Talk:Pantera

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This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Pantera article.
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Nufy8 (talk • contribs • email)

Contents

[edit] Copyvio

This looks to be copyrighted - see http://www.vh1.com/artists/az/pantera/bio.jhtml The same person who did this, also did KoЯn, which may also be copyrighted, as well as several others which look copyrighted that I've not checked yet (Primus_(band), Faith No More, Journey). I don't have time to clean them all up now - I'd appreciate it if somebody else could. --Camembert 02:59, 1 November 2002 (UTC)

Camembert, I did that before I even saw your comment here.  :-) -- Zoe 03:21, 1 November 2002 (UTC)
I was pretty sure somebody would sort them out without me saying anything, but I thought I'd stick a note here just in case they slipped through the net. Thanks for doing the dirty work, Zoe (oh, and mav too) :-) --Camembert 03:26, 1 November 2002 (UTC)

[edit] Ford Pantera

Should write something about the Ford Pantera, you guys really don't have many car articles on here —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.61.19.167 (talk • contribs) 21:38, 15 August 2004 (UTC).

That's a different Pantera MrHate 03:53, 20 January 2005 (UTC)
Yes this is the BAND Pantera dumbass. That's why we're talking about singles and radio play and crap like that. TearAwayTheFunerealDress 16:30, 28 November 2005 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Civility. Sum0 22:33, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Vandalism

There's been an anonymous user inserting "Douchbag" Darrell into the page at random places as well as adding random profanities. The vandalism has been removed a few times but if it continues, I think we should consider locking the page temporarily. Any thoughts? MrHate 03:53, 20 January 2005 (UTC)

No objections here. And sorry about insulting other users. Bad day. TearAwayTheFunerealDress 15:07, 29 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Changes

Well, I've made all of the changes I can think of making right now. What do you guys think? I'm sure it still has the chance to be expanded upon further, but I don't have much else to go by. Nufy8 22:02, 19 October 2005 (UTC)

No one has any comments? :P Nufy8 04:24, 23 October 2005 (UTC)
I fail to see how Pantera's greatest influence were the classic bay area thrash bands. While the song structures may be more or less similar, the vocals, the heavy and relatively slow guitar riffs as well are the drumwork are obviously hardcore influenced. Anselmo himself said that they were influenced mainly by hardcore bands... I don't see any reference to this in your article. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 85.64.43.72 (talk • contribs) 16:00, 27 November 2005 (UTC).
Where does it say that the Big Four of Thrash are their greatest influences? It merely says Pantera emerged from them, i.e., that as classic thrash was winding down, its influenced transferred substantially into Pantera's rise. I'm not denying that they have other influences (see the references to Rob Halford and Judas Priest), which may include hardcore; it says right on AMG's biography (and this article, for that matter) that the vocals resemble a hardcore sound. However, if Anselmo did say that their main influences were hardcore bands, we need a source for this; I may have missed it, but I haven't seen anything to that effect - I'll go over some of the sources again. If you find a source for this, I'd be glad to incorporate it into the article. Nufy8 15:45, 27 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Dallas?

The article and infobox state that Pantera is from Dallas. Further down in the article it gives Pantego as the hometown. For that matter I always thought they were from Arlington; one or more members lived a couple of blocks from my old jr. high schoool. At any rate, why Dallas? -- Gyrofrog (talk) 08:11, 29 November 2005 (UTC)

The Best of Pantera insert calls them "Dallas-based." As for Pantego, it sounds very familiar, but I don't think it's in any of the sources. I'll see if I can't find it somewhere. Nufy8 15:40, 29 November 2005 (UTC)
Well, Cowboys from Hell was recorded in Pantego Studios in Pantego, Texas. Beyond that I'm not sure. Nufy8 20:59, 29 November 2005 (UTC)
They're simply said to be from Dallas because few from outside the state would really know where Arlington or Pantego is, just like how those from suburbs of major cities say they come from, for example, "Chicago" when while not living in the city proper. I have a Guitar World tribute edition to Darrell, and it says that the band originated from Pantego, although it is possible that they could have "relocated", for lack of a better word, to Arlington. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Rp81 (talk • contribs) 02:55, 10 February 2006 (UTC).
Pantego is "in" Arlington; Arlington is a major suburb between Ft. Worth and Dallas, and Pantego is a small community east of Lake Arlington. Saying they are from Arlington is more accurate than Dallas. Have a look at Google Maps. As far as I know, the Abbotts lived actually in Arlington. 128.101.244.225 18:05, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Reunion

I don't agree with the part of the article that says: "After Dimebag's death, a Pantera reunion has of course become impossible,..." A band is larger than a single person, and certainly many bands have had a reunion after the death of a member. I do not see why a reunion has become "impossible;" if so, it should be explained. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Mmathu (talk • contribs) 07:11, 17 December 2005 (UTC).

