Talk:The Football League

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Contents 1 Logo 2 Move to Football League? 3 Requested move 3.1 Discussion 4 Use of Football League Confusing 5 Record Premiership transfers

[edit] Logo

Now that The Football League has gone to all the trouble of rebranding themselves, do you think we'd be allowed to use their (rather nice) new logo as an image on this page? It's available at [1]. BBC News had it on their site, but I'm not sure if they have some sort of special permission. Surely their logo can be featured here too under fair use?

[edit] Move to Football League?

I seem to recall this being discussed before, but I'd like to suggest that this is moved to Football League, without the definite article. sjorford:// 10:18, 27 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Not I'm bothered either way, but I believe 'The Football League' is its official name. It would be a bit like moving The Times to Times. Also, that'd be a lot of links to fix.

I think there's a subtle difference; The Times is a title, whereas The Football League is a name (very subtle, I know). Anyway, the links aren't a problem, as redirects will take care of it either way. sjorford:// 17:55, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Football League is already a redirect page. If the article is moved there will be some double-redirects to fix. -- Arwel 18:25, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Requested move

Please also see Talk:The Football Association, also listed for moving.

The Football League → Football League - same reasons as above. sjorford #£@%&$?! 15:36, 1 September 2005 (UTC)

---

Add *Support or *Oppose followed by an optional one sentence explanation, then sign your opinion with ~~~~

• Against. The is part of the name and the current title follows the Naming_conventions Bornintheguz 16:21, 1 September 2005 (UTC)
• Oppose "The is part of the name" Jooler 18:35, 1 September 2005 (UTC)
• Oppose. This is the official name of the organisation. – AxSkov (☏) 05:57, 3 September 2005 (UTC)
• Support. Agree completely with sjorford. Proteus (Talk) 13:45, 3 September 2005 (UTC)
• Oppose. The is an integral part of the organisation's name. -- Arwel 14:15, 3 September 2005 (UTC)
• Support. Many organisations use "The" in their official name, but this is generally not included in the WP title. Qwghlm 08:45, September 5, 2005 (UTC)
• Support. See Wikipedia:Naming_conventions (definite and indefinite articles at beginning of name)#Rule of thumb. I don't think many people would capitalise it in running text. CTOAGN 11:22, 5 September 2005 (UTC)
• Oppose - see everyone else's comments below - Master Of Ninja 20:30, 5 September 2005 (UTC)
• Oppose - "The" is part of the offical name and fits with Wiki naming conventions. - Pal 21:18, September 5, 2005 (UTC)
• Support. 'The' rarely capitalised in running text, as per Wikipedia conventions. -- Necrothesp 14:43, 9 September 2005 (UTC)

It was requested that this article be renamed but there was no consensus for it be moved. Dragons flight 07:23, September 10, 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Discussion

Add any additional comments

Alright, it's finally got to me, so I've put this (and The Football Association) on WP:RM. Main reasons:

• WP standard is generally not to use "The" for names of organisations such as this one

No it isn't see Naming_conventions Bornintheguz 17:11, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

• It's easier to link to Football League in the middle of a sentence (yes, I know there's a redirect, but it's nice not to link directly to redirects, or to have to pipe the link)

I 'think' that in 99% of cases 'the' will be in front so this makes very little difference Bornintheguz 17:11, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

• There's no ambiguity: Football League and Football league both already link here, and the latter could potentially be turned into a redirect/article without affecting this renaming. sjorford #£@%&$?! 15:36, 1 September 2005 (UTC)
• Check out The FA website. They always use "The" in their own publications, even capitalizing it mid-sentence. I don't see why we should treat it any differently here. - Pal 21:18, September 5, 2005 (UTC)

• This is a manual of style exception. The FA is specifically cited on Wikipedia:Naming_conventions_(definite_and_indefinite_articles_at_beginning_of_name)#Official_names Jooler 17:48, 9 September 2005 (UTC)
  • Wrongly, according to the basic principle listed on the same page: "If the definite or indefinite article article would be capitalized in running text, then include it at the beginning of the page name. Otherwise, do not include it at the beginning of the page name." Usually in this case, it would not be capitalised in running text in most publications. -- Necrothesp 03:35, 10 September 2005 (UTC)
    • The FA should be capitalised in running text. What better authority in this particular case than FIFA? [2], [3],[4],[5],[6] (also as The F.A. [7], [8],[9],[10]) -sometimes writers do not adhere to this rule as you find when people write "the Hague", but it is the correct rule in this case. Jooler 06:12, 10 September 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Use of Football League Confusing

I think this article has some discrepancies regarding the term 'Football League'. Itr seems the author(s) have assumed that prior to the Premier League being formed the teams involved we're part of the football league. This isn't not true. The Premier League was mearly a re-badging of the Division 1 (mainly for marketing purposes), 'the football league' did not exist prior the premier league. Parts of the article refering to this have to be changed. Any objections? Jamie 12:02, 3 January 2006 (UTC)

Yes, I object, as you're mistaken. The Football League was formed in 1885, and had grown to 92 teams in four divisions by 1992. The First Division was part of the Football League, until the 22 clubs that made it up resigned to form the separate Premier League, leaving the Football League with 70 clubs in three divisions. It was not a mere rebranding - the two leagues are totally separate entities. Go read the Leagues' respective websites: [11] and [12] (or any decent football history book) for more. Qwghlm 13:51, 3 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Record Premiership transfers

Are we sure the discussion of escalating transfer records in the Premiership (in the History section) wouldn't be better place in the Premier League article? It may already be there for all I know, but I really don't think it belongs here, as well. Binabik80 04:31, 7 January 2006 (UTC)

Agreed - it should be in the Premier League article (in a briefer/more readable format - leave out the individual records and just say how many times it got broken in the time period). British football transfer record would be the best place for the full details. Qwghlm 12:11, 7 January 2006 (UTC)