Talk:Silver

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Elementbox converted 12:35, 6 July 2005 by Femto (previous revision was that of 20:28, 29 June 2005).

Unusual uses of silver include the manufacture of prosthetic noses. :-)
My goodness: that comment sells itself short, by appearing to have a link to Prosthetic nose. Follow the link, for an intellectual treat. --Jerzy 16:50, 2004 Feb 20 (UTC)

...without causing noticeable harm to more complex life-forms.

Is this statement acceptable? I see people saying that it does, and that it bonds to human cells etc

Contents

[edit] How precious is a precious metal?

Your text on silver lists it as the second most precious metal following gold. In your text on platinum, you list this as considered more precious than gold. Is the "consideration" a common fallacy as reguards regards platinum as a marketable quantity, or is the text in error in calling silver the second most precious after gold?

The article precious metal states
The demand for precious metals is driven only in part by their practical use; it is also driven by their value as investments. Palladium is, as of January 2004, valued at about half the price of gold, and platinum at about twice that of gold. Silver is substantially less expensive than these metals, presently at 1/65 the price of gold, but is often traditionally considered a precious metal for its role in coinage and jewelry.
but doesn't "price" iridium.
With that possible exception, we can deduce the following sequence among the 4, which may or may not be the absolute ranking.
  1. platinum
  2. gold
  3. Palladium
  4. Silver
The injection of "marketability" into the discussion may refer to the distinction between the use of precious metals as hedges against currency fluctuations (or economic disaster) and their industrial uses. That distinction may be worth discussing in precious metal. (My understanding is that gold prices rise during crises to levels that would reduce its use for, e.g. edge-connector-plating in printed-circuit boards for electronics, if those prices were sustained in the long run. Gold futures contracts are industrial users' means of keeping their business running despite such fluctuations.)
But IMO let's treat this discrepancy for now as just sloppy research, unless someone comes forward with the intentions of previous editors, and for now reflect those rankings in the respective articles. Unless someone wants to research iridium prices first.

--Jerzy 16:43, 2004 Feb 20 (UTC)

[edit] Health Effects

Removed the following sentences because I believe they are incorrect:

  • Silver is used in along with copper as an agent to remove algae in swimming pools in the United States by use of electrolysis.
  • Some swimming pools do not use silver due to staining problems so they instead used copper-zinc colloids instead.

I can't find any information on the web about swimming pools being sterilized by the use of copper-zinc colloids.

I suspect the following sentence is also incorrect, but I don't know enough about the field:

  • Copper is active against algae while silver is active against bacteria primarily due to silver's activity in the absorption of oxygen causing bacteria to oxidize on contact.

Bacteria do not oxidize, nor does silver readily "absorb" oxygen. Eric 03:28, 24 Jun 2005 (UTC)

hello Eric ! take a look at oligodynamic effect. michael

Yes, I read the oligodynamic page, but it doesn't say anything about oxidation. Why does the absorption of oxygen by silver and the resulting "oxidation" of the bacteria not have a similar effect on algae? Eric 17:57, 24 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Hello Eric ! What do you mean by "oxidation of bacteria" and what do you mean exactly by "absorption of oxygen by silver" ? Silver-ions are interacting with some sulphur-containing enzymes and may therefore influence "respiration" of bacteria, and are "toxic" for silver-sesitive bacteria. Is this the effect you mean ? As i told on the discussion-page of colloidal silver, i made a (a bit quick and dirty) translation-attempt of my own webpage in german concerning silver and its oligodynamic effect.The link to that page is there. This text may help to find keywords for further investigation.
That was in reference to the sentence in the Health Effect section that I believe is incorrect. See above. Chemically speaking, it doesn't really make sense. Eric 20:22, 26 Jun 2005 (UTC)

[edit] There are health benefits in medical publications

I did a major restructuring of the health effects section. I removed the line:

  • However, no clinical study has yet demonstrated a therapeutic use for silver as an antibiotic in vivo.

    For I have found several studies claiming therapeutic benefits in vivo roaming around pubmed. One of these is a study done on rabbits infecting them with herpes in the eyes and then dropping silver droplets either right in there, or after 20 hours. The study simply says under results: 'Prevention of keratoconjunctivitis'. It works. Many of the most recent entries in pubmed concerning silver only mention argyria, but I have not dug deeper into pre-1990 studies which should be much more common. Older scientific publications simply usually are not online, so the current medical library is biased to only the fashion of the last 25 years. And silver went out of fashion the moment antibiotics came into play. I also removed the line:

    Copper is active against algae while silver is active against bacteria primarily due to silver's activity in the absorption of oxygen causing bacteria to oxidize on contact.

    Because the only source I could find for this is a site that immediately tries to sell you something. Also, there more than one possible process mentioned in the medical publications I read on the function of silver compounds in the body. It is also highly unlikely that the antibacterial function of silver is the same as it's antiviral function, and I can also find some evidence of this in the literature. I highly recommend keeping the explanation of the exact process open unless a credible source is cited.

