Talk:Nikola Tesla

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Contents

[edit] Nikolai Tesla and his Earthquake Machine

What's this I hear about an earthquake machine? Can we put some information on this? IT SEEMS PRETTY DAMN IMPORTANT!

-G

[edit] Main Photograph

The photographed looks shopped. More to the point, it looks edited at the source. I think this may be an example of 1920's vainity photoshopping in action.

[edit] Year of death of Tesla's mother

In the Wikipedia's entry on Tesla there is a wrong data on the year of death of Tesla's mother. It was 1892, at the time of Tesla's only visit to Europe since he left for the US. This can be easily verified, in Tesla's autobiography or elsewhere.

The year stated in the Wikipedia entry is 1882. In my opinion, it would be very important to fix this error. Otherwise, congratulations for the good work.


[edit] quirks?

I've read about tesla in various places before and one of the most interesting things about him were his extreme alleged eccentricities, which don't seem to be mentioned here at all. Things like having to do everything in multiples of 3 and whatnot (I forget exactly what they were). Or maybe such quirks are false and a prank played by historians or himself- perhaps assisted by mark twain..

[edit] Synaesthesia? Asperger syndrome?

In a number of different places I've read that Tesla had synaesthesia, but I've not been able to find the source of such information. Could someone give a reference?

Tesla was one of the famous people mentioned in the book "Different like me: my book of autism heroes" by Jennifer Elder. I've not read the book myself. Is it worth mentioning that Tesla might have been on the autistic spectrum (along with many other great minds like Newton, Einstein etc)? OCD and synaesthesia seem to be associated with autism. I think Asperger syndrome could explain a lot about Tesla's life.

[edit] reverts

Can we stop this senseless pattern of reverting others' edits? Reverting people who fix spelling errors, correct grammar and make other uncontroversial changes is no way to build good faith amongst editors. If you disagree with part of an edit, revert that part if you must, but don't revert the whole thing wholesale. –Joke 15:04, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

When you revert, it is not considered good form to revert other users' spelling corrections, link fixes, punctuation corrections and grammar and style corrections while pursuing your favorite hobby-horses. –Joke 03:34, 23 May 2006 (UTC)
I wish we could but apparently people think they have the power to do anything they want to an article without consensus. It's quite simple:

A) If you don't think Tesla's cat has relevance in this aricle, you can

a) remove it b) change it or give it relevance

do not

c) change it along with other parts of the article that you don't agree with.

72.144.150.233 08:50, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Please, stop changing edits. People who do that are

A) annoying.

If you don't like my part of my post, that's no reason to go and erase averything I've added. That's why I somtimes don't leave an edit summary.Dan

99% of the material in this article has already been reviewed by and accepted by the majority of editors on here. Now, we're getting massive changes and adding POV claims like "Tesla is also known for his ground breaking contribution to the radio, whose patented research in 1897 allowed Guglielmo Marconi to broadcast the first signal across the English Channel in 1899." While an editor is consistently removing sourced and relevant information in this article, such as a paragraph outlining the prototype of a loudspeaker invented by Tesla. 72.144.150.233 08:54, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

It is your responsibility when doing the reversions not to needlessly revert others' work. Frankly, I don't know anything about this Marconi sentence. Remove it if you find it offensive, and reinsert the loudspeaker. But as long as you keep doing these robotic reverts back to a version with spelling errors, poor grammar, mismatched parentheses, an overlong introduction and ambiguous links, I will continue to revert your changes. Why don't you try and compromise? –Joke 13:35, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Marconi used Tesla's research without giving Tesla credit. This is widely known historical fact known to any biographer of the man. The only problems that appear in the anon user's edit is that they sound sycophantic. No one can believe that something is pov when lines like

"It is of some interest to note that Tesla was reportedly born at the very stroke of midnight during a lightning storm, according to various biographies" or "In the United States, Tesla's fame rivaled that of any other inventor or scientist in history or in popular culture". and "he was widely respected as America's greatest electrical engineer." This sounds like something out of a fan club and does not constitute valid research. Finally, what is it with that pet cat? Guy Montag 06:06, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

There, I have reinserted the stuff about the loudspeaker and removed the stuff about Marconi. I have almost surely annoyed someone else in doing so... –Joke 13:49, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Hi, Joke. Please make any edits you have to make on the original version, not on the one that was recently butchered and vandalized, including the removal of numerous sentences almost by random, plus the addition of weird sentences like "When Edison was a very old man and close to death, he said his biggest mistake was that he never respected Nikola Tesla or his work." and farfetched POVs like a change from "Tesla's theory is ignored by some researchers (and mainly disregarded by physicists)." to "disregarded by nearly all researchers" (which is untrue). For an example of random deletions:

the following was deleted by a user without posting any reason for why it was removed in talk:


Furtheremore, an entire paragraph was randomly removed from the intro, and several sentences were replaced by the nonsensical sentence "He was one of the pioneers of modern electrical engineering; however, due in large part to the unfavorable course of his competition and disputes with other inventors, such as Thomas Edison." 72.144.60.85 18:34, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

You really ought to pay attention. I removed the weird Edison sentence already. I am finding it hard not to see your behavior as willful obstinance. It is certainly true that Tesla's theory of gravity plays no role in modern physics – who else other than physicists (and perhaps historians of science) would study a theory of gravity? Why don't you look at the diffs yourself and fix the part that was butchered and vandalized. –Joke 18:55, 23 May 2006 (UTC)
Researchers and physicists are two different occupations last time I checked. Instead of reverting by random as you're doing, how about helping me improve the original? I can't fix the parts that were butchered and vandalized without reverting, because too much was randomly removed. I explain everything I do in here. No one else does. 72.144.60.85 18:57, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

I am trying to improve the original. Here are some things that are wrong with the original. In the intro:

Actually you did nothing to the original. Last time I checked those changes were made before you came.
  • It is too long and hagiographic.
It's taken from several official biographies, and is no more hagiographic than some of the information of Newton, Einstein, and others. I did shorten it though, it was a bit long.
  • The "editor's note" is bad style.
That's true. That should be moved.
  • "mechanical and electrical engineer" can be shortened to engineer
Um no...there are computer, industrial, civil engineers too
  • He is recognized as one of the most accomplished inventors, not scientists.
No, he made fundamental contributions to physics theory (it states right in the intro) as well as numerous other fields.
Do some research.
  • He did not die forgotten. That is melodramatic and wrong.
The fact that nearly all official biographies state this is clear enough evidence he died pretty much forgotten.
  • The caption writes "Dr. Nikola Tesla." It is not conventional to use a title with the first name. Why not just "Nikola Tesla."
Fine change that.

Aside from those changes, some links in the table of electromechanical devices, paragraphs about Edison and Hinduism which could easily be removed, and some minor rephrasings and changes to links, there is essentially no difference between the two versions. Finally, as far as I can see, "physicists" are a superset of "researchers in theories of gravity".

It didn't state anything about "researchers in theories of gravity"...in fact, it said "researchers".

Also, you've violated the 3RR.

Ok.

