Wikipedia talk:WikiProject College Basketball

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College Basketball
WikiProject
Information
Project page talk
College Basketball Portal talk
Participants talk
2006 NCAA DI Season talk
2006 Rankings talk
2006 DI Tournament talk
Project category talk
Master Table talk
Team images talk
Year Page Format talk
Departments
Assessment talk
  •Worklist  •Log
Collaboration of the Month talk
Tools
Project banner talk
Coach infobox talk
Season infobox talk
Persondata talk
{{subst:CBBwelcome-project}} talk
Userboxes
Project Userbox talk
NCAA Teams talk
edit · changes


To-do list for Wikipedia:WikiProject College Basketball: edit · history · watch · refresh

Major Core Improvements Needed

  • Merger still not complete Merger completed
  • Sub-Projects not ready
  • Ranking system for articles not complete
  • Unflashy WikiProject Page (see WikiProject Judaism for good example)

Maintain and Improvement

To be Created

  • Write team articles
  • Infoboxes n' Templates not finished
  • Write coach articles
  • Make a 'College Basketball Barnstar'. Of worthless importance, but if someone's bored, it could be fun.
  • Make 'welcome' templates

Contents

[edit] Coach and player infoboxes

We need to create a standard coach and player infobox. I used the college football coach one for Dean Smith and I think that works well. I am sure we could use a similar one for players. Remember 16:36, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

I've created Template:Infobox NCAA Athlete. It has a small error with a spurious pipe "|". I've been unable to discover the cause. Please offer suggestions or modifications.

[edit] Templates

I've created poll templates which can list the top 25 for whatever poll. They were designed to reduce some of the work in pages such as 2006 NCAA Division I-A football rankings where you can see what the {{16ColPollTable}} would look like in finished form. I'd like to know how many weeks the college basketball typically has polls for. In football it's typically 16 and maybe 17 and never any longer. But is the basketball season longer (I'm ignorant here, sorry!). How many weeks maximum would you folks need?

Also, I'd like to create the project template for you folks. For the project template, do you want ratings categories which the College football project (and others) has used which then adds the class (stub, start, B, GA, A, FA) and importance or priority (low, mid, high, top) tags. You can always add it later if you decide you don't want to worry about that for now.

A few suggestions as well: I have found the navigation box and a "Master Team Table" that we developed for the CFB project invaluable. You can see them at: {{WPCFB}} and Wikipedia:WikiProject College football/MasterTeamTable. The navigation box mainly goes within the project pages, but I've added it to my user page as well which makes things even easier for me to find. We even have a partially filled table that lists some basketball items as well at Wikipedia:WikiProject College football/Team Articles. I could help set some of this up for you as well.

Anyways, let me know what I can help you with and I'll get to work. Thanks. --MECU≈talk 16:16, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

