Talk:Second Empire

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Please provide some images of examples of this style.

You cite Opera Garnier as the canonical example of Second Empire style... yet when you go to the Opera Garnier page, it describes itself as being designed in the Neo-Baroque style... I don't think that both can be correct.

• Added an image and removed image request template. --ScottyBoy900Q 16:56, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Largest?

Wondering if anyone could help me verify this piece of info:

Prior to the construction of The Pentagon in the 1940s, the Second Empire–styled Ohio State Asylum for the Insane in Columbus, Ohio was documented as the largest building under one roof in America, proving the style's adaptability.

I can only find articles here and there (not wholly reputible sources, either) that claim it was the largest building. There is no mention of footprint size (foundation) or total square feet. However, the exact same claim is made for Greystone Park Psychiatric Hospital, which does have verifiable square-foot information on the building. I know every building wants its claim to fame, but I find it bizarre that these two Kirkbride buildings would both have the same claim attached to them. Any help would be appreciated. Rkitko 11:21, 5 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Revival of what?

This phrase puzzles me "Second Empire was succeeded by the Queen Anne Style era, and its sub-styles, which enjoyed great popularity until the rise of the “Revival Era” in American architecture just before the end of the 19th century." what exactly is the "Revical Era" is it the Gothic Revival, which contrary to the claim in the lead never fell out of fashion in certain areas of design, or is it something else compltely. Giano | talk 09:25, 28 April 2006 (UTC)

I suspect that this refers to the Classical Revival phase that was kicked off by the Columbian Expo in 1893. The Gothic Revival - used mostly for educational purposes did not really get going until the early 20th Century. There were a couple of Gothic revivals, but the one that never went out of style is/was the use of Gothic for churches. At least this is my opinion as to what this is about. Feel free to improve the article so that it makes better sense to you, and hopefully everyone. Carptrash 16:21, 28 April 2006 (UTC)

• I think the problem here, is one of transatlantic differences. We on the European side regard the Gothic revival as having started in the late 18th century and continuing until at least 1914, and you are saying on the American side that is not the case. I don't feel confident enough to edit this page, as I think it also probable (from reading the page so far) that the American version of "Second Empire" is not exactly comparable to what is understood here in Europe. To my mind the Opera Garnier is not "Second Empire" at all but a Neo-Renaissance building with Baroque influences - where are the particular "Second Empire" features? being built during the time of the second French empire is not a good enough reason - However, far greater experts than me have differing opinions on this, so I don't think I'll become involved in "Second Empire (Wikipedia style)" - it's far too much of an architectural minefield. Giano | talk 18:10, 28 April 2006 (UTC)

Although American architectural historians [wikipedia style] are a opinionated lot I would not characterize any of the discussions that I have been involved in by using any war [i.e. minefield] terminology. You do raise an interesting point about the role of the Atlantic in these articles and it might be best to turn this article into a "Second Empire style in America" one and let the Europeans do what they will with their buildings. In America the term Second Empire is pretty widely used and understood. I think the name was chosen because Americans [opinion] have frequently felt like Europe's country cousins, at least in the architecture world. Thus the term Second Empire, with its nod toward some French precursors was easily employed. This style, even when used for residences, was considered to be flashy, expensive and "European" witnessed by the fact that the style pretty much gets absorbed by the slightly less pretentious Italianate style. Hmmm, I wonder how wikipedia is dealing with that one? Carptrash 15:38, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

• Hmmm! Well having just clicked and read Italianate one can only say "Oh dear!" Italianate is in fact a form on Neo-renaissance. The information on the Italianate page, to put it politely, is not something I would agree with 100%. Giano | talk 22:39, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

Well, you might be more inclined to agree with it [perhaps up to 87% ?] if the article were just about American Italianate. I just discovered the article while writing to you [see UP] so have only glanced over it, but as a description of the Italianate style as it is the the United States, it's okay. In the US [in my opinion] Neo-renaissance revival would be much more formal designs. Italianate dwellings were usually built as vernacular constructions, designed and built by local builders without an architect, much like the Greek Revival had been a generation earlier. So perhaps I'll go to these articles and toss in a prominent "As used in the United States" right at the beginning. Carptrash 00:25, 30 April 2006 (UTC) and now let's see what Greek Revival gets us into. eeek