–Joke 19:12, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

I've reported the 3RR. Hopefully those lazy 3RR admins will do something for once :-))). Joke - credit to you for trying to sort out this page. I hope you persist. While you do, I'll try to help William M. Connolley 22:45, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

  • I am getting tired of all the senseless and childish reverts and re-reverts on this article. Therefore, I am disassociating myself with it. When you CHILDREN decide to agree on an article, then I shall return. Erzahler 22:30, 28 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Speculation

On par with a recent edit by Philosophus, I removed the line "It was possible that Tesla was told of the plans of the physics award committee and let it be known that he would not share the award with Edison." because it is seemingly an opinion placed in the middle of a biography. It could possibly be readded with a source stating "Some Biographers conclude......." Etc...

72.144.150.233 09:02, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

It is NOT an opinion placed in the middle of a biography. It is from various news stories of newspapers at the time. It is also recorded in most of the reliable biographies (Man out of time, Wizard, etc ...) which cite that he and Edison were told of this (and both were surprised when the prize was awarded to others). Removing the line is uncalled for and is another egregious act of removing information. 17:29, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

The Seifer book "Wizard" contains documentation from the Nobel committee files that neither Tesla nor Edison was offered a Nobel. There was an incorrect story in the London Daily Telegraph in early November, 1915, from their correspondent in Copenhagen, reprinted in the New York Times, that listed Tesla, Edison, and several others as recipients. Tesla said the previous day's NY Times was the first he had heard of the possibility. The info was all wrong, about other supposed recipients as well, and was corrected. The recipients had actually been decided 9 months before. See the article on Nobel Prize Controversies for more info. This is a myth which has been debunked. The various sources were all basing it on an erroneous press report. Edison 17:46, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Compatibility with Nature line

I removed "Tesla considered his exploration of various questions raised by science as ultimately a means to improve the human condition with the principles of science and industrial progress, and one that was compatible with nature.[1]" because its a very unusual line. I put it here in talk so someone can fix it up and have it make more sense, and be more "compatible" (no pun intended) with the article. 72.144.150.233 09:11, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

How is this "very unusual"? 204.56.7.1 (talk • contribs) 17:29, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Encyclopædia Britannica

In thier article on Ferraris, Galileo ... "Meanwhile, other physicists came independently to the same principle — among them Nikola Tesla, who applied and patented it. In the assessment of Thomas Edison they state, "yet [Edison] employed as his aides, at various times, a number of eminent mathematical physicists, such as Nikola Tesla and A.E. Kennelly." They themselves (though not explicity stating him being a physicists in his own article) call him a "Serbian U.S. inventor and researcher". And note, at the end of his entry that "Due to lack of funds, many of his ideas remained only in his notebooks, which are still examined by engineers for inventive clues.".

This latest lil' series of "improvement" (and I use that term loosely) on the Wikipedia article of Tesla proves that Wikipedia suffers from opinions at the cost of facts.

(ps. Inparticular the actions of User:Joke, User:Hillman, and User:William M. Connolley)

134.193.168.250 (talk • contribs) 14:06, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Electrotherapy

Something should be added on Tesla currents (as defined in the 'IEEE dictionary') and Tesla's pioneering work in Electrotherapy. This article could be cited for a reference:

  • Rhees, David J., Electricity - `The greatest of all doctors': An introduction to `high frequency oscillators for electro-therapeutic and other purposes'. Proceedings of the IEEE. Vol. 87, no. 7, pp. 1277-1281. 1999 ISSN 0018-9219

(PS., This is his article on it: Tesla, Nikola, "High Frequency Oscillators for Electro-Therapeutic and Other Purposes". 1898-09-13. (ed., available from tesla.hu))

134.193.168.250 (talk • contribs) 14:53, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Trolling?

I suspect the recent history of edits of this article may include some trolling, hence the new flag added to the headers at the top. I hope that all editors who feel genuine passion will employ restraint and discuss possibly controversial changes in this talk page before trying to unilaterally implement them. ---CH 23:30, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

None of it has been discussed. The majority of anon greivances on here have been generally ignored and as far as I've seen, the users who are editing this page are in cahoots with eachother. LaGrange 00:39, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
Both 134.193.168.250 and User:177.140.153.233 have pointed out the unsound actions of WMC and Joke (I'm not as certain of your participation) in the editing of this page. LaGrange 00:41, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

Note that

  1. the IP 134.193.168.250 (talk • contribs) is an instance of the kc.umkc.edu anon, registered to the University of Missouri in Kansas City, MO. Compare the Linda Hall Library anon, also geolocated in Kansas City, MO.
  2. I can't find in the history page any edits from the IP 177.140.153.233 (talk • contribs). This IP is registered to ARIN itself. Did you perhaps write down the wrong IP while trying to check registration? I guess you might have meant 72.153.86.152 (talk • contribs) (the mia.bellsouth.net anon)

In any case, you should be on the lookout for possible shilling.---CH 03:42, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

How ironical is your flag: ...Remember to always assume good faith. which you missed to assume yourself...Lakinekaki 05:27, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

Well, I am trying to reduce arguing so let's not start arguing over my motivations, Lakinekaki. And LaGrange, I don't understand who you think is "in cahoots" with whom, but if you look at Talk:Chaos theory you will probably agree that it is unlikely that I am "in cahoots" with Lakinekaki.

All I am asking is that the edit war cease. Let's try this instead: if you don't like something in the article,

  1. describe your objection here in the talk page,
  2. present an argument why you think it should be changed,
  3. describe the change you want to see,
  4. react reasonably and fairly to comments on your proposals.

The talk page is here for this kind of discussion, and in my experience compromise is often possible. Fair enough? ---CH

[edit] Semi-protected

Note: this page is semi-protected at the moment, largely in response to anons breaking 3RR. I'm in favour of keeping it for a while; if anyone else has strong opinions that it should be lifted (or kept), please place them here where people can see. William M. Connolley 13:27, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

It's sad the that users Hillman, WMC, and Joke can destroy this page. WMC's, inparticular, ignorance and removal of the verifiable and cited facts (such as that Tesla's papers and writing are still being researched today; he's repeatedly questioned this [but has been cited by the standard EB professionals (see above)]). Hillman, WMC, and Joke have before tried to exclude cited and reliable information; this probably will not stop. WMC is in favour of keeping semi-protected for a while because then the opinionated editors (the ontes cited and others that can be contacted to do so on thier behave [such as IRC, etc.) can remove information that they deem "extraneous" or "bloat" and remove the more valid and cited information. As stated in other posts, Wikipedia suffers the ill informed opinion at the cost of verifable and reliable facts. The pathological skeptical actions of some of these editors is at Wikipedia's peril. 204.56.7.1 (talk • contribs) 16:39, 25 May 2006 (UTC) (registered to Linda Hall Library, Kansas City, MO)

Thanks for sharing. –Joke 16:42, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
Our Linda Hall Library anon also edited History of perpetual motion machines very recently. ---CH 18:58, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Negotiations with British Government on Death Ray

I have doubts about the accuracy and timescales in this article refering to Tesla's negotiations with the British government. I also am doubtful about linking them only to Chamberlain. The article states negotiations began in the Twenties. Baldwin was prime minister 1923-24, 1924-29 and 1935-37 whilst Chamberlain was prime minister 1937-40 and he was replaced by Churchill, not Baldwin.

I suggest removing the line "The incoming Baldwin government..." and adding a line making it clear this is conjecture, not established fact.

