more deeply than any other environment has ever done, I consider myself fortunate to have been born here, rather than in Boston, or New York, or London." —T.S. Eliot. Letter to Marquis Childs quoted in St. Louis Post Dispatch, October 15, 1930.

The author says he feels "affected" and "fortunate." This is not POV about how great St Louis is, it is personal experience. The quote clearly states he was born in St. Louis which puts it in proper perspective. Anyone who reads it will give it the same weight they give anyone who was "born in thier favorite city." I don't mind having this one quote, but I really dislike a Quotations sections which will soon hold 5 or ten quotes.--Birgitte§β ʈ Talk 13:55, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

When I said policy I linked to WP:NPOV. Please don't misattribute statements to me that I didn't make. As far as the layout conventions, they may not be policy but I don't see a pressing reason to break them. And it is the selective usage of that particular, highly favorable quote that creates the "POV" that is not allowed. GT 21:15, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

Quoting is not POV. Especially in this example, which is clearly his personal experience. Maybe if the quote said "St. Louis is a better city than New York," you could convince me. What is the bias here? Is it baised to say the city someone was born in has a greater affect on them than any other? Is biased to say a person feels lucky they were born in the city they grew up in? I don't know how else to explain it. This quote does not break policy, no one should worry on that aspect. Obviously you still don't like it. Many other people do like it. I certainly prefer it over a quotations section. Sorry about the misunderstanding above, I struck my comments. The layout conventions not closely adhered to and self-contradictory. They say that there should be a Quotation section and then stated it should be removed and replaced with a banner to Wikiquote. It looks like we can all agree on the graphic quote box though. I actually like that even better.--Birgitte§β ʈ Talk 22:19, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

I agree, it's very common and unremarkable to be proud of the city you were born in. That's why I originally said I don't even think the quote should be in the article. But if the rest of you want it in the form of a quote box near discussion of famous natives or something, that's your decision to make, as it's not that big of a deal to me. The idea of a "preamble" in particular (and specifically, one that is overwhelmingly favorable about the city) is what I have problems with as I've gone into detail about already. GT 06:10, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

The quote is an illustration from a notable native. The photos in this article are also illustrations. The photos are terribly POV in that they "promote" the city. Why not feature photos from inside the public toilets in the city's main train station? I think the way a city keeps its toilets serves as a strong indicator of a city's overall quality of life (seriously). Many would argue, however, that this article's photos are indeed encyclopedic and suitable. I won't argue the point. However, all the justifications these people would use in defending glamorous photos of the city should also apply to Elliot's quote. His quote provides a unique and beautiful tribute to the city. The fact that other encyclopedias occasionally introduce an article with a literary quotation simply adds weight to this and previous arguments. Please replace the preamble, provide some new justification for not using it, or start replacing the beautiful illustrations with those of more "typical" experiences. Rklawton 22:47, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

If you have better photos that more accurately and correctly represent the city then feel free to upload them and insert them in the article. As it stands, the current ones do a good job and I have no problems with them. I agree about the toilets and I encourage you to conduct a study of public toilets in every big city in America and report on the results (just not here). If St. Louis has interesting results then I'd support mentioning them here.

And, beautiful as you may find the quote to be, we are not here to make a tribute. That should give you an idea of why it's an inappropriate "preamble", as though such a thing were possible here. GT 06:10, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

It would seem that you missed the point. 1) The photos provided are POV tributes to the city. 2) The photos provided are typical of photos that illustrate just about every city article (see East St. Louis, Illinois - and don't need to be replaced. 3) the quote is not atypical of articles about home cities of famous authors.

It's a fact that Elliot wrote what he did, and it is included as a fact, as a real illustration. The fact that Elliot's comments reflect his POV might disqualify them, except that folks tend to be interested in reading the comments of Nobel Prize recipients.

