Talk:Taiwanese American

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To-do list for Taiwanese American:	edit · history · watch · refresh
Include general Taiwanese-American beliefs about American politics. Increase article size.

Changed statement. It's not true that Taiwanese were the first of three waves of Asian American immigration. I changed the term to ethnic Chinese immigration since all but the most extreme Taiwanese independence supporters do not deny that Taiwanese are ethnic Chinese.

--Roadrunner

Contents 1 Monterey Park 2 Taiwanese-American beliefs about American politics 3 Politics section 4 Chinese Americans? 5 Taiwanese Canadian

[edit] Monterey Park

Actually, Monterey Park doesn't have that much of a Taiwanese-origin population anymore as it did during the 1970s and 1980s. It seems to me that most Taiwanese American-owned businesses that used to be here have decline or disappeared and the city is now predominantly Cantonese-speaking (instead of Mandarin). It's now mostly mainlanders and Chinese Vietnamese here. Most Taiwanese with money have moved out. I know, I've lived here much of my life. Unfortunately, the Census data lumps all ethnic Chinese as "Chinese" (rather than Taiwanese or Mainland Chinese) so there is no way to verify my claims.

What I can say is that the cities with large and growing Taiwanese populations include Irvine and Rowland Heights in California.

[edit] Taiwanese-American beliefs about American politics

I believe this has to do with:

• Immigration Policies for Taiwan.
• United States support for governmental body of the Republic of China.
• United States support of the Taiwan Relations Act.
• Political groups of Taiwan.

I know that each political party treats the Taiwan issue in a different light, and of course it depends on the relationship with China at the time. There are also active political members and groups that live in the United States but travel back to participate in the Taiwan government, which would give political beliefs regarding American politics as well.

--Nomegustan

I would like to raise a point that in normal terms it's accepted that a Taiwanese American has to hold some form of Green Card or Passport, which in the case of Ang Lee, I don't believe that's true. I may be wrong, but at present that is my knowledge. Perhaps I will wait and see if anyone can verify that before I alter it.

[edit] Politics section

In the 2000 ROC Presidental Election an estimated 10,000 Taiwanese Americans traveled to Taiwan to vote in an election in which the margin of victory was 30,000, and both groups campaigned extensively in the United States and held campaign rallies on Taiwan to welcome their voters.
This sentence sounds as if it's referring to the 2004 ROC Presidential Election instead. --A10203040 13:54, 21 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Chinese Americans?

The following sentence in the lead is disputed: "Whether Taiwanese Americans also count as Chinese Americans is a controversial political issue."

Are there specific examples of Taiwanese Americans explictly claiming not to be Chinese Americans? The Chinese sense of the term "Chinese American" 美籍華人 applies to Taiwanese Americans as the term for (culturally) "Chinese" 華人 universally and undisputably applies to Taiwanese.--Jiang 00:37, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

Are there specific examples of Taiwanese Americans explictly claiming TO BE Chinese Americans? Whether it is "Chinese American" or 美籍華人 (which are essentially the same), due to the political status of Taiwan and Taiwan-China relations. This sentence is necessary to keep NPOV in effect on wikipedia. This is not PA, but how can a Chinese person represent the voice of Taiwanese and universal value as a whole?--Bonafide.hustla 00:54, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

Your response is completely irrelevant. It is obvious that you cannot read Chinese or comprehend the the concept of "Chinese" as it is rendered in the Chinese language. What you are asking me to "prove" is ridiculous, but I'll do it anyways. examples you requested: "Taiwanese Americans make up about 5 percent of the nation's 2.7 million Chinese Americans, according to the latest US Census figures", Chinese Student Association: click on "External VP".--Jiang 01:12, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

This is a chinese conducted survey. Please use a unbiased source. Please do not make false accusations.--Bonafide.hustla 01:30, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

This is not a Chinese conducted survey. Please cite how "Whether Taiwanese Americans also count as Chinese Americans is a controversial political issue." Can you verify this? Where is the controversy? --Jiang 04:07, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

