Template talk:Virginia/Draft
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I do not agree with the changes in the template:Virginia. Washington DC is not a major city of Virginia, in fact, its not even in Virginia! And, how does one include Roanoke and exclude many larger cities? Please explain and perhaps we can work out the bugs. Vaoverland 06:23, Feb 16, 2005 (UTC)
I am reverting this template page to the earlier vesrion. The new version will be listed under draft. There are too many porblems which are not being addresses yet to not take this action. Vaoverland 01:34, Feb 18, 2005 (UTC)
Okay, I think I found where I erred. I intended the Washington, DC link to go to access the 1,789,227-resident Virginia portion of the Washington, DC urban area. I redirected that link to "Northern Virginia," a page that I didn't really notice already exists.
Likewise, "Virginia Beach" now goes to "Hampton Roads," a metro area that includes Newport News, Hampton, Norfolk, Chesapeake, and Portsmouth.
And Richmond (the metro area) now goes to "Richmond-Petersburg," the metro area.
Roanoke, with 197,442 residents in its urbanized area, ranks next. The larger cities (by population) are mostly included in "Hampton Roads," all included in the other metro areas, and in any case, are listed under "Independent Cities." Roanoke apparently doesn't have its own metropolitan area page, so I just linked it to the city of Roanoke.
Tell me if you like the new draft.
Dufekin 13:49, 21 Feb 2005 (UTC)
OK, some suggestions intended to be constructive. Part of the problem I (and others) have with the current Wikipedia articles is that geographic regions (pretty much defined by the state) and economic regions (MSA's as defined and redefined by the feds) are not the same. The MSA'a even cross state lines, which is functionally correct but is beyond state-level thinking. (I am in in Richmond,Virginia|Richmond), where the label "former president" still brings the name Jeff to the minds of many. Your revised template could help clarify the difference between economic and largely geographic regions used by the state. Fortunately, both seem to respect county/city borders, so the confusion is limited somewhat.
Under regions, if there was room, I would indicate geographic for clarity. If MSAs are listed separately, then you should restore Virginia Peninsula and South Hampton Roads. To satisfy another editor, I have compromised and agreed to call them "subregions" in the Hampton Roads article, as the other editor insists on calling the MSA for that area a "region". If you don't change your Metro entry to match that, you may run afoul of the same editor and thinking, (and we are all trying to get better stuff into WP, after all).
Under Metros, I would change the label Metros to MSA. You can alsway footnote that or link it (ie MSA. How can you go wrong? To us, "Metro" is WMATA in Northern Virginia.
If you intend to use the MSAs (or Metro) space for the big MSAs, you should lable them by the names listed by the OMB. Under rights, the word State might fit better next to Colony. I don't feel strongly about that, but please don't use "States Rights". The American Civil War and the issue of States Rights should be behind us.
That's all for now. Your new template is a lot prettier than the old one. Vaoverland 15:50, Feb 21, 2005 (UTC)
UPDATE: regarding MSA's, there are at least 12 in Virginia. I will work on a list, and then article to match. A link for some of the info is http://www.vcu.edu/cppweb/urban/MSAJune03.pdf. An incomplete DRAFT, with at least four more MSAs not yet listed, may be found at List of U.S. Metropolitan Statistical Areas (MSA) in Virginia. For the template, I would do away with "smaller urban areas", and use the space to list all of the MSAs, perhaps by their correct titles, to which you can link from my list. I will be working on adding the missing MSAs (at edges of the state on 3 sides) and then on article for each MSA using the linked titles found on the list (all red for now). Vaoverland 17:22, Feb 21, 2005 (UTC)
ANOTHER UPDATE: I think I have figured it out. There are 11 MSA's partially or completely in Virginia under the June 2003 OMB revisions. I will work on an article for each of the 11 as listed in the List of U.S. Metropolitan Statistical Areas (MSA) in Virginia. It might actually be helpful to caption the category on the template as Metro MSAs, since the OMB now has another category of "micro statistical areas", which someone could confuse with the acronym for the larger units were are describing (or at least trying to)! I would still do away with attempt at listing the smaller urban areas, as they define easy definitions without inherent unfairness. Your current list will mislead a reader, I fear (no offense intended). Vaoverland 19:34, Feb 21, 2005 (UTC)
I have been working on another article, Lost Counties, Cities and Towns of Virginia Vaoverland 05:02, Feb 24, 2005 (UTC)
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[edit] New Template Ready?
Hi all. Mahtanza brought to my attention that the Virginia article still has its outdated template sitting at the bottom. This new template looks great. Is this project stalled or perhaps finished? Is this go for launch? Thanks! 
Monkeyman 23:12, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
[edit] U.S. state templates
Wikipedia:WikiProject U.S. states/state templates lists and displays all 50 U.S. state (and additional other) templates. It potentially can be used for ideas and standardization. //MrD9 07:26, 19 March 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Smaller urban centers
If Warrenton gets in, Leesburg and Culpeper ought to be included in that list. If Abingdon gets in, so too should Wytheville, Marion and maybe Norton/Wise (the two are virtually next door to each other). Maybe Pulaski can get in as well (I didn't know it was pushing 10k in population) and there is sufficient "open space" between it and Roanoke. If Suffolk gets in, then so should Poquoson and Williamsburg, although all three are really covered under the Virginia Beach/Hampton Roads area. FWIW, those outside the area refer to the whole cluster as "Tidewater" or "Hampton Roads" similarly to how those outside of Northern Virginia refer to the whole area as "NoVA."
Also, should this template go in for any city or state in Virginia? Shawn Pickrell 15:53, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
[edit] My changes
I added some of the smaller urban centers I mentioned earlier. Leesburg is the largest incorporated town in the state (as opposed to independent city). Culpeper has over 10,000 people. Wytheville and Marion are the same size as Abingdon. Poquoson and Williamsburg are also significant areas; if Suffolk qualifies as a "smaller urban center" (as opposed to part of the Tidewater area), then so too should Williamsburg and Poquoson. I don't know if Pulaski should get in, or if Norton/Wise have a combined weight making them worthy of inclusion.
"Nova", while a nickname that ought to be mentioned in the Northern Virginia article, is more heavily used by the rest of the state than the region itself.