Lastly, why is it you seem to be the only one arguing for removal? Please stop and consider this. Rklawton 13:44, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Images and Maps

How do we tag images as being a part of {{WikiProject Missouri}}? Do we put it on the talk page, the same as for articles? I just want to check before I do some of those. Amalas 20:11, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Missouri State Highways

Since these are part of the WikiProject Missouri State Highways, a child of this project, would it be redundant to list these as part of the MO WikiProject also?Rt66lt

I would say so. --KHill-LTown 04:42, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Category:Missouri railroads

Someone who knows more about this than I do should probably check over this category. There are some railroads categorized as Missouri railroads, but nothing in the articles states they are in Missouri. Conrail and Southern Pacific are a couple.Rt66lt 17:24, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Missouri History Stub

I would like to request that a Missouri History Stub be created. I recently add a Generic Missouri Stub to the St. Louis Arsenal page, but I think there should be a stub for history. The picture for the stub could be a picture of Lewis and Clark since they are important to Missouri History, since they travel across the state, and since St. Louis just had a big celebration about it two years ago.

[edit] MISSOURI STUB!!!!

There is a movement to try and elimanate the Missouri Generic Stub. Go to the Wikipedia:Stub types for deletion page and scroll down to April 23rd. It is the second one down on the list. Vote to say our stub!

I have gone through a mess of Missouri Articles and added a stub tag to those that apply. The Category:Missouri stubs has gone for 3 entries to 20. I will do more later. (Steve 17:24, 29 April 2006 (UTC))

[edit] Victory!

Thanks to our voting we have saved the Missouri Generic Stub. Viva la Missouri Project!

Just Remember to keep an eye out for mor Missuri related stubs. (Steve 00:07, 30 April 2006 (UTC))

[edit] Missouri State Fair needs rewriting

I just flagged Missouri State Fair as being a copyright violation from http://www.mostatefair.com/beginning.html. We need a new article there. I've invited the original author, who copied the material, to help contribute to an original article. Anyone else who wants to jump in, please do

By the way, folks, it was pretty durn obvious from the prose that that article was not the original work of a wikipedian. Please keep an eye out for such violations. To test, just cut the core of a unique-looking sentence and paste it into Google with quotes around it. In this case, searching on "prompts a Missouri farm family to load up the kids" immediately found the source.

--Kbh3^rd talk 23:10, 4 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Grant's Farm will need expanding

I just created this. It could use some expansion if anyone wants to have a go at it. --Gregh2k5 19:41, 9 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Bob Holden page

I just reorganized (and added a little content to) the page for former Governor Bob Holden. It still needs a lot more info about his governorship, imo. Also, if someone could provide the year and/or a source for when he called the legislature into special session for higher ed funding, I'd greatly appreciate it. Cheers and happy editing! --Kchase02 (T) 05:21, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Crime and Social issues of St. Louis, Missouri

The section in the St. Louis, Missouri article on social and crime issues is not a summary of the main article Crime and Social issues of St. Louis, Missouri...it IS the main article. Either way, both of these need to be cleaned up. Could someone lend a hand in doing that? I'm not an expert on St. Louis, especially not its social/crime issues. So if soemone could pitch in with that, it'd be much appreciated. Metros232 14:32, 3 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] History buff needed

Please check out List of current and former capital cities in the United States and make sure that Missouri's capital cities are listed accurately. A word of warning: the page does contain quite a bit of complicated wiki formatting, so if you're not comfortable editing it, just post your changes on the talk page and someone more experienced will apply them to the article. JEK 19:53, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Nominate articles for Portal:United States

I've worked for the past month to update Portal:United States and keep it better maintained. Though, I think the Portal:United States would be even better with broader participation. One way to do that is instead of choosing the "selected article" myself each week, if others would nominate articles and help make decisions. (same goes for pictures, though these are stocked up through July 29) If there is anything related to Missouri (or anything else related to the U.S. - culture, music, literature, geography, history, politics, ...), please nominate. I'd also like people to weigh in on the nominations and help select what should be featured. Thanks. --Aude (talk contribs) 23:32, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Abraham McClellan Deletion Proposal

User:Somerset219 has proposed that the article I created on former Missouri State Treasurer Abraham McClellan (Missouri politician) be deleted. Assistance from my fellow Wikipedians on WikiProject Missouri is requested in order to improve the article and avoid deletion. Under the terms of the deletion tag used in the article, it could be deleted within five days of July 27, 2006. --TommyBoy 01:44, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

Deletion has been averted. --TommyBoy 01:33, 29 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Marlin Perkins

Marlin Perkins (Mo native) article is incorrect. He did not fake lemmings jumping off a cliff. If you read the article cited it is clear that the lemmings incident was about Disney not Perkins.

