Talk:Super Mario Bros.

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This part doesn't make sense: "In addition, the elevator-style lifts are about 60% their original size throughout, as opposed to the original size until world 5-3 and 60% after." Just so you all know--74.69.54.30 23:25, 3 August 2006 (UTC).

I reverted the addition of the mini-Fiery Mario trick - it's not very significant or well-known, so it should go to Wikibooks. Andre (talk) 22:21, Feb 1, 2005 (UTC)

What?! How is it not significant?! I strongly disagree and I think that the removal of this trick weakens the article. Anyone agree? FWIW, IIRC, the trick was mentioned in an early issue of Nintendo Power.--StAkAr Karnak 03:10, 2 Feb 2005 (UTC)
It may be significant, but I don't think it's encyclopedic. I think the only bug really worth documenting is the Minus World bug, since it did gain widespread attention. - furrykef (Talk at me) 11:24, 4 Feb 2005 (UTC)
yes StAkAr Karnak i agree that this trick is significant and well-known. regardless of whether it deserves to be mentioned in the main article, it's certainly more significant than those level 4-2 pipe details. so i've moved that other piece over to wikibooks. --blah 18:39, 13 Feb 2005 (EST)
I am disappointed to see that the Fiery Mario part was deleted from this article. Therefore, on my [webpage] about this topic, I'm now linking to the page version from the Wikipedia History page that still contains the content: [[1]] Is this a bad idea? What should I do instead? The content I was looking for was not found at [Wikibooks] either. -- Bisqwit 07:01, 5 April 2006 (UTC)

Since when can fireballs defeat Bowser? I remember the one time I was actually able to bring Fire Mario all the way to Bowser's stage and the fireballs just hit him with no effect.

They can, you just have to fire many times (five, perhaps). Jørgen 16:52, 25 May 2005 (UTC)
Yeah, I think it's five. Andre (talk) 00:20, May 28, 2005 (UTC)

I agree with StAkAr Karnak. In a video game, you need every tip, hint, and cheat you can get (believe me, I know. I'm terrible at video games!).

Tips and hints go to Wikibooks unless they have significance outside of making the game easier. Andre (talk) 00:20, May 28, 2005 (UTC)

Is it just me, or was this not the first appearance of Mario, but was the arcade game "Donkey Kong." Someone doublecheck and fix this? - bobthemilkman

Nothing in the article says it's the first appearance of Mario, actually. --Shadow Hog 14:58, 21 December 2005 (UTC)

Contents

[edit] Mushroom Traitors?

The Goomba's Japanese name (Kuribou) is based on chestnuts, not mushrooms. The Goomba is actually supposed to resemble a chestnut in it's shape and color. So, as oppose to mushroom traitors, Goombas are actually some kind of odd chestnut monster. -- Kendamu 14:24, 26 March 2006 (UTC)

Not according to the manual for the US/EU version of the game, it isn't. --Hullubulloo 11:38, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Help!

I don't know alot about the plotline of this game, and I really want to create a complete guide. I think this guide should have a list of worlds and the little worlds inside of them (1-1,1-2, etc.). Help! - Wack'd

Does anyone know what the source is for the paragraph about David Victor Gehrke discovering a way to escape from minus world? It seems like it was probably a hoax and I think it should be removed until further evidence is shown that the trick is possible. I frequently go to at least 5 different forums where this kind of stuff would be very likely to be discussed and I've read lots of stuff about Super Mario Bros. glitches, and I've never seen it mentioned anywhere. I googled it and all I found was other pages that just copied the article straight from wikipedia. I also, with the help of save states, repeatedly attempted the trick on several different bloober/fish sets many times with no success. -Mjf314 —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Mjf314 (talk • contribs).

[edit] Chocolate factory rumor.

There was a rumor that there was a chocolate factory hidden in the game. The link below turns up results mentioning it.

http://www.google.com/search?q=%22hidden+chocolate+factory Hackwrench 16:38, 9 November 2005 (UTC)

I remember reading about that in some NES game tip book; I think it turned out to be a silly false rumor. I'm sure if there really was one, hackers would have found it, and there would be a lot more than 2 pages of Google results for it.
I know that at the time, it was an urban legend of the same proportions as Ermac in Mortal Kombat. It's odd that there's next to no information about it on the net now. I spent a good chunk of my childhood in the futile search for it, so I can't help but feel a little bitter ;) --QuasarTE 19:52, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Vandalism

Is there a way to ban IP's? Some guy keeps making it say "Super Garret brothers". Shortly after I reverted it, he did it again on, apperantly, a different computer. Then someone esle reverted it. His first Ip was 67.183.11.197 71.114.26.29 12:47, 14 September 2006 (UTC) Here's his other IP 68.53.140.160 Cfive 12:49, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Released in Europe in 1997?

