Talk:Sukhoi Su-30
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This article seems to violate NPOV. Much of it seems intend to convince the reader that the Su-30 MKI, apparently one of the best operational fighters in the world, is the equivalent of the Typhoon and F-22, even though the only widely published comparison rated it on par with the Rafale, better than F-15, but lagging Typhoon and F-22, apparently because of the lack of supercruise, poorer integration of avionics, and acceleration / climb rate due to thrust-to-T/O weight.
Randall rnicameron@yahoo.com
Randall, You are implying the Rafale itself lags behind the Typhoon. That in itself is highly ambiguous at best. Can't see how you can complain about this article violating NPOV then.
- Asking for NPOV on anything to do with a boy's toy like the Su-30 is asking too muc. They are all like that. The most you can hope for is to tone it down. After all there are no neutral sources. The only evidence you are going to get is going to come from the employees of one or other plane producer and/or user. Lao Wai 12:26, 1 February 2006 (UTC)
I did some minor grammar editing and I removed the part where it said the Su-30 could engage ballistic missles. No fighter aircraft in the world can do this. DarthJesus 23:40, 7 April 2006 (UTC)
- Thats true. There were a lot of inaccurate stuff in this article but thanks to your edits, the article is more factual now. --Spartian 06:29, 8 April 2006 (UTC)
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- I'll be rewriting significant portions of the article so as to include data on all variants of the MKI and have it conform to a NPOV and Wiki's quality standards-- Archerblack.
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[edit] Bunk comparison
I removed the comparison as it's bunk. The original source for it is [1], a submission by an Australian representative in Parliament (or whatever their title is), pushing to buy the MKI, and naturally it exaggerates the MKI's abilities and shortens its competitors.
Point by point:
- nuclear weapons - this is interesting and unique; moved it up to the description
- combat radius - the source actually says the F-22 and MKI have the same range (it's a wash anyway), whereas the Eurofighter is less by some 40%. It is also the only source claiming that the F-22 is speed-limited by stealth factors (which is how I found the piece), which I judge to be nonesense without a technical source for the claim.
- the DRDO avionics are discussed above; and no indication is given to whether or not it's superior to alternatives. It'd be difficult for any outsiders to discern anyway.
- per/unit costs are very misleading due to the low purchase number. The various SU-27 derivative prototypes probably have an extremely high per/unit cost as very few were ever built. Indications were that if exported, the /unit cost would have been closer to $168 million.
Even this piece admits it's a 4th generation aircraft; the heading attempted to imply otherwise.
Hey, it's a nice piece of kit; a good example of an export user modifying an aircraft beyond what i could originally do. But it's no super-jet, which is what Mr. Jensen was trying to sell it as. --Mmx1 00:23, 17 April 2006 (UTC)
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- The DRDO avionics were found to be superior to the import alternatives at the point of time, the MKI was developed, and were indeed better in performance to what the Russians themselves fielded. For instance, the Indian radar data processors on the MKI have been retained in the MKM variants and are part of the package. It is true that some of the assertions made by Carlo Kopp are debateable, but then again, there can be no single authoritative source on the MKI as the data would be classified. - Archerblack
[edit] The Cobra and stall
I found this "The design incorporates a straked delta wing, with strake and body blending, also seen in the American F-16 Falcon. This allows the airplane to fly at extreme angles of attack without stalling -- illustrated in the so called "cobra maneuver"." passage rather disturbing. I think most would agree that a stall is either the condition that arises when angle of attack has been brought beyond the angle that gives maximum lift coefficient, or the condition that arises when airflow around the wings has separated from the wing. Both conditions are true during the cobra (as shown by numerous vidoes on the internet), so I don't quite understand what the passage I quoted is on about. --81.233.90.182 09:53, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
[edit] MKM variant
How about adding an MKM variant entry? - --124.82.15.15 14:19, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
- As in a seperate page, or a section? If you are willing to do the work yourself, you can give the section a shot. (USMA2010 19:58, 21 June 2006 (UTC))
[edit] MKK/MK2 Variants
The Su-30 MKK and Su-30 MK2 were developed by KNAAPO for the People's Republic of China.
[edit] Su-30MKI Article
I moved Su-30MKI info to the Su-30MKI Article as the Su-30 article was exceeding 32kb which was warned by wiki.Moreover Su-30MKI is most modern version and Most Advanvced Russian Fighter in active Service and is much different from other any other Su-30 Variant. The Aircraft came into news , primarily due to its capabilities compared to American Counterparts. All this leads to Su-30MKI dominating the whole Su-30 article.
[edit] Assessment of Su-30MKK/MK2 section
Assuming that this is a Su-30 article, I don't understand why we're citing JH-7/JH-7A and J-11? Also, the only J-11B exists in models. Production of J-11 has been cancelled after ~100 aircraft, and we have yet to see even 1 real J-11B prototype. Isn't it a bit too quick to assume that it exists (or will be produced)? -- Adeptitus 22:38, 12 July 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Map
The map shows Angola and Ethiopia as users of this Sukhoi-family. Can you comfirm that?--Arado 08:22, 24 August 2006 (UTC)