There is established folklore in the UK about successive British governments interest in a "Death Ray", but I've been unable to find any hard facts. Arpley88 08:05, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

This is not conjecture! This is not folklore ... sessh ... it's a fact .... 204.56.7.1 (talk • contribs)
Nikola Tesla worked on an actual Death ray in the early 1900's and at the time of his death. He offered the US War Department the secrets of his "teleforce" weapon on January 5, 1943 but was assumed to be crazy. Tesla then offered his device to several European countries. Records which recently turned up in Russia showed that his proposed death ray was based on a narrow stream of atomic clusters of liquid mercury or tungsten accelerated by high voltage, probably produced by a huge Tesla Coil. At the time of his death, a prototype compact version of the "death ray" called an "Anti-Tank gun" was located in a trunk in the basement of his hotel. Immediatly after his death a Russian spy had raided the room and the safe containing the schematics of the "death ray". The FBI never found any of the important parts of the schematics nor the trunk with the prototype, as far as we know. Schematics of the projector nozzel have surfaced, though. 204.56.7.1 19:56, 30 May 2006 (UTC) (taken out of the Death ray history, now a redirect)
PBS has a good page on this. "A Weapon to End War". :204.56.7.1 (talk • contribs)
Other time-period news articles that might help you.
204.56.7.1 (talk • contribs) 20:18, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
Bear in mind that large parts of this article may be dodgy, especially the wacky death-ray stuff. If you think you know better, please edit away. William M. Connolley 11:33, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
Bear in mind that you have an uninformed opinion. 204.56.7.1 (talk • contribs) 20:18, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
Please be polite, Linda Hall Library anon (see WP:CIV). Also, please see the header for instructions on how to wikisign your comments. TIA ---CH 03:12, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
I'll be polite when the editors stop being a prick (in the side) [this was suggested before, but removed by your friend, WMC]. WP:CIV states exactly what you (among others) are doing, personally targeted behavior that causes an atmosphere of greater conflict and stress. A editor can wikisign thier comments with ~~~~ or ~~~ (the note @ top is a guideline). 204.56.7.1 14:52, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Superconductivity references

Pulled out of the archives (as posted by user:reddi), just so more ramblings and POV edits can be headed off.

  • The patent office classifies U.S. Patent 685012 as superconductivity technolgy via several classifications
  • Thomas Valone (ed.) book contains the information on the superconductivity in one of the essays. The essay "Effects of Tesla's Life and Electrical Inventions" specifically notes this.
  • Oliver Nichelson talks of Tesla's invention in this context.
  • In "The Problem of Increasing Human Energy - Through Use of the Sun's Energy," (The Century Illustrated Magazine), Tesla cites Carl von Linde (inventor of a method for liquefying air via "self-cooling"). As Tesla states, "This was the only experimental proof which I was still wanting that energy was obtainable from the medium in the manner contemplated by me ." In 1892, Tesla went to London and saw Professor Dewar's experiments with liquefied gases. Tesla noted that others had liquefied gases before, notably Ozlewski and Pictet. Later, Tesla was working on a project, together with other pojects, which would give a refrigerating machine of exceptional efficiency and simplicity. This is the time of the 1895 Houston Street lab fire which delayed his endeavors. Shortly afterward, "Linde announced the liquefaction of air by a self cooling process, demonstrating that it was practicable to proceed with the cooling until liquefaction of the air took place". Tesla sought to simplify Linde's accomplisment, also. Tesla's endeavors in his own projects (with this as one part) would lead to (according to him) a "self-acting machine deriving energy from the ambient medium".
  • In addition to the above reference, Seifer ("Wizard, the Life and Times of Nikola Tesla". ISBN 1-559723-29-7 (HC)) in the footnote states that (though doubtful) it is probable that Tesla contemplated superconductivity for his world wireless system (this a decade before Onnes experiment). 204.56.7.1 (talk • contribs) 15:01, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
The Linda Hall Library anon in Kansas City, MO; compare Reddi (talk • contribs)
I have some concerns regarding shilling; see WP:SOCK. ---CH 15:31, 10 June 2006 (UTC)

There is no shilling, fraudulent or damaging. Have all the concerns you want, but there are WP:SOCK#Legitimate uses of multiple accounts (Keeping heated issues in one small area). User:reddi may or may not edit at the library here.204.56.7.1 17:08, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tesla's car

I've read some stuff about Tesla's car, which he apparantly demonstrated to his nephew Peter Savo in 1931. The car had an electric motor, but it seemed to get its power from some unknown but universally present source (dark energy, cosmic radiation, gravity). I'm no expert in the field so perhaps I'm talking complete nonsense here, but if it did indeed exist it would've been a fantastic yet forgotten invention. A "free energy" book you can order online claims to contain the instructions on how to build one yourself, but I doubt that as if that were the case we'd all be driving one now and free energy claims always tend to be overrated. Googling for Tesla's car brings up some information, but with little details and not always from the most reliable of websites. Does anyone know more about this and would it perhaps add to the article, or be worth an article of its own? BabyNuke 11:38, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

Seifer ("Wizard, the Life and Times of Nikola Tesla". ISBN 1-559723-29-7 (HC), ISBN 0-806519-60-6 (SC)) talks about this, IIRC. Not sure if Valone's "Harnessing the Wheelwork of Nature" has anything. I'll look around. 204.56.7.1 17:31, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Nationality

I have tried my utter best to portray this issue in NPOV. I have clearly stated that the topic of his natinality is disputed between Croatians and Serbs (which it is), and have taken absolutely no sides. Yes, I'm Croatian, and as much as I would like to post that Nikola Tesla was Croatian (and all Croatian children are thought this in school, even myself all those years ago), I conform to the NPOV rule just like everyone else should.

So please, don't revert this without just cause, which I doubt you could find.

xompanthy 15:11, 10 June 2006 (UTC)

Could you put it as a references note? or fotenote? It just seems a bit jarring there in the intro. 204.56.7.1 17:27, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
template:ref - template:fn

Well I added it right after the claim that he was a Serbian-American inventor. I actually changed it to "American inventor,..., of Serbian and Croatian origin" (which seems a lot more NPOV), but it seems that User:Krytan felt that needed to be reverted. In the hope that we can make this viewpoint a bit more NPOV and avoid a revert war, I left it at that.

I think it should stay in that position since it is a very controversial topic, still argued over even today amogst Croatains and Serbs. And since Wikipedia is NOT a place where one states his own beliefs but FACTS, it should remain there.

And if some pro-Serbian or pro-Croatian user decides that the article should reflect what they BELIEVE is correct, they can go somewhere else.