I'm pretty sure that Super Mario Bros. didn't come out in Europe in 1997. Is that supposed to say 1987? Could someone who has a reliable source (GameFAQs ain't it) fix this?

In the meantime, I've commented the Europe release date out. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 06:11, 22 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Minus World

I reverse engineered the Minus World bug about 8 years ago... The article is correct that the Minus World is 36-1.

The reason the world loops forever is the format of the level data. The enemy data for a level contains embedded "set pipe target" commands. These commands say, "if (world == X) pipe_target = Y;", and the pipe system uses the current value of pipe_target to select the destination level. However, because there are only such entries in the data for worlds 2 and 7 (they share this same data on 2-2 and 7-2), this variable never gets set. Its previous value is the last level loaded - the one you're on.

The fact that the middle pipe is 5 is more interesting. It's actually the result of an optimization - SMB1 has many crazy size optimizations in it. Remember, the game has exactly 3 bytes of free space in its CPU ROM, and even uses the PPU ROM for the title screen layout because the CPU ROM was out of space. One of the optimizations is that there is only one type of warp zone. The "underground" warp zone of 4-2 has only a single pipe to world 5. Despite this, it is not a separate type of warp zone. It is actually a 3-pipe warp zone like the other two. In the table of warp zone worlds, it is implemented as 3 warps - worlds 36, 5, and 36. The pipes for the outer warps are omitted from the level data to prevent you from using them. The reason they use 36 for the outer two warps is so that when you see "WELCOME TO WARP ZONE" you don't see extra floating numbers above nothing - the "36" tiles are blank. The sole effect of this bug is to load a different warp zone than the one intended. Thus, the fact that such an illegal world is the Minus World is not really a coincidence.

The Famicom Disk System version of the game is basically the same program re-"org"ed at a different address. ROM on a 32k direct-mapped cartridge is from 0x8000 to 0xFFFF. On the Famicom Disk System, there is an 8k ROM for the disk system at 0xE000-0xFFFF. Games run in 32k of RAM from 0x6000 to 0xDFFF. It is the change of the base address that causes the FDS version of the game to have a different Minus World. The game decides which level to load based on the world number by looking in a table. Obviously, loading world 36 overshoots this table. The game happens to end up loading a byte from another table that contains the high byte of data addresses. Since the address layout is different, this table is different, so the FDS version loads a different level number than its cartridge counterpart.

I didn't put this on the main article because it's clearly original research. -- Myria 06:46, 9 December 2005 (UTC)

Submit your information to a ROM hacking site (a reputable one) and then cite that as a source :) - furrykef (Talk at me) 04:44, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
Although not helpful for getting rid of the "citation needed" notice, I can vouch for this, as I too have done extensive hacking of the game both through Game Genie and through messing with some reverse-engineered assembly code. The phenomenon that creates the Minus World can be duplicated and extended by playing with the Game Genie warp code YSAOPE + YEAOZA + ??APY?, replacing the first ? with one of APZLGITY, the second ? with one of EOXUKSVN, and the last ? with either A or E. The code which takes you to world -1 for the US cartridge version of the game happens to be LXAPYA, and it is the 36th such code (Game Genie codes are simply encoded memory address/value pairs). The effect of these codes is indeed caused by indexing the level table out-of-bounds. The value it ends up with determines what kind of level you will get. Usually this will be one of the existing levels with some of its attributes mixed up (such as level 4-4's layout, but with an underwater level's palette, music, and swimming enabled). A few of these codes will take you to weird and wonderous areas that are not a part of the real game, but are other data being interpreted as level data. These can get really weird and will often crash the game. Discussion of their details would be out of scope here though. Anyway, as interesting as this stuff is, it probably won't help with the article.--QuasarTE 07:03, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Commander Keen Reference

The 'Popularity' section mentioned that Commander Keen started of as SuperMarioBros clone, that however doesn't seem to be correct, it looks like it was a SuperMarioBros3 clone named "DANGEROUS DAVE IN COPYRIGHT INFRINGEMENT", following link has some more infos (only know about Dangerous Dave for 10mins so I havn't touched the article): http://rome.ro/games_ddici.htm

[edit] dab page?