However for some reason I cannot edit the article or enter a discussion - all it shows is a reference to "WikiProject Missouri" so I came here to see if one of you would be so kind as to fix the article. Thanks http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marlin_Perkins --J nc 23:26, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Invite

Wanted to let you know that WP:BIOGRAPHY has added a "work group" called Politics and government, and so wanted to invite you to participate on any biography-type articles. The section for MO is here and if there's interest, we can beef it up to look like the newly-created Virginia one plange 05:28, 25 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Project banner

As I was browsing Category:WikiProject banners, I noticed that your {{WikiProject Missouri}} was incorrectly added to the talk pages. It appears that someone copied the code (after hitting the edit button on the template page) and then copied that into articles. As it is a project banner, it would probably be best not to substitute it, but if this project would prefer to have it substituted, the code would be {{subst:WikiProject Missouri}}. This keeps the category from being added to articles pages. -- Heave n's Wrath ^Talk 16:36, 29 August 2006 (UTC)

I'm not sure how that happened. I know I always put {{WikiProject Missouri}} (without subst'ing). I'll go through that Cat and clear out the Missouri stuff. Thanks for the notification. ~ Amalas rawr ^{=^_^=} 18:25, 29 August 2006 (UTC)

Okay, they should all be fixed now. ~ Amalas rawr ^{=^_^=} 18:58, 29 August 2006 (UTC)

Sounds good. Thanks for fixing it so quickly. -- Heave n's Wrath ^Talk 19:34, 29 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Miles Davis

Miles Davis is up for a featured article review. Detailed concerns may be found here. Please leave your comments and help us address and maintain this article's featured quality. Sandy 19:53, 16 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Invitation to new WikiProject

A new WikiProject has been started, and may be of interest to members here. It is WikiProject National Register of Historic Places. It covers all listings on the Register, in all states and territories. Should you be so inclined, please feel free to join. And spread the word to any other interested parties. -Ebyabe 19:49, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Project directory

Hello. The WikiProject Council has recently updated the Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Directory. This new directory includes a variety of categories and subcategories which will, with luck, potentially draw new members to the projects who are interested in those specific subjects. Please review the directory and make any changes to the entries for your project that you see fit. There is also a directory of portals, at User:B2T2/Portal, listing all the existing portals. Feel free to add any of them to the portals or comments section of your entries in the directory. The three columns regarding assessment, peer review, and collaboration are included in the directory for both the use of the projects themselves and for that of others. Having such departments will allow a project to more quickly and easily identify its most important articles and its articles in greatest need of improvement. If you have not already done so, please consider whether your project would benefit from having departments which deal in these matters. It is my hope that all the changes to the directory can be finished by the first of next month. Please feel free to make any changes you see fit to the entries for your project before then. If you should have any questions regarding this matter, please do not hesitate to contact me. Thank you. B2T2 19:05, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Climate

This article lacks information about climate.
Please add it if you can, citing reliable sources
Many consider a climate section in an encyclopedia article about a nation/state/geographic region to be ubiquitous.
Please remove this message once this section has been written.

Missouri lacks a climate section.

[edit] New proposed project

There is a new project proposal at Wikipedia:WikiProject/List of proposed projects#WikiProject Kansas City which some members of this project may be interested in. Badbilltucker 02:37, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

Also, Wikipedia:WikiProject Silver Dollar City could use at least one photograph, if anyone has any. Badbilltucker 00:11, 21 November 2006 (UTC)

Wikipedia:WikiProject Kansas City is now started - Missourians may want to join the party/endeavour/workload. :) -- nae'blis 20:18, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Missouri Stubs

I just wanted to remind everyone of the various Stubs related to this group that needs to be expanded or rewritten.

[[Category:Missouri stubs]]
[[Category:Missouri politician stubs]]
[[Category:Missouri geography stubs]]
[[Category:Missouri school stubs]]
[[Category:Missouri State Highway stubs]]

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