For starters, I'm for the most part a college football fan who finds himself entertained by college basketball in the off-season. That said, I checked the ESPN website for the amount of weeks in a season. In seasons past, there have been nineteen weeks of basketball - though, I'm sure it may vary from time to time, I think that's what you should go with.
I'd love it if we could have a real rating system with class and importance like the college football article has - it makes life a lot easier in the long run. For the record, I note that the other college basketball Wikiproject that hasn't yet been merged, has this template available. However, it links to the wrong project - a rather easy problem to fix, however - it still needs the ratings and class stuff thrown to the bottom of it.
On top of all the suggestions you threw out there, we need to complete this merger soon. Nothing says "Don't join" like a merger tag, no flashy graphics, and a starter project. Despite its age, it really hasn't gotten off the ground from what I can tell - the [[1]] is the best example of that.
Your help's greatly appreciated - and I hope you can help get this project off the ground (or what it's at now). --NomaderTalk 22:21, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
I'm with you Nomader. Any help you can provide (Mecu) is greatly appreciated. I like the look of most of those CFB templates. I'd love to see them adopted. The Master Team Template is great, although we'll have many more teams, even if we just stick to D-I basketball.
Also, let's definitely do this merge.
I'm the one who created the CBB portal a few months ago, and I've let it sit idle. Now that the season is started, I'm ready to get back engaged and get it going again. Daveahern 16:06, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
MECU, I greedily copied the navigation box from the CFB project and created a CBB version. I'm linking it on the main project page now. We can decide what sections we do or do not want. Only a few are currently populated. - Daveahern 19:03, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
For the record, I'll be changing a few of the colors on that navigation box - if this ends up being only a temporary addition, that's fine by me. Anyhow, what we need now is to have an avaible set of quality and class rankings for our tags on talk pages, neither of which have been made. Also, I've been recently editing the Basketball Portal - I think we all need to give a little bit more attention to it if we want this WikiProject to succeed. --NomaderTalk 20:39, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
Edit: I have changed the current template's colors to a more orange-red scheme to make it look less like College Football's. --NomaderTalk 20:51, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
Agreed on the Portal page needing more work. I did some edits on it this morning and will hope to get to some more soon. -- Daveahern 21:07, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
Looks like things are starting to move. Great! I found these templates too {{NCAA Men's Division I Basketball Tournament}} and {{National Invitation Tournament}} so someone (you should recruit those who edited a lot on the history pages) has been at work. I'll make up to 19Col/week of my poll table then. --MECU≈talk 14:43, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Priorities

So what are our priorities here? I see listed on the main page:

  1. Create non-existing teams' articles and edit existing college teams' articles.
  2. Keep the quality of the articles maintained up.
  3. Share our comments and feedback.

I think we also need to add maintain the CBB portal like Nomader talks about above. Probably also that we want to have timely information? For example current rankings (polls) and news about recent games or events? (See the College Football rankings)

In addition to that, what are the WikiProject management (meta) priorities? Obviously creating some templates is one. Anything else? I'm new to the whole WikiProject thing. - Daveahern 21:23, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

I think our first goal should get the WikiProject up and running. We need to get cracking on the articles themselves, but it's rather worthless for us when we still have these problems ahead of us:
  • Merger still not complete
  • Sub-Projects not ready
  • Ranking system for articles not complete
  • Unflashy WikiProject Page (see WikiProject Judaism)
  • Infoboxes n' Templates not finished
Once we finish with all that, it gets no easier, as we have some other things we have to do.
All that aside, we could then do a few more things with regards to the project itself, not college football.
  • Make a 'College Basketball Barnstar'. Of worthless importance, but if someone's bored, it could be fun.
  • Make 'welcome' templates
  • Make 'You might be interested in us!' templates
And, there you have it. My priorities - bolded priorities are the most important in my opinion. --NomaderTalk 22:13, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
No arguments from me so far. As far as the merger - there's only one user over on the other CBB wikiproject, so I think we can get this taken care of quickly. I've copied over all the links to the templates listed over there. Then the only issue is whether our goals/scope need to be adjusted to include what Orlière wants with the other one. As far as I'm concerned, it's close enough. If Orlière wants to add anything to our goals/scope, more power to him/her. -- Daveahern 23:07, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
Also, I think I'll start copying the CFB assessment/rating pages over here. (I'm sure they won't mind as they "borrowed" it from someone else anyway :-). Once we have it started, we can discuss what changes/differences we want. -- Daveahern 23:15, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
Don't worry, the college football standards are for the most part, standard, with the exception of specifics, which will need to be edited anyhow for this project. Pretty much, it's time to get to work - I'm beggining work on the Collaboration of the Month page. --NomaderTalk 04:34, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] TfD nomination of Template:NCAA Tournament MOP Men

Template:NCAA Tournament MOP Men has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for Deletion page. Thank you. --American Patriot 1776 17:36, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Monthly Collaboration has begun