    Please provide sources for your additions. And sign your posts here.
    I removed the following unsourced quote:
    "A polymer protected form of silver, called Argleas, has been developed in the UK; it releases silver at a controlled rate, thereby overcoming the neutralizing effect of the ever-present chloride ions...this new form of silver has received approval from the US Food and Drugs Administration for use in antimicrobial dressings and with catheters."
    If you have a source then reference it and re-insert. Thanks, Vsmith 12:59, 3 January 2006 (UTC)
    The only contribution so far from the user who added this. Arglaes (note the spelling...) is a trademarked name of a product line of Medline Industries, Inc. - Reads like an advert anyway. Femto 13:22, 3 January 2006 (UTC)
    • It appears to be a legitimate product, based on the number of hits in Google Scholar. It is, at least, the subject of genuine research. [http:// scholar.google.com/ scholar?hl=en&lr=&q=Arglaes+&btnG=Search] But as there are similar products on the market, I think this particular application is non-notable. Even if it is significant, I think it probably belongs over at Silver nitrate rather than here. eaolson 17:15, 3 January 2006 (UTC)

    The sentence: ...However, no clinical study has yet demonstrated a therapeutic use for silver as an antibiotic in vivo... is still valid. i am observing every month medline for new entries. there is no known evidence for any in-vivo treatment using silver so far. Redecke 17:54, 3 January 2006 (UTC)

    [edit] Silver Whiskers an Application?

    If you follow the article on Silver Whiskers, which is listed as an application, you'll find that it is a failure mechanism of silver and other metals, not an application. Stifynsemons 06:33, 1 April 2006 (UTC)

    [edit] More Facts

    If these facts have already been adressed, feel free to delete the bullet

    • <>Who discovered it, and when?
    • <>What is the oxidation number and states?
    • <>What does the name mean?
    • <>Where did the name come from?
    • <>What is the solubility of it?
    • <>What is the maleability of it?
    • <What is the ductility of it?
    • Is is flammable?
    • What is it reactive with?

    [edit] Smelting

    Ought there not to be something in the article about how silver is produced from its ores? Peterkingiron 23:06, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

    [edit] Antiwerewolf etc.

    I've cut

    * In legend, silver is traditionally seen as harmful to supernatural creatures like werewolves and vampires. The use of silver fashioned into bullets for firearms is a popular application.

    ... because werewolf and vampire articles say that neither mentions silver as a traditional weapon against them (except for a throwaway comment on Slavic vampire folklore saying that they were afraid of it, but not killed by it). Personally, I can't find any fictional refs to vampires and silver pre-Blade, although werewolves've been associated with the stuff for ages. I've replaced it with...

    *Silver is often used in modern horror fiction as a weapon against certain supernatural entities, especially werewolves, who are sometimes described as being burned by silver.

    ... which puts more emphasis on the fiction and less on the legend. (I also moved it to the bottom of the list - it was i the middle of a load of scientific applications...) Tyrhinis 22:27, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

    It'd also help if I realised modern fiction article doesn't exist. Bah. Tyrhinis 22:28, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

    [edit] Kind-a-folklorish-sort-of

    Forgive me for doing before asking – but I namechanged section Superstition to Folklore. I wish the story of Judas Iscariot to be moved from History to Folklore, but Superstition is an inappropriate (read: religiopolitically incorrect) heading for the (historically unattested) story about everybody's love-to-hate-Judas-Iscariot. Rursus 11:46, 12 December 2006 (UTC)


    Silver bullets (as opposed to those made of other materials, such as the usual lead, or such phenomena as the playing of a silver flute or the ringing of silver bells), are among the few material objects (among the others, garlic and crucifixes) and natural phenomena (sunlight) that can destroy the Dracula character of legend. The conventions for the Dracula character are so well established that they cannot be altered without using literary credibility.

    Silver bullets are also associated with another legendary character, the Lone Ranger of radio serials, comic strips, television shows, and one dreadful movie as a calling card.

    These references belong in literature or pop culture; they obviously lack any scientific validity. --Paul from Michigan 02:01, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

    [edit] Gas solubility

    From my M.Sc. research I know that oxygen dissolves into silver rather easily. Attempts were made to create a membrane for filtering pure O2 from air. Shouldn't this be mentioned in the article? Like, under applications? -- Bakabaka 14:31, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

    [edit] Picture of 'Vulva11' attached to spoken audio of article

    Image 'Vulva11.jpg' was somehow attached to 'Silver.ogg' so I removed the audio from the file for until it is cleaned up. The large picture of female genitalia appeared directly over the beginning of the article in a very distracting and not entirely unwelcome (yet inappropriate) way. This appears on (at least) Safari 2.0.4 and would be visible in the HTML source regardless. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.84.173.11 (talk) 10:08, 9 December 2006 (UTC).

    Can't reproduce, it seems to be OK. I reverted the removal of the spoken article link. --Dirk Beetstra T C 11:32, 9 December 2006 (UTC) (reinstate removed answer, seem to have removed that in a revision Dirk Beetstra T C 18:14, 9 December 2006 (UTC))
    I have been going through the links, through the source and through pages linking to the image you describe, but I cannot find how this page is linked here, maybe a strange browser error. --Dirk Beetstra T C 18:21, 9 December 2006 (UTC)
    hehehe... that's quite a browser error then. :) It was definitely a deliberate popup, although I don't see it anymore. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.84.173.11 (talk) 18:29, 9 December 2006 (UTC).
    I should have added, I cannot find edits in the history as well. But well, if it is gone, it is gone :-) --Dirk Beetstra T C 18:40, 9 December 2006 (UTC)
    It's Template:Spoken Wikipedia that was vandalized. Femto 19:15, 9 December 2006 (UTC)
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