-- xompanthy 21:01, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

What to do, what to do? This has got to be one of the silliest edit wars I have seen here to date. I suppose it would be very naive of me to suggest that we call Tesla an American of Balkan heritage and leave it at that?---CH 11:14, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
Yes, it would. And what you find silly others might not. -- xompanthy 14:50, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
Actually, since someone removed that section yet again, I find myself not caring. Keep it POV if it means that much to some people. -- xompanthy 20:40, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
I beleive Tesla's own words are the best guideline - he stated "I'm proud of my Serbian heritage and of my Croatian homeland..." . I could argue on both sides for many reason, but the truth is that he was of Serbian nationality, and of Cratian domicile (altough it was as many state a part of Austro-Hungarian Empire, Lika was integral part of Croatia, who shared the rights to Hungarian crown...and the ages of Tesla's youth are the ages in which the Croatian and pan-slavic (unity of all Slavic nations) ideas were the strongest... they resulted with State of Slovenes, Croats and Serbs , and later on with Kingdom of Serbs, Croats and Slovenes...-- Vladimirko 22:23, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

Why I removed reference! - Let's take aside that the article, from (othervise resputable source) was full of incorrections, disputable and biased... Article in question is not relevant reference for establishing anyone's nationality, not even Tesla's, which is mentioned in article. Relevant source and/or reference would be any (preferably legal) record, or paper issued (or recorded) for or by Tesla, stating his nationality. It might be birth record, family record (as kept in parishes at that time), census data, school record, (all of the above mentioned is most probably available in States's Archive of Croatia in Zagreb), then, it might be any imigration data in U.S. (check up the Ellis Island records), or it might be taken anywhere in Tesla's correspondency (available in Museums in Smiljan or Belgrade). Newspaper article, no matter how god or bad it is, cannot be reference source for establishing such fact! Just not to leave article in mention out, here it is:

-- Vladimirko 08:31, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

People! Some of you confounding the issue with bad terminology. What you call "nationality" is in fact called ethnicity in English. Tesla's ethnicity is, as far as I know, not disputed by anyone: Tesla was a Serb. Still, Tesla is put into e.g. Category:Serbian physicists, despite clear Wikipedia guidelines (Wikipedia:Categorization_of_people#By_nationality_and_occupation) that people be categorized by nationality, not ethnicity, except in explicity named categories such as e.g. Category:Serbian people by ethnic or national origin (which, interestingly enough, doesn't exist as of this writing). His nationality was not Serbian: his parents never lived in Serbia, nor did he. GregorB 19:21, 12 July 2006 (UTC)


"Eccentric Serbian-American engineer who made many contributions to the invention of electromagnetic devices. Tesla was Serb who was born in the Croatian village of Smiljan in the Lika region, which at the time was part of Austrian monarchy. His father was an orthodox church priest." Wolfsram Research --Lowg 01:27, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

I'm suprised Croatia is claiming Tesla as his own, seeing as how as soon as Krajina was occupied by the Croatian army, Tesla's statue was destroyed. An interesting way to show respect. In any case, I find the dispute hilarious. His father was a Serb Orthodox priest, and he was christened in the Serbian Orthodox rite... All of his indirect descendants (for Tesla had no children) were Serbian, not Croatian. This is easy enough to find. I can't see a single argument that he is Croatian, other than the fact that the Austro-Hungarian region he was born in was later to become Croatia. I find this irrelevant, and it says nothing about his nationality.

What nation included his birthplace of Smiljan when he was born, and when he came to the US? What nation is his hometown part of now? These questions of fact have some bearing on what words should be used here. I found in Tesla's US "hometown paper," the New York Times, the following: The first mention of his nationality I found was 7/19/1891 , p4, where he was called "Austro-Hungarian." March 4, 1895, it said he came here from "Servia," which was the spelling the NY Times used for Serbia in that era. March 31, 1895, p13 “He is hardly the representative of any European nationality; perhaps he might be better spoken of as a flower of a mountaineering clan. Just as the Highlanders in Scotland have beaten back the tide of invasion, so his people in the highlands of the Adriatic, have fought, cursed, and slaughtered Turks ever since the turban invaded Europe. His people are a rural people, and willing to be peaceful, but ever ready to turn their sheperds’ crooks into spears amd their scythes into bloody blades. They have been planted from time immemorial in the Adriatic mountains, but it was, perhaps, a happy chance that took thither in the turbulent First Napolean days an officer of the victorious French legions, who intermarried and thus gave to the aboriginal stock the blood of which Tesla is the latest and best product.” July 16, 1895 p 10 said he was “a Montenegran.” Sept 29, 1895 p 22, he was described as a "Servian." July 10, 1934, p19 said he was born "in Smiljan, in Austrian Croatia (now part of Yugoslavia. He is the son of a Greek father, a clergyman, and a Serbian mother, Georgiana Mandic, an inventor, and the daughter of an inventor." {single parenthesis in original}. His obituary, Jan. 8, 1943, p 19 said " Nikola Tesla was born at Smiljan, Lika, a border country of Austria-Hungary, on July 10, 1856. His father was a Greek clergyman and orator, and his mother, Georgina Mandic, was an inventor." Jan, 9, 1943, p13 says " Yugoslavia, where Tesla was born of Serbian parents, will be officially represented by..." May 8, 1949, p27, says "..Nikola Tesla, American inventor who was born in Croatia of Serbian parentage.." June 26, 1956 p43 says ""A native of Croatia, Mr Tesla came to the United States in 1884." Jan 24, 1960, px19, calls him "..Croatian born.. " On Feb 9, 1967, p78, calls Tesla "Yugoslavian born" and note that he spoke Croatian with the hotel Maitre d. April 14, 1974, p 12 calls him "Serbian born." Sep 7, 1980, pE20 calls him him “the Serbian inventor.” July 6, 1982, pc3, refers to “ the grandiose claims made in his behalf, particularly by some Tesla admirers who share his Croatian origins.” Sep 18, 1983, pH33,says he was “born in a town in Croatia in what was then Austria-Hungary and is now Yugoslavia." Feb 23, 1997, pLI25 says he was "Born in 1856 to a well-placed Serbian family..” April 19, 1999, pE5, calls him "a Croatian born Serb.” So could we say "Tesla was born of Serbian parents in Smiljan, Lika, Croatia, then a part of the military frontier of the Austro-Hungarian empire, and now part of Croatia.” This mirrors the words used in the article on Smiljan. I don’t know how we explain the “Greek clergyman father” being Serbian unless he was perhaps a Serbian who was also an Orthodox priest.Edison 22:17, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

Oh, how many words... :-) So, here it is, when settling in US, people coming from this part of the world were more confused than anybody reading text above! I found immigration data on ellisisland.org for my greatgrandfather, his sister, her housband and several other family members that came on the same ship, same date from two neighbouring houses. Almost each and every one of them (according to immigration data) came from other country, territory and city, half of them even had their names missspled! According to data they were from Slovenia?, Austria, Hungary, Croatia, Bosnia, Serbia, Ottoman empire?! and some other territories for which I haven't the slightest idea how they came in this records! Reason(s): Ignorant American officials! and people that came from "region that was not more then century ago part of Illiryc provincies occupied by Napoleon, part of Kingdom of Croatia and Slavonia that acording to treaties from 11th century was in personal union with Hungary, and with Hungary together under Habsburgs (Austrian rouling family), so part of the Austrian empire as well, as they lived close to border of Bosnia, territories was under direct governing from Vienna, which was anachronism at that time, but as they had some tax privileges, they were obliged to serve army wherever "crown" needed them!... To CTC, Tesla lived not far from them. Few decades later, Austrian empire collapsed, and most of people declared themselves according to newly grown ideas, as Illyrs, or south Slavs, (Yougoslavian academy of sciencies was founded in Croatia before Yougoslavia named itself as such)or by ethnicity or regionally (and btw, according to international laws Croatia claims it's statehood from 10-th century)... So when Yougoslavia was founded, most of immigrants accepted it as their homeland, accepting their differences too! Not many years later, Serbian king and governmant on head of South Slav country, founded on bases of equality, started redirecting tax money to Serbia, and with time the hell broke loose! But that's another story! So, when (according to his nephew) a politician greeted Tesla on his 80-th birthday as "son of Serbian origin born in Croatia", TESLA replied "As I'm proud of my Serbian roots and Croatian homeland, as you Yougoslav politicians act I'll have no homeland to return to, your haterid is so great, that if it would be possible to turn it into electricity, it would light up the world" (It was just some time after one of the gretest politician of the time(from peasant's party) was assasinated in parliament in Belgrade)... I'm totally in favour of total removal of ANY ethnical, national or geographical(Serbian, Croatian, American) reference from introduction line! Tesla was GREAT MAN and he probably turns in his grave on such disputes! I worked for to many hours today so please fogive me on any typo's I made, you might correct them if they boughter you, and...You've got the point-- Vladimirko 00:48, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