Alright, I've created the monthly collaboration page - for it to work, we'll need everyone's help to keep it going. Even if you don't know much about the subject chosen, you can still give a hand by looking a few things up and finding out about them. I've nominated for a creation of the UNC Tar Heels page - I request that we stave off the college basketball page for a bit until we get a few more users on board. If anyone thinks that the UNC page would be a bad choice, feel free to nominate something else, but we should get this started in a few days. --NomaderTalk 05:01, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] College coach template

Probably should add Template talk:College coach infobox to the templates section. Remember 15:12, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Naming Standard

I propose that the WPCBB project uses the following naming standards:

  • General Schools
  • General Athletics
    • <School> <Mascot>, ie Colorado Buffaloes (whereas University of Colorado at Boulder Buffaloes is wrong)
  • Sport specific
    • <School> <Mascot> (wo)mens basketball, ie Colorado Buffaloes mens basketball (whereas Colorado Buffaloes basketball is wrong)
    • If the mens and womens are known by different nicknames (aka <Mascot>), whatever is appropriate should be used in the article title
    • Even if a school only has a mens team (for example), it shall still use the mens in the title. If the article Colorado Buffaloes basketball was erroneously created for whatever reason, it shall be changed to a redirect into the general athletic article for the school (ie, Colorado Buffaloes, whereas a redirect to either mens or womens page would be preferential and wrong)
  • Season specific pages
    • 20xy-xz <School> <Mascot> (wo)mens basketball team, ie 2006-07 Colorado Buffaloes womens basketball team (whereas 2006 Colorado Buffaloes womens basketball team is wrong and if created, merely moved/redirected to the 2006-07 page)

The first two are in line with the WPCFB project and the rest of the university naming conventions. The third is to give no preference to mens or womens at a school and also in line with WPCFB. The fourth is also in line with WPCFB with the added -xz to make clear the season, since basketball spans the calendar year and having just 2006 or 2007 (for example) would be ambiguous. This system has worked well for the WPCFB, and having similar naming convention across Wikipedia would bolster both projects.

When linking from articles to another school, it is preferred to link to the sport/same gender page if available. If not, the general athletic page and if not available, then the school page (which all are available) and if not available then left as a red link. Linking to the season specific page should only be done from another season specific page with a {{seealso}} from a game-by-game breakdown or a See Also section at the bottom. See 2006 Colorado Buffaloes football team for an example. --MECU≈talk 17:21, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

This all sounds rather reasonable to me. -- Daveahern 19:30, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
Personally, I think that names should include both men and women in the same page, making it things like Duke Blue Devils basketball and North Carolina Tar Heels basketball. Both genders on the same page makes it easier to edit, and adds more good content, though, I'm not too strong on this opinion. --NomaderTalk 21:53, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
I'd have to think that the content between men's and women's basketball teams would be different enough that we'd want to separate them. The team history, coaching history, possibly the arena, everything could be different. I lean toward separate pages. -- Daveahern 14:48, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Uniform Record Box for coaching

I have added several coaching record boxes to articles and I just thought others may be interested in adding these. Therefore, I thought we should discuss here how to make them all consistant. Here is an example of one of them, let me know if anyone wants to revise it. Remember 20:51, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