Why was Super Mario Bros. turned into a dab page? Do we really need one? In any event, this article should be "Super Mario Bros. (video game)" if it had to be moved. --Pagrashtak 04:33, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

Someone moved Nintendo Entertainment System too earlier today; someone needs to learn that you need to discuss before moving. --Ntg 08:12, 8 January 2006 (UTC)
I agree. Someone is going to pay... --Optichan 20:06, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

Now that it's been moved back to its proper home, should we get rid of the disambiguation page? Optichan 21:44, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Requested move

Talk:Super Mario Bros. (original game) - Super Mario Bros. (original game) → Super Mario Bros. - user Nintendude moved the page without discussion and created a disambig which many feel is unnecessary. --Ntg 03:51, 11 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Voting

Add *Support or *Oppose followed by an optional one-sentence explanation, then sign your vote with ~~~~
  • Support - don't see why not. It IS the most common usage of "Super Mario Bros."; if they meant any OTHER game, it'd have the appropriate number after it. --Shadow Hog 14:27, 12 January 2006 (UTC)
  • Support. --Optichan 14:42, 12 January 2006 (UTC)
  • Support, but I think that's obvious. --Ntg 05:37, 14 January 2006 (UTC)
  • Support --Pagrashtak 13:30, 14 January 2006 (UTC)

Moved. —Nightstallion (?) 08:52, 16 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] "Cheat Code"

Query - This article says that SMB features the first "cheat code" or "easter egg" in video games - however I know for a fact that there were codes programmed into Intellivision games that would let individuals "cheat" or find hidden features. Thus this claim should be removed, n'est-ce pas? 71.124.16.93 21:22, 16 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Easter Eggs

We should create a new topic by combining all the topic we have now on Minus World and all the other topics on easter eggs, cheats, and glitches we have already discovered. We could call this topic "Secrets". Also it must include The Choclate Factory Legend and how it has not yet been found. This would cover a topic that seriously needs to be included. ~ The Cyborg

[edit] Communist propaganda

It sounds a little strange, but some believe this game contains subliminal communist refrences. Should that be noted in the article?

I don't think you'll be able to find any reliable sources to that effect. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 03:44, 22 April 2006 (UTC)
[2] - 71.31.159.119 00:11, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
You might want to read WP:RS before calling that a reliable source. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 22:25, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
I was just joking. I would never consider that a reliable source. - 71.31.144.61 00:42, 26 April 2006 (UTC)
Well... I mean, I have heard of this "rumor" in real life. It isn't like there is no precedent for people reinterpreting neutral elements of a popular culture item in a way unintended by the creators. Peyo is mute on the musings of Smurfs as communists. It might be useful to create a seperate article explaining the meme; what it is, and what it is not...

No? Yes? Maybe?--ttogreh 13:40, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Crown Lives

Why isn't 10+ lives mentioned?

[edit] ROM

It seems that the origianl version of Super Mario Bros. is no longer available for download on ROM sites. Was is taken off everywhere by force? 21:51, 2 June 2006 (UTC) Alexzero77

I find that very doubtful... - furrykef (Talk at me) 05:57, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Princess Peach Hoax...

"Apparently, Princess Peach was supposed to be a playable character, but her sprite was never made playable in the final version (She can be played by the game)"

Please remove this hoax from the page or I'll do it :) His proof is a youtube video showing a ROM hack. Princess Peach wouldn't have had a pink dress in SMB1 anyway...

[edit] Record information stated is false

I have book of world records (1999) sitting on my lap currently. The wiki site claims Super mario bros has sold 50,000,000 copies according to this book, which is false. Guinness book of world records (1999) clearly states that the Super Mario bros 3 is the best selling game of all time with 18.6 million copies sold. If you do not believe me, i can take a photo of the mentioned article in the book of world records.

Check the link. SMB3 is the best-selling standalone game; SMB is the bestseller when copies bundled with NESes are taken into account. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 19:53, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Spoilers

Why do show a screenshot of a world end scene?

--Diego 12:51, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

Because by now, everyone knows what the world endings look like in that game. Even for people who didn't, it wouldn't take them long to finish the first world and see it themselves. Plus, is there really anything to spoil in this game? -Unknownwarrior33 02:06, 3 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tricks to gain 100 lives and Big but Small cheat

I wonder why you guys never mention the trick in the stage of 4-3 or 4-4 (i forgot but sure) to gain 100 lives or more by manipulating two flying ducks which descended on the stairs just below the flags?

also as information, this trick is not for greedy people because if you manage to gain more than a certain limit of lives, then you will be 'cursed' by the bugs that send you directly to game over and title screen with just one single death (buried by too much lives would be a joke explanation of this bug).

Also i would like to see the tricks involving bowser fire, the golden axe at the end of the bridge, and big mario to invoke big but small mario (the small mario if damaged turned to big, and vice versa, so the small mario can shoot fire).

Tasfan 09:30, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Arcade version?