Calling him a "Croatian/Serbian inventor" is just ridiculous. He was born a Serb in what was then Austria. He was educated in Austria and spent more than a half of his life in US. He has nothing to do with Croatia other than the area he was born in is part of Croatia *today*. Calling him an American has a lot more merit than calling him Croatian and I don't really see anyone calling him American.

Following the logic above (“He is not Croatian as he was born in Austro-Hungarian region“, or “He was educated in Austria”), we could also say that Nikola Tesla is Turkish, because Serbia was Turkish region were Serbs were serving 400 years under Ottoman Empire and probably mixed with Turkish, which is both nonsense.

We could safely said that Nikola Tesla was not Serbian inventor. He was Croatian inventor with Serbian origins. Nikola Tesla himself was always proud of being a Croatian of Serbian origins (a similar way as today we say American of African origin). He stated that himself many times and it is recorded in his work and documents.

The fact is that Croatia had advanced education system that leads to many discoveries (propeller, torpedo, first refillable pen etc …). Tesla is product of that education system as well as other famous Croatian scientists. If Tesla would be born in Serbia, he would probably be a smart guy in his village and this is all what he would become. He would do nothing in terms of innovations. The fact that the first Serbian dictionary was made 300 years after Croatian is telling us that under Ottoman Empire Serbian educations system was really poor.

Zizula 01:36, 17 September 2006 (UTC) Zizula 20:06, September 16 2006 (UTC)

I see that Wikipedia states Tesla was a "world-renowned Serb-AMERICAN inventor". The fact is that Tesla, himself, said that he is proud of him being a Serb, and proud of Croatia being his home-country. I just wonder where in history did he become an American? No, the fact that all his works have ben done in America does not mean he EVER was, or will EVER be an American inventor. He is as much as an American as Einstein.

Tesla had American citizenship after all... --Djordje D. Bozovic 16:34, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] FTL claims

Can someone note that some "Tesla Coils" transmissions were "many" times the speed of light and that this is related to cherenkov radiation (and Bremsstrahlung which Tesla used in his X-ray experiments). Thank you. 204.56.7.1 17:00, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

(PS., most modern text on this subject cites cherenkov radiation as what Tesla was referring to when he talks about FTL transmissions)

Are you saying that when Tesla mentioned FTL transmission he was referring to Cherenkov radiation? Can you give an example of a modern textbook (on physics?) which says this? ---CH 11:10, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

When Tesla mentioned FTL transmission, was he was referring to Cherenkov radiation? Yes. Is there modern textbook on physics that state this? No (not that I know of), modern biographies on Tesla DO state this though.

Is there an example of a modern biography? Valone, Thomas, "Harnessing the Wheelwork of Nature". ISBN 1-931882-04-5 (pg. 122-123). Valone's books states, "Tesla had found that at electrical resonance with the earth, electromagnetic waves had become supraluminal [...]. In the supraluminal sense, they moved faster than the speed of light". Then Valone footnotes (bottom pg. 123), "[...]speed of EM phase velocity is v=1/sq rt (LC) which can be faster than light speed in a vacuum." Valone refers the reader to an article, Harold Willis Milnes, "Faster than light?", Radio-Electronics, Vol. 54,, Janurary 1983, for more information.

Are there other references indirectly to this? Yes. Seifer, ["Wizard, the Life and Times of Nikola Tesla". ISBN 1-559723-29-7 (HC), ISBN 0-806519-60-6 (SC)] has a whole chapter called "faster than the speed of light (1927 - 40)". Seifer states "Verification for Tesla that there existed particles that travelled faster than the speed of light were purportedly discovered in the late 1890s whn he invented a device to capture radiant energy. The machine [...] comprised, in essence an insulative plate [...] made out of the 'best quality of mica as a dielectric'" (pg., 423). IF you look at Cherenkov radiation, it is electromagnetic radiation emitted when a charged particle passes through an insulator at a speed greater than the speed of light in the medium. Matter can be accelerated beyond this speed. Cherenkov radiation results when a charged particle exceeds the speed of light in a dielectric (electrically insulating) medium through which it passes. The Bremsstrahlung phenomenon was discovered by Nikola Tesla during high frequency and X-ray research he conducted, several years earlier than the FTL claims.

USPatent 18:46, 19 June 2006 (UTC) (PS., this is in addition to the much older (and more outdated) claims of superluminal communication and, tachyons IIRC, of Cheney ("Tesla: Man Out of Time", ISBN 0-13-906859-7 ))

Do note that the c limit is a the speed of light in a vacuum only. In the dirac sea of reality, there is not a perfect vacuum. And, as was Tesla's belief, there is a medium throughout space (at the minimum, space itself).

You can also read:

  • A-Ahamid Aidinejad and James F. Corum, "The Transient Propagation of ELF Pulses in the Earth-Ionosphere Cavity"
  • James F. Corum and Kenneth L. Corum, "Disclosures Concerning the Operation of an ELF Oscillator"
  • James F. Corum and Kenneth L. Corum, "A Physical Interpretation of the Colorado Springs Data"
  • James F. Corum and Kenneth L. Corum, "Critical Speculations Concerning Tesla's Invention and Applications of Single Electrode X-Ray Directed Discharges for Power Processing, Terrestrial Resonances and Particle Beam Weapons"

USPatent 19:25, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Nobel claims

I NPOVed the Nobel Prize claims a month or two ago, but now they are back in their highly fan-like form. I have tried to fix them, but there seems to be some resistance. Could others look into making this have a NPOV? --Philosophus T 00:03, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

Read:

These should contain the references that you need. This page also give a tast of the news reports about it. Edison and Tesla Win Nobel Prize in Physics. Literary Digest, December 18, 1915.