I understand your POV. But no POV pushing please.--Bonafide.hustla 00:18, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

In the United States census, at least, Taiwanese Americans are considered as part of Chinese Americans and there is no seperate grouping for Taiwanese. And certain prominent Taiwanese, such as Iris Chang, did explicitly consider themselves as Chinese, and named them as so in her book, The Chinese in America. So there's certainly at least some segnment of the populartion who describe themselves as Chinese Americans. --Yuje 12:20, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

The problem is "Chinese" can mean different things, one is ethnic Chinese/Han Chinese, another is citizen of China, and then there's the problem of the definition of "China" itself. LDHan 12:37, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

The discussion is moving off topic. The sentence "whether Taiwanese Americans also count as Chinese Americans is a controversial political issue" serves as a disclaimer and should remain in the article. Please reframe from considering every edit to be politically driven. =D Jumping cheese ^Contact 05:43, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

It has nothing to do with motive of the editor. The statement, as it stands alone, is not verified. I could add "Whether Chinese Americans can be considered true Americans is a controversial political issue" and say the same about verifiability. --Jiang 06:16, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

The Taiwanese and Chinese issue is obviously a controversial issue and a disclaimer is needed to prevent offending Wikipedian on either side of the spectrum. =) Jumping cheese ^Contact 06:23, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

How is it "obviously" a controversial issue? Can you link to websites explaning or demonstrating the controversy? I just don't see it.--Jiang 06:38, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

You know...the Pan-Blue vs. Pan-Green issue. It’s basically politics. Jumping cheese ^Contact 06:48, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

The issue in Taiwanese identity politics is over whether Taiwanese are politically and ethnically Chinese (zhongguoren) or not politically Chinese and only ethnically Chinese (huaren). However, by default and definition, "Chinese American" implies only the latter and makes no implication over the former. "Chinese American" is an ethnic-cultural label, not a political one, unless we speak of being politically American. In Chinese newspapers in America, the terms "overseas Chinese" (huaqiao) or "ethnic Chinese" (huaren) are used to refer to Chinese Americans, inclusive of Overseas Chinese. Ethnic Chinese in America from Singapore still check the "Chinese" label on the US Census form, since there is no "Singaporean" race or ethnicity. (see also Talk:List of Chinese Americans#Ethnicity lists discussion)--Jiang 07:41, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

Are you sure? Although I’m not from Singapore, the last thing I would call myself is Chinese (which is thousands of miles away). Malaysian would be a much more appropriate choice.
Another thing, the article is not going by "ethnic-cultural" or ethnic groups, but nationalities. If Chinese is the ethnic group, then Han Chinese is the only existing label. =D Jumping cheese ^Contact 02:03, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

"Chinese American" is not a nationality. It is used to describe a racial/ethnic group of Americans, ie those with origins/ancestry in China. If you would like more input, post something at Wikipedia:WikiProject China--Jiang 05:31, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

Whether Chinese American is a nationality or not is irrevelant. People can argue either way. By saying it with a statement of fact is an example of POV pushing. Thank you.--Bonafide.hustla 08:29, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

How about modifying "Whether Taiwanese Americans also count as Chinese Americans is a controversial political issue." to something like:

Whether Taiwanese Americans also count as Chinese Americans is a controversial political issue for some Taiwanese Americans. Although "Chinese Americans" is used by most, including the US Census, to mean "ethnic Chinese" ie Han Chinese, some Taiwanese Americans use the term "Chinese Americans" to mean Americans from or of descent from people from China. Therefore they do not include Taiwanese Americans as Chinese Americans because they do not include Taiwan as part of China. LDHan 16:34, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

That sounds a little too superfluous and has a slight issue of POV. I still believe that the current disclaimer is adequate. =D Jumping cheese ^Contact 19:35, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Taiwanese Canadian

There a good amount of info regarding Taiwanese Canadians, so I'm creating a new page and moving the info over. =D Jumping cheese ^Contact 22:39, 9 October 2006 (UTC)