I think that was meant more to suggest that a reunion of the band consisting of its core members would be impossible. I'll try and reword the sentence to reflect that. Nufy8 06:17, 17 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Spongebob

Where would be a good place to mention the sampling of Pantera music in that one Spongebob episode? Also does anyone have any more information on it such as how they came together etc.. Johhny-turbo 23:37, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

You could always create a "trivia" section, or similar? IainP (talk) 23:52, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
I'm not so sure it really needs any other mention, other than what's already there. Also, it seems unlikely that there's a story behind it, other than Pantera coming together to record a song for a soundtrack. If there is, I would suggest adding it to the bottom of the "Studio activity" section, seeing as how it appears to be the last song they recorded. Nufy8 00:01, 24 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Chart positions

http://www.billboard.com/bbcom/retrieve_chart_history.do?model.chartFormatGroupName=Albums&model.vnuArtistId=5375&model.vnuAlbumId=413295 —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Kasmif1221 (talk • contribs) 03:04, 20 February 2006 (UTC).

Ok, thanks. I'll add them back in. Also, is there anything for Cowboys from Hell? Nufy8 02:52, 20 February 2006 (UTC)
Album Certifactions- http://www.riaa.com/gp/database/search_results.asp
Charted singles in the U.K http://www.everyhit.com/searchsec.php
U.S Singles http://www.billboard.com/bbcom/retrieve_chart_history.do?model.vnuArtistId=5375&model.vnuAlbumId=413295
Cowboys From Hell never charted —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Kasmif1221 (talk • contribs) 08:50, 20 February 2006 (UTC).
I added this info to the article and put the "Charted singles" heading back. Thanks again. Nufy8 17:12, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Power metal?

QUOTE: "Pantera was a popular heavy metal band from Arlington, Texas that formed in 1981. Specifically, some fans consider them power metal, groove metal (post-thrash), or an amalgamation of both (so called "power groove", a term the band devised themselves)."

Power metal? Power metal is stuff like Helloween, or any other recent band that sounds like a sped-up Iron Maiden with keys....Pantera had little Halford-style wailing or high-pitched vocal melodicism, NWOBHM style dual-guitar harmonies, lyrics about fantasy, keys, etc... I'm removing that. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Rp81 (talk • contribs) 23:22, 23 March 2006 (UTC).

It wasn't overbearing, but Pantera did show power metal in Cowboys from Hell. They combined that power metal with groove metal to create, as they call it, "power groove." After CfH, they moved more into groove metal (which is why the template lists them as groove metal). Either way, they personally describe themselves as having that power metal edge, so it should be kept in. Nufy8 22:30, 23 March 2006 (UTC)
yeah, you're right there, but I think that's the only post-hair album that has any songs to compare to with power metal. I guess you might as well put it back, but only in light of their first album...to the average person who knows nothing of Pantera, having that term at the top of the page would prove very misleading. perhaps it should be mentioned in the context of their timeline when CFH was released. --Rp81 05:01, 27 March 2006 (UTC)
Ok, I took power metal out of the intro and put it in the CfH paragraph. Nufy8 07:16, 27 March 2006 (UTC)
I think they should be regarded as simply Heavy Metal beacause through out their years they have regarded themselfs as "Heavy Metal." —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.139.199.153 (talk • contribs) 02:54, 2 October 2006 (UTC).
Well, they are. But they've regarded themselves with a specific subgenre, and are often grouped under one. Nufy8 02:11, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
Well then maby they should be regarded as thrash or Dethmetal —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.139.199.153 (talk • contribs) 02:55, 3 October 2006 (UTC).
No, because they're not really either. Nufy8 02:17, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
Well we should regard them as heavy metal beacause thats what they would want and its not really fun to complicate things. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.139.199.153 (talk • contribs) 01:11, 4 October 2006 (UTC).
If we were to classify them as what they want (which isn't always correct), then they themselves classify their sound as "power-groove." Either way, I don't see how it's complicating anything. In general, they're a heavy metal band. Specifically, they used to be glam metal, then they evolved into groove metal. What's so bad about that? Nufy8 01:08, 4 October 2006 (UTC)
Nothings bad about it its just easier to put them under the general title of heavy metal, I mean whats the point of trying to divided it? Good tunes is good tunes. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 207.193.160.251 (talk • contribs) 18:38, 4 October 2006 (UTC).
Well, they are under the general title of heavy metal in the opening sentence and in the infobox template. However, it's standard for an encyclopedia like Wikipedia to address the specifics of a band's sound. Nufy8 17:48, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Lawsuit