There isn't anything "fan-like" about this. It's statements of fact. 204.56.7.1 19:26, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

Please read: Nobel Prize controversies. The text there was incorporated here. 204.56.7.1 19:43, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

Another site: Controversy about This Year's Nobel Prize in Medicine teslasociety.com 204.56.7.1 20:00, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

Another verifiable site for the initial incorrect report is the New York Times, Nov 6, 1915, p1: "Edison and Tesla to get Nobel Prizes" which based their statement on the Copenhagen correspondent of the Daily Telegraph. Also see Nov 7, 1915, p12, "Tesla's discovery Nobel prize winner". The article said "Nikola Tesla, who, with Thomas Edison is to share the Nobel Prize in physics, according to a dispatch from London, said last night he had not yet been officially notified of the honor. His only information on the matter was the dispatch in the New York Times." Tesla thought the honor was for the transmission of energy without wires. He said he thought Edison was worthy of a dozen Nobel Prizes. He had often expressed his friendship with and admiration for Edison, and gave no hint he would refuse the honor if Edison was also getting it. The reported antipathy toward Edison only showed up when he was elderly. Finally Dec 28, 1915, p83 the NY Times reported that the initial report was incorrect. It had also given an incorrect report for the person to receive the chemistry award, further disproving the claim that Tesal refused the prize because Edison was also getting one. Also disproof of any great antipathy between them causing them to refuse the 1915 Nobel Prize is that in 1916 Tesla accepted the Edison Medal'For meritorious achievement in his early original work in polyphase and high-frequency electrical currents.' This often repeated claim that Tesla refused a Nobel prize needs something like a rejection letter from the Nobel files, or a memoir by someone involved with the Nobel award, or papers from Tesla's files. In other words, something more than someone writing a book or creating a webpage and stating it is so without a good source. Edison 23:48, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

There is not much room for controversy. Seifer in "Wizard" pp378-380 has obtained detailed info from the Nobel people. Tesla never received a Nobel nomination in 1915, so he did not refuse it. Neither did Edison. Out of 38 nominations for the prize in physics, Edison received one and Tesla zero. The winners were the Braggs, father and son. There was an erroneous press report as listed above. Tesla also received one bid out of 38 in 1937, again not enough for him to win the prize. No nomination, no controversy, other than perhaps that he might have deserved one.I am removing refrence to the 1915 Nobel Prize and Tesla.Edison 22:56, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Dynamic theory of gravity

There needs serious help in outlining the Dynamic theory of gravity. Both CH and William M. Connolley seem to be pushing a anti-tesla POV (as seen from above and in that article).

CH (User:Hillman) edits of POV - http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Dynamic_theory_of_gravity&diff=40547941&oldid=39938292

CH actions:

WMC's actions, among other things:

  • Removed "which some feel anticipates Ernest Rutherford's nuclear model of the atom. Tesla further claimed that there exist carriers transmitting "tensions or electrostatic strains". Some claim to see these statements as an anticipation of later work on elementary particles."
  • Thinks he is Wolfgang Pauli by putting in "Today it could only be described as not even wrong"

References to improve that article:

134.193.168.227 23:36, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Born in Croatia

I don't see why it simply doesnt state he was born in Croatia, instead of Austrian Empire...it doesn't make sense. If we follow this pattern then half of famous Americans were born in British Empire, Czechs and Slovaks in Czechoslovakia and so on...

Tesla was not born in Croatia, because it didn't exist then. The part of the Austrian Empire that is now called Croatia was then called Vojna Krajina, so it would be more accurate to write that as well instead of just Austrian Empire. And you can't be born in a country that doesn't exist at the time of your birth, can you? I'm sure his birth certificate didn't show that he was born in Croatia, but rather Austria. --serbiana - talk 06:25, 4 July 2006 (UTC)
You haven't done your reading in full. Vojna Krajina, was the part of Croatia that had privileges and additional fundings from court as an defence zone from Ottoman Empire! ...and Croatia was constitutional part of Austro-Hungarian Empire!Vladimirko 17:59, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
There was no "Croatia" when Tesla was born. Aslo, what was called "Croatia" was much smaller then today's country known as "Croatia", it was only a small territory around city of Zagreb.Homo Cosmosicus 12:36, 16 September 2006 (UTC) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Homo Cosmosicus (talk • contribs).

But the common standard is to use the present country for geographical reasons. Why do you think for George Washington it doesnt state he was born in Britain, as the United States didn't exist then. If we follow your logic, then all Serbs born in medieval time were born in Turkish empire, because Serbia didn't exist then.

Well they were born in the Ottoman Empire genius, because Serbia didn't exist. Of course Washington wasn't born in the US, it would be idiotic to agree with you and say that he had been. He was born in a British colony... --estavisti 22:08, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

It is clearly stated that Tesla's birthplace was in present date Croatia, and I don't see why are Croatians so much upset about the fact that in time of Tesla's birth, it was part of Austrian Empire? Archimedes wasn't born in Italy, nor Heraclites in Turkey, although the places of their birth are today situated there. Speaking of which, Michael I. Pupin was born in Banat, which was then part of Serbian Voivodship, but nobody is that vain to forge the fact that it was in fact in Austrian Empire. Ridiculous. Marechiel 16:14, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

Why is Tesla claimed to be a Serbian-American if he was of Croatian descent (by today's standards)? Many books from Croatia claim Tesla is Croatia. Case in point: if you are born to a Pole and a Russian, but you're born in Spain, does that make you spanish, or polish/russian? The later, correct?

Tesla stated that he was proud of being a Serb, and of Croatia as his country. I belive that one's roots (his/her "blood") are the most important. However, of high importance is the country where a person grows up and which he/she him/herself claims to be his/her motherland. Tesla can be called a Serb, as well as a Croat, for he was of Serbian blood and he called Croatia his motherland. True, his works were done in America, but Tesla can not be called an American inventor.

Tesla was not of Croatian descend, nor he was half-Croatian half-Serbian. Both his parents were pure Serbs (In one letter Tesla writes about the deep medieval Serbian roots of his mother's family, the Mandićs). The fact that someone was born in Croatia doesn't make them Croats, you know. And Tesla wasn't even born in Croatia, he was born in what many years later became the Republic of Croatia. :) --Djordje D. Bozovic 16:23, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
Tesla just can't be a Croat. At the time he was born, his birth place was not part of Croatia (and even if it was, then he would perhaps be a Croatian, and not a Croat again), and none of his ancestors were Croats. On the other hand, Tesla did have an American citizenship. Tesla was born in Austria-Hungary, he was a Serb by ethnicity, and an American by citizenship. Again, not a Croat at all. ;) --Djordje D. Bozovic 16:28, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

In sentence "According to legend, Tesla was born precisely at midnight during an electrical storm, to a Serb family in the village of Smiljan near Gospić, in the Lika region of the Austrian Empire, in Croatian part od Military frontier, located in present-day Croatia", I removed part which says "in Croatian part of Military frontier" because of folowing reasons: first, there was no such a thing as Croatian part of Militatry frontier, second, Lika region is more narower, and therby more precise specification, third, sentence itself had more than enough geographical specifications. Uross 23:23, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Wow!

I got to know a bit about this guy only because I happened to live for several years around the corner from the site of his old lab in Shoreham, NY. When I first saw the place in 1974, White's gorgeous architecture was still visible. Before long, it was hidden behind a hideous corrugated metal facade and a shiny barbed-wire and chain-link fence, and most of the beautiful old trees were replaced by a parking lot. A few local residents had become fascinated with Tesla, and as you probably know if you're reading this, that can quickly slide into all-consuming obsession. My own interest in Tesla was only intermittently obsessive. I think everyone involved in the creation and evolution of this article deserves congratulations - it's amazing you all have managed to make this much sense out of such a mind-boggling subject!

One bit of interesting trivia: The Shoreham-Wading River library contained a book called Wasn't The Future Wonderful? - a collection of articles, reproducing the original pages, from futuristic pop-science pulp magazines mainly from the 1930s. I came across it around 1979, when it was just beginning to look as if the Shoreham Nuclear Power Station project might never reach completion. One of the articles was an interview with Tesla, dating from the early 1940s, in which he expressed the view that nuclear energy would never be harnessed. In fact, he may have believed there was no such thing! Perhaps it was his ghost that jinxed the Shoreham plant, whose history seemed to prove his point.

[edit] possible plagarism

I'm not certain if this is being or already has been addressed, but I've noticed that several portions of the this article are word-for-word matches with the Tesla page at supernaturalminds.com/NikolaTesla.html . Just wanted to make people aware of this.

Based on the age of the site, it looks like the copy/pasting happened the other way around, that site took info from this one. That is OK, but he should really be displaying the GFDL licence info... Phidauex 18:19, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] invented the 20th century

Ok, I am not a Tesla expert but the quote "Many contemporary admirers of Tesla have deemed him the man who invented the twentieth century." seems a little over the top. It would sound better if it was a specific person for example "Lisa Simpson nobel laureate has said Tesla invented the twentieth century." There seems to be a bunch of strong feelings about this article so I didn't want to change anything out of hand. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 216.231.43.78 (talk • contribs).

Lomas titled a Lecture to South Western Branch of Instititute of Physics, "The Man who Invented the Twentieth Century". 134.193.168.252

[edit] Any romantic relationships?

Noone ever mentioned any single relationship of Tesla with a woman, at least when he was young. All I know of this subject is an anegdote saying: "Once on a party a woman, a great admiror of Tesla's work, approached him and asked if she could meet him and he said: "I'm sorry, my wife electra would be very jelaous of that." Or it went something like that. Who knows what he and Mark Twain were doing in his lab during late night? Image:Happyjoe.jpg —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Aljosa (talk • contribs).

Tesla was a sought out by the ladies of high society. He did have very close relations with some women (the wife of one of his friend may have been a non-physical love). He though turned many young girl away, following the life of invention and the research of electricity (which he believed that he could not do to the fullest in the married life). He was not homosexual though, as you imply. Cheney, a biographer of his, in the documentry on his life insuinated that he may have impaired his manhood though (after a hot french actress kept bugging him). That is speculation though. 134.193.168.252

I didn't mean to imply that he was homosexual, it was more a joke. Wikipedians are often pretty stiff :) I think that wikipedia article on Tesla is pretty good and is trying to cover all aspects of his life but it can't really be complete without covering romantic aspect of his life/personality. So that's why I started this section - to find out more about this rather important part of life and to put at least one sentence about that in the article. Tesla was obviously in control of all biological needs of his body (e.g. strictly calculated diet).—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Aljosa (talk • contribs).

He was an obsessive-compulsive anti-social recluse, I doubt that he ever dated anyone. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Cold water (talk • contribs).

Howard Hughes was far quirkier and more OCD than Tesla, but was married, had mistresses, and reportedly had as lovers Katharine Hepburn, Bette Davis, Gene Tierney, and Ava Gardner.Edison 15:00, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

Marc Seifer in his book "Wizard: the life and times of Nikola Tesla" says p18 that after Tesla dropped out of Technical University Graz in his junior year, he met "Anna" in his father's church and "fell in love." They went for walks etc. Then he started his undergrad studies afresh at Prague and she married someone else. Seifer cites Dragislav Petrovich, "A visit to Nikola Tesla" Politika, April 27, 1927, p4.

[edit] Protected

Please find a compromize solution on the talk page and then let me know when you are ready for the page to be unprotected abakharev 06:20, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

AD 9289:

"Mommy, what are Croatians and Serbians?"
"GalNet says that they were a couple of primitive tribes of Terra homo sapiens on Old Earth. Like most others at that time, the people of those tribes were conditioned from birth to believe that their 'country' (whatever that was) was important. Remember, we're going for your GalNet implant tomorrow; you can think about all of this stuff youself, much faster than I can tell you about it."

There sure are a lot of people nitpicking about things that most would consider, well, unimportant.

You folks aren't, er, prejudiced, are you? I thought most people had gotten past that by now.

I don't see any mention of what his skin color is, why should anyone care about his nationality?

--Scott McNay 06:44, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

Scott, do you care if someone cals you an Afghan, rather than American? Imagine that in 50 years, you are remembered as an Afghan. I mean, I'll just start calling you Afghan right now, according to you, it wouldn't matter. --KOCOBO 20:58, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
The issue is not what he is (or I am) but rather what is written. If can't agree, then just leave it out, and put an HTML comment in so that people will leave it alone, or simply say "disputed". --Scott McNay 08:14, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Compromises

How about Ethnically Serb, Croatian-born, American engineer, or In Serbia he is considered Serb, in Croatia Croat and in the USA - American, or just remove all the ethnic labels from the lead all together. Both place of birth and the religion are seen in the first paragraph of bio. abakharev 06:51, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

On June 1st 1892, Tesla arrived in Belgrade due to a call for assistance from the Belgrade municipality. Several thousand people were there to greet him at the Belgrade train station. He addressed the gathered crowd, who saluted him:
"There is something within me that might be illusion as it is often case with young delighted people, but if I would be fortunate to achieve some of my ideals, it would be on the behalf of the whole of humanity. If those hopes would become fulfilled, the most exiting thought would be that it is a deed of a Serb. Long live Serbdom!..." Tesla further said to the students of Belgrade University: "As you can see and hear, I have remained a Serb overseas where I have done some researches. You should do so and by your knowledge and hard work you should glorify Serbdom over the world." [1]
I don't think it matters if Serbia considers him a Serb or what not, when Tesla himself clearly stated what he is and always will be. By the way, Croats don't consider him a Croat, simply because there is nothing that shows he was a Croat, considering his father was a Serbian Orthodox Priest, and his mother from a famous Serb family. But don't believe me, read what the Croats did to Tesla's house and statue during the war against Serbs.
Alex, from your suggestions, I am not sure how much you know about Tesla, or even the claims some people are making here. The only solution is to put Nikola Tesla was a Serbian-American inventor,... And I reluctantly agree to the "American" part, but he did achieve his life's work in the States. Hiding the truth is not NPOV, everyone have that in mind. I think you've seen now that Tesla was a Serb, regardless of what any government or people of any country think. So, MAYBE we should write what Tesla actually said about himself. --KOCOBO 20:55, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
So far I have only heard the arguments to name him Serbian-American (in fact Brittanica did exactly this), any arguments for the Croatian part? Any reputable source naming him Croatian? abakharev 23:23, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
Since nobody argued for Tesla's Croatian heritage, I assume we have a consensus here. I will unprotect the article and revert to a "Serbian" version. Reversions back can be seen as violations of the WP:CON policy, so you better discuss them first of the talk page. abakharev 07:49, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

Tesla may have been an ethnic Serb but he had nothing to do with Serbia(I think he was once or twice in Serbia in total) thus cannot be Serbian scientist. The man was born in Croatia and consiered Croatia to be his homeland which he expressed on more than one occasion. The correct formation would be 'Croatian-American scientist of Serbian origin'. However the most liberal and fair would be to remove any mention of this at the begining of the article since the rest explains it. Also making his location of birth 'Austrian Empire(now Croatia)' is in direct collision with what the article says 'born in Kingdom of Croatia-Slavonia, then part of Austrian Empire'. Afrika Paprika 11:44, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

