Talk:The Pitman Vegetarian Hotel

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[edit] Not the first

A leedle problem: The Times, Friday, May 12, 1893; pg. 14. Police Notices report the remand at Bow Street, London, for burglary of Percy Albert Blake who "took a bed room at the Vegetarian Hotel in the Strand". And that leads to this reference about the 1890 International Vegetarian Congress at the Charing Cross Vegetarian Hotel, Strand. Doubts cast, then, on all the 'firsts'.

And more: it looks pretty obvious that some details of the Kathleen Keleny piece are potentially fabulation or unreliably recalled. "Kathleen's father talking: Early Beginnings ... My daughter is 88 ...". Oh, lordy!

A solid source: The Times, Monday, May 22, 1882; pg. 6; has a reference to a court case involving the Temperance Restaurant Company, a vegetarian restaurant at 34 Londonwall. And so on.RayGirvan 13:43, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Well here is a another link about the Pitman, http://pitmanshorthand.homestead.com/PitmanBooks.html

The Pitman Vegetarian Hotel was founded in the summer of 1898 using floors above a vegetarian restaurant. Maybe we could claim then that it was the first vegetarian hotel outside of London? By the way Andy, I think you may find that the only exageration comes from you, I am only as good as my information and if that information is unfounded or mixed up then brilliant this is the place to put it right ;) Nick Boulevard 11:12, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)

The first vegetarian hotel outside of London? It may well have been, but we don't have verification of that. The Times - I use the Times Digital Archive - tends to be a bit skimpy on non-London events. But the Reference Library in Birmingham and its newpaper archive would be sure to have something (I remember it being an excellent library). But there's plenty else to be said. I'm sure many of the broad details in the Keleny article, such as it being named after Isaac Pitman, are correct.

PS One of the first things you find when you get seriously into historical research is that sources saying "X being the first Y" are always worth double-checking. That's why I pick on statements of that sort. RayGirvan 11:48, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)

By the way Andy. Just spotted that. You're mistaken, really. Can't you tell the difference in styles? A moment with Google will find [1] and [2] RayGirvan 14:15, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)

I'm multi-talented, aren't we? Andy Mabbett 14:19, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)

I have to admit, it's been very hard maintaining these multiple personas. :) Raygirvan

Ardy ar ar... ar. :) Nick Boulevard 22:52, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)

P.S. Thanks for taking so much time to edit and perfect my loverly article on the Pitman, a sincere thank you, I am flattered ;) Nick Boulevard 22:57, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Nick. No need to thank anyone - this is entirely down to cooperation on both sides. There's a fine quotation from Oliver Cromwell: "I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ, think it possible you may be mistaken". Believe me: if you produce good source material as you've done here and don't get het up over properly-cited edits and deletions, other editors (even those such as those as myself who have been in dispute with you elsewhere) will very happily support you and put in the research to develop the article. All everyone wants is fair representation of available information. RayGirvan 00:10, 9 Jun 2005 (UTC)