With the bit about Anselmo inciting a crowd to beat up a heckler, the article doesn't state whether the guy actually got beat up, or if the band were just sued for incitation. It doesn't read quite right. Superbo 11:47, 2 April 2006 (UTC)

The source doesn't say, but it can probably be assumed that he did get beat up - can someone even be sued for incitation? Nufy8 17:30, 2 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Influences

Has anyone seen the VH1 behind the music bio yet? According to it (or at least my interpretation of it), they were influenced in the beginning by bands like Kiss and Van Halen, hence their spandex era. I mean unless it comes from the horse's mouth, should we be making assumptions about their early influences based on the music. Seems kind of subjective to me. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 63.173.114.137 (talk • contribs) 04:22, 23 May 2006 (UTC).

The article does say that they were influenced by KISS and Van Halen in the beginning (as per the sources), so I'm not sure I understand your question. Nufy8 04:39, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Audio samples

I added audio samples of one track from each post-hair metal album that the band produced. I felt these songs exemplified the band's sound the best through each successive album and and/or were the most popular. However, since Web sites like Amazon.com don't have 30 second audio clips from the band's 1980s albums, and because I'm no good at audio editing, someone else would need to add them if they felt inclined to do so. Nufy8 05:06, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

I think AllMusic.com has short clips. Jordan 14:24, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
Just clips from their post-hair metal albums, unfortunately. Nufy8 16:32, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Template

Other bands have a specific genre in their template box. Why not Pantera? Pasajero 13:03, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

I just think it'll confuse readers to list such significantly different subgenres as glam metal and groove metal (assuming they haven't read the article). Nufy8 18:06, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Discography

I have created another page dedicated to Pantera discography and have moved the discography section there. This will help reduce this article size to within the prescribed norms. Will231982 11:47, 12 September 2006 (UTC)Will231982

Thanks; I figured that would be necessary at some point. I added a much more basic listing of the band's studio albums (and their certifications) under the main discography link. Nufy8 16:28, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Controversy

Is this the same speech that the Montreal DJ (mentioned in main Pantera article) alleges was racist? Perhaps, if it is, it can be added to that section as a citation. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5iQZEBBg7hE 68.33.185.185 06:27, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

It could be, but I'm not really sure that can be verified. Also, Phil says "Brooklyn, you listen to me..." so that might not be the speech the Montreal DJ was talking about. Nufy8 16:04, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] layout

either this page wont load properly in my browser, or the layout is severly(sp?) messed up... can anyone clarify the position of the infobox being on the left, and seperate from the main text? 194.83.71.232 10:37, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

sorry, wrote the above before signing in.... Jonomacdrones 10:38, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
The infobox is on the right and parallel to the main text, and everything else looks fine to me in both Firefox and IE. Nufy8 15:15, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Pantera and Jesus

There is a traditional that Jesus of Nazareth was the product of an illicit liaison between Mary and a Roman soldier named Pantera. CBS News alluded to this (quite cautiously, as one might imagine) last year. See page three on the linked transcript. http://www.religionandpluralism.org/MediaSummary/PDFs/Dec1Dec312005/TheMysteryOfChristmas_CBSNews_122005.pdf

Any connection between the band's name and that story? --Christofurio 21:53, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

I've never come across any connection between the band and the Roman soldier. I've never come across anything substantial about the origin of the band's name, for that matter. The sentence in the "Miscellanea" section might need to be removed; although it sounds logical, nothing concrete has been presented about Pantego coinciding with Pantera. Nufy8 23:08, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
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