Afrika paprika, aside from your rude reverting when the majority has clearly decided how the article should be formulated, you provide no evidence or concrete references for your claims. Why should I believe you? Why should anyone believe you, when your contributions clearly show that you are pushing Croatian POV. You keep removing well-referenced sources from other Serb-related articles like Dado Pršo (look how he keeps reverting the "ethnic Serb" part of the text), and the list goes on. This is a place where serious people come to discuss serious issues, and there is no place for nationalism here. We have all provided well-referenced sources, so please stop bothering us with your "theories" which everyone is quite sick of. Your actions are considered trolling, and to some aspects, vandalism. Thank you, --KOCOBO 21:43, 18 July 2006 (UTC)
The majority has not decided. Two people having the same opinion on the subject cannot be and is not a consensus. Thus I shall keep revereting it as long as it needs to get in your little fascist head. As for Dado Prso the man considers himself to be a Croat and has publicly stated it more than once. User:Afrika Paprika 01:52, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
Oh, oh, since when do you care what the actual person in the article declared about himself? No, evidence, no proof of your claims, this is the policy of Wikipedia. --KOCOBO 00:59, 19 July 2006 (UTC)


I do care actually as all my changes can be confirmed. Unlike you who are pushing for a nationalistic propaganda. --User:Afrika Paprika 16:15, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

I have zero axe to grind, since I am of no Serbian or Croatian ancestry. Did Tesla ever call himself Serbian? Sure. And on his patent application for the induction motor, he referred to himself as: "I, Nikola Tesla, a subject of the Emperor of Austria, from Smiljan, Lika, border country of Austria Hungary." Yet it seems undeniable that Smiljan is now in Croatia. It appears to have been in a Croatian kingdom at the time, but Tesla's parents were undeniably ethnic Serbs. He should be listed as Croatian-born "Serbian-American" with some mention of the Austro-Hungarian empire. Balkan politics is complicated! He was ethnically Serb and he became a US citizen. Otherwise provide a verifiable source where Tesla said he was Croatian, not Serbian. I can show many where he was described as Serbian (or Servian in the spelling of that era). One newspaper artical even called him Montenegran! Edison 23:32, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tone it down please: POV tag added

This article needs some serious toning down, so I have added a POV tag. Compare the bombastic introduction with the relatively modest phrasing in the Albert Einstein article. Personally after reading such an introduction, I am reluctant to take the rest of the article seriously. However the parts I looked at seemed to be good, and that introduction is doing the subject a disservice. Chicheley 00:24, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

With all due respect, his ethnicity is quite clear to everyone, and I have cited my sources. Only one user claims that this is not true, even though he has not shown a single piece of evidence. This is not reason enough to put a POV tag, and I have removed it. Instead, I would advise Afrika Paprika from being the only one that claims that Tesla was not a Serb. --KOCOBO 00:57, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
Nobody disputes him being a Serb, but it seams to me that you insist on not allowing appearance of any mentioning of Croatia in his introduction. I'm prepared to add his ethicity myself every time I see it removed, IF ALL the data about his birth are present. If not, to cut down disputes it's better to remove such references completely! I'm glad that you don't insist anymore on that obviously nationalistic propaganda article as refference in introduction... I consider it as a great progress, and there still might be some hope for this article!-- Vladimirko 01:12, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

Haha, you people are just funny :) Croatians and serbians are together trying to get to a consensus on a topic like Tesla's nationality. That's soo not gonna happen. You don't see that you're not just subjective on the matter but prejudiced (pristrani). Therefore I recommend that all ex-Yugoslavians shouldn't be let to decide the "truth" on the matter. We need a body that would check ONLY the facts, with no prejudicies and hotheads included. Something like a Hague Tribunal on Wikipedia. I know it's somewhat against the Wikipedia rules, but Wikipedia doesn't know croatians and serbians :)

[edit] Tesla was Serbian, he is sometimes referred to as Serbian-American

And here are the references to prove that:

  • The Serbian-American inventor, electrical engineer, and scientist [2]
  • His father Milutin, and his mother Djuka, were both Serbian by origin [3]
  • On June 1st 1892, Tesla arrived in Belgrade due to a call for assistance from the Belgrade municipality. Several thousand people were there to greet him at the Belgrade train station. He addressed the gathered crowd, who saluted him: "There is something within me that might be illusion as it is often case with young delighted people, but if I would be fortunate to achieve some of my ideals, it would be on the behalf of the whole of humanity. If those hopes would become fulfilled, the most exiting thought would be that it is a deed of a Serb. Long live Serbdom!..." Tesla further said to the students of Belgrade University: "As you can see and hear, I have remained a Serb overseas where I have done some researches. You should do so and by your knowledge and hard work you should glorify Serbdom over the world." [4]
  • Serbian/American Inventor [5]
  • Serbian-born inventor Nikola Tesla [6]
  • Nikola Tesla, Serbian-American inventor [7]
  • US (Serbian-born) electrical inventor [8]
  • He was of Serb descent and worked mostly in the United States [9]
  • Nikola Tesla was a Serbian-American scientist [10]
  • Nikola Tesla was a Serbian-American inventor, electrical engineer, and scientist [11]
  • Nikola Tesla was a Serbian inventor and scientist [12]
  • Nikola Tesla was a Serbian-American inventor and engineer and a master of electricity [13]
  • Nikola Tesla (1856-1943) was a Serbian-American inventor [14]
  • A Serbian-American physicist and electrical engineer [15]
  • Nikola Tesla was a Serbian by birth [16]
  • Nikola Tesla was a Serbian born inventor [17]
  • The Serbian-American inventor, electrical engineer, and scientist [18]
  • Nikola Tesla was a Serbian-born American scientist and his archive was brought to Belgrade after his death in New York in 1943. [19]
  • Nikola Tesla, was a Serbian electrical engineer [20]
  • Nikola Tesla was a Serbian inventor [21]
  • Nikola Tesla was a Serbian-American inventor/electrical engineer [22]
  • Nikola Tesla was a Serbian-American scientist, electrical engineer, and inventor [23]
  • Nikola Tesla was a Serbian-American inventor, electrical engineer, and scientist [24]
  • ...this great Serb American. [25]
  • Dr. Nikola Tesla, was a Serb [26]
  • Nikola Tesla was a Serb [27]

I'd like to add that every website mentions this at the very beginning. I'd also like to add that searching "Nikola Tesla was a Croat" returned 2 results (both of them blogs), while "Nikola Tesla was a Croatian" returned an amazing 4 results, and all of those websites confirm that Tesla was Serbian, but born in what is today considered Croatia. Almost all of the websites also cite that he was born in Austria-Hungary, while a mere some mention that the city he was born in is in todays Croatia, which definately doesn't make him Croatian. So, don't believe me, look at the tons of references I just gave you in the above list. Thank you :) --KOCOBO 01:38, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

P.S. there is no doubt that Tesla was born in Austria-Hungary, and his birth certificate proves it. Imagine that New Haven, Connecticut, USