Talk:Reusable launch system
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I disagree that this title should redirect to Space Shuttle.
As mention on Wikipedia:Cleanup by myself and two other people (which seems good, as it is not a subject which engenders much interest in the general public), the Shuttle is merely one example of a reusable launch system.
My initial reason for creating the article was to provide the match for the Expendable Launch System article. I then planned to link to pages on other proposed reusable launch systems. It seems improper to do so from within the Space Shuttle article.
There is already a considerable portion of the population who think that the Space Shuttle is the embodyment of a reusable launch system. This is a result of nasa's heavy work to promote it during the 70s and 80s. I really hate to reenforce this flawed viewpoint.
The Space Shuttle is one example of a PARTIALLY reusable launch system. A seriously flawed partially reusable launch system. It is unfortunate that the general concept, which has yet to be treated to a proper test, is forced to be viewed through the narrow box of its one partial functioning example. Audin 05:34, 8 Oct 2003 (UTC)
[edit] Buran
Should Buran not be a fully reusable launch system? It is the Energia rocket which is not reusable, but the rocket is a separate system, unlike the Shuttle system, which contains not reusable parts such as fuel tank and solid boosters. --Bricktop 21:26, 21 Jun 2005 (UTC)
- The Shuttle solid rockets are reusable (although allegedly a refit costs 90% of making new ones) and reused.
- All parts of Buran were designed to be reusable, except for the main tank. (IIRC the main engines were in an engine pod with a parachute, which was retrieved at least once to check for engine damage, the liquid strapon boosters also were reusable, as of course the orbiter). However, most of the Buran infrastructure has been lost due to the collapse of the Soviet Union. No flight worthy vehicles survive today either, to the best of my knowledge. Quasarstrider 18:46, 22 Jun 2005 (UTC)
- Buran itself has no fuel tank (except an iternal tanks for orbital purposes - docking, orbit change maneuvers - which are reusable) and no liquid boosters. These parts are the Energia rocket, which itself is only a carrier for Buran, but can also launch other payloads (see Polyus). From that point of view Buran is fully reusable. --Bricktop 19:42, 22 Jun 2005 (UTC)
- Ok, I should have said Energia. But your argument is pointless. The Shuttle Orbiter (the analog of Buran) is also fully reusable. Buran could not reach orbit without Energia to boost it. Energia+Buran is not more reusable than the Shuttle launch system. Quasarstrider 16:37, 23 Jun 2005 (UTC)
- Buran itself has no fuel tank (except an iternal tanks for orbital purposes - docking, orbit change maneuvers - which are reusable) and no liquid boosters. These parts are the Energia rocket, which itself is only a carrier for Buran, but can also launch other payloads (see Polyus). From that point of view Buran is fully reusable. --Bricktop 19:42, 22 Jun 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Dense fuel?
What is dense fuel? -- Cimon avaro; on a pogostick. 10:14, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
- Basically, almost any fuel except hydrogen. Some fuels like methane are borderline. The relative density of liquid hydrogen is 0.07 (water is 1, LOX is 1.4, kerosene IRC is about 1.1). For liquids with a relative density of about 1, a tank weighs about 1% of the contents. The same tank with hydrogen in is about 14% or so. Also, hydrogen needs lots of insulation... state of the art hydrogen tanks are under 10% of the weight. This extra tankage weight (as well as other knock-on effects in pipes and pumps) makes a huge reduction in performance; roughly cancelling for the extra Isp that hydrogen gives (for lower stages, upper stages do better with hydrogen).WolfKeeper 13:25, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