School Year Record Postseason
Kansas 1988-89 19-12 (Probation)
Kansas 1989-90 30-5 NCAA 2nd round
Kansas 1990-91 27-8 National Runner-Up
Kansas 1991-92 27-5 2nd round
Kansas 1992-93 29-7 Final Four
Kansas 1993-94 27-8 Sweet 16
Kansas 1994-95 25-6 Sweet 16
Kansas 1995-96 29-5 Elite 8
Kansas 1996-97 34-2 Sweet 16
Kansas 1997-98 35-4 2nd round
Kansas 1998-99 23-10 2nd round
Kansas 1999-2000 24-10 2nd round
Kansas 2000-01 26-7 Sweet 16
Kansas 2001-02 33-4 Final Four
Kansas 2002-03 30-8 National Runner-Up
UNC 2003-04 19-11 2nd round
UNC 2004-05 33-4 National Champions
UNC 2005-06 23-8 2nd round
TOTAL OVERALL RECORD: ???
We could also add in conference record/championships and final poll rankings like this example from the Duke basketball page. -- Daveahern 21:51, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
Season Overall Record ACC Record ACC Regular Season
or Tournament Champions?		 Final AP
Ranking		 Postseason
1980-81 17-13 6-8 Neither NIT
1981-82 10-17 4-10 Neither ---
1982-83 11-17 3-11 Neither ---
1983-84 24-10 7-7 Neither NCAA Tournament
1984-85 23-8 8-6 Neither NCAA Tournament
1985-86 37-3 12-2 Both 1 NCAA Championship Game
1986-87 24-9 9-5 Neither 17 NCAA Sweet Sixteen
1987-88 28-7 9-5 Tournament 5 NCAA Final Four
1988-89 28-8 9-5 Neither 9 NCAA Final Four
1989-90 29-9 9-5 Neither 15 NCAA Championship Game
1990-91 32-7 11-3 Regular Season 6 NCAA Champion
1991-92 34-2 14-2 Both 1 NCAA Champion
1992-93 24-8 10-6 Neither 10 NCAA 2nd Round
1993-94 28-6 12-4 Regular Season 6 Championship Game
1994-95* 13-18 2-14 Neither --- ---
1995-96 18-13 8-8 Neither --- NCAA Tournament
1996-97 24-9 12-4 Regular Season 8 NCAA Tournament
1997-98 32-4 15-1 Regular Season 3 Elite Eight
1998-99 37-2 16-0 Both 1 Championship Game
1999-2000 29-5 15-1 Both 1 Sweet Sixteen
2000-01 35-4 13-3 Both 1 NCAA Champion
2001-02 31-4 13-3 Tournament 1 Sweet Sixteen
2002-03 26-7 11-5 Tournament 7 Sweet Sixteen
2003-04 31-6 13-3 Regular Season 6 Final Four
2004-05 27-6 11-5 Tournament 3 Sweet Sixteen
2005-06 32-4 14-2 Both 1 Sweet Sixteen
Coach K Overall record: 648-187 (.776)
Duke overall record (1906-2006): 1799-792 (.694)

Per the Wikipedia policy, you shouldn't link the same item over and over in a table. The first instance in a table is fine. And while linking dates, years, is acceptable, I'm against just linking years in tables, but there's no real consensus on it. I think it's just useless linking in that instance. --MECU≈talk 21:56, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Uniform Team Infoboxes

Alright - currently, we have two seperate team infoboxes, one official, one not.

The NC State Wolfpack basketball page shows our official template. The North Carolina Tar Heels basketball page shows the un-official one.

Personally, I'm amazed that the official one is actually official - really, the second one in my personal opinion looks better, though, I created it. Therefore, I ask everyone else's opinion on the matter. --NomaderTalk 21:39, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

There's no reason you can't improve the "official" (who blessed it anyways?) one with yours that does have improved capability and information. Just be sure that your changes are optional so they don't mess up pages that use the current official one, or be willing to go through all of them (all 4!) and fix them so they work. I would think in the long run, upgrading the "official" one would serve Wikipedia and this Project better. If you need help, let me know. Also, we just developed one for CFB so you may get some ideas at Template:NCAAFootballSchool. --MECU≈talk 22:41, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
Sadly, I'm going to have to ask for you to do it - I tried my hand at it, and it all came up as some 'mumble-jumble' of code. Apparently, I'm alright at making simple things, but this was too much - I'd appreciate it if you could help convert it, maybe if you wanted to, add some stuff about pagentry - anyways, I'd appreciate your help in the matter. --NomaderTalk 02:39, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] AFD on CBB player

Aaron Gray has been nominated for deletion. Please weigh in there, and this would be a good way for the WP:CBB to declare precendence and help determine what players deserve articles. --MECU≈talk 15:27, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

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