Wasn't this game released as an arcade console before or simultaneously with the NES release? Brutannica 21:11, 12 August 2006 (UTC)

After, actually, as Vs. Super Mario Bros. Vs. Unisystem games were based on already-released NES games. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 21:13, 12 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] NES Classics Version

This was also released on the GBA as part of Nintendo's NES Classics series.

That's already mentioned in the article but it's under Classic NES series, which I think was the American name for the series. Corbo 19:40, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Jerry Jackson reference...?

I think that reference is totally useless. There are billions of Mario Parodies around the Internet. Why is a Jerry Jackson reference here? I remember that two submissions were blammed in Newgrounds. But the moderators allowed them in the very end! Not only that, but Jerry Jackson make movies totally pointless, without any kind of sense. They are poorly drawn, with a emotionless voice, not sound at all, and they even manage to appear in the Frontpage and here in the Wikipedia. I'm going to delete that reference right now. Please, be fair.

[edit] Vs. Super Mario Bros. statement removed

The player begins with only two lives rather than the standard three, and 256 coins are required to earn an extra life, as opposed to 100 in all other versions.

I removed this because this obviously depends on switch settings. Both the number of lives and how many coins are needed for a 1-up are configurable settings. - furrykef (Talk at me) 22:10, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] GA Re-Review and In-line citations

Note: This article has a very small number of in-line citations for an article of its size and currently would not pass criteria 2b.
Members of the Wikipedia:WikiProject Good articles are in the process of doing a re-review of current Good Article listings to ensure compliance with the standards of the Good Article Criteria. (Discussion of the changes and re-review can be found here). A significant change to the GA criteria is the mandatory use of some sort of in-line citation (In accordance to WP:CITE) to be used in order for an article to pass the verification and reference criteria. It is recommended that the article's editors take a look at the inclusion of in-line citations as well as how the article stacks up against the rest of the Good Article criteria. GA reviewers will give you at least a week's time from the date of this notice to work on the in-line citations before doing a full re-review and deciding if the article still merits being considered a Good Article or would need to be de-listed. If you have any questions, please don't hesitate to contact us on the Good Article project talk page or you may contact me personally. On behalf of the Good Articles Project, I want to thank you for all the time and effort that you have put into working on this article and improving the overall quality of the Wikipedia project. Agne 21:57, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Removal of info

I can't say that I agree with the removal of the cultural info here. I mean, the whole article is cultural cruft, we might as well acknowledge it. Its not like it hurts the encyclopedianess. I won't revet, but I think the info should be put back. pschemp | talk 02:19, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

It was "A Wikipedia user noticed that foo is referenced/is similar to/is mentioned in passing in bar" original research plus an ad for someone's album. If someone wanted to write something cited, that would be fine. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 02:25, 15 October 2006 (UTC)
Maybe pull the album ad but the content seems encyclopedic to me. ++Lar: t/c 02:33, 15 October 2006 (UTC)
How is it original reserach to talk about a phrase the game uses? Anyone can verify that. pschemp | talk 02:38, 15 October 2006 (UTC)
How is it original research to note how many toes a species of bird has? Anyone can catch the bird and verify that.
Synthesizing direct observation is original research. In this case, it's really, really inane original research, but it's a good hedge against Armchairs in popular culture. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 02:44, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

The first half is all "A Wikipedia user noticed that foo is mentioned in passing in bar." Super Mario Bros. or its music has appeared in the background of dozens, if not hundreds, of TV shows and movies and mentioned im passing in many; listing every single one is neither useful to an encyclopedia or even practical. We're not exactly talking about SMB3 and The Wizard, here.

The whole bit on "I'm sorry..." is full of unsourced, largely unsourcable statements:

  • It has become something of a pop culture phenomenon, similar to "all your base are belong to us." - Since when?
  • The phrase is frequently parodied and referenced in popular culture, most often in video games and video gaming related contexts. - The video game world is pretty self-referential, especially when video game series reference previous games in that series. Any reference in a source other than video game recognizing this phenomenon?
  • It is sometimes called both a meme and a snowclone. - This is an artefact of memespam being cut from the article on "I'm sorry" and is similar to "Fanfic often depicts this character as..."
  • It is sometimes cited as a good example of negative reinforcement. - By whom?

The rest is more "A Wikipedia user noticed that foo is mentioned in passing in bar."

So, where's the encyclopedic content? - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 02:44, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

Speaking of the removal of info, why is it that there is a constant effort to remove or minimize the presence of the Minus World? This is something that has been around for years (as in, you saw talk of the Minus World in old magazines), and it's well-known why the Minus World is there, and yet anytime it's added to the page it's either removed completely or listed as "uncited", which is crap, as the game itself should be enough citation. 66.168.83.91 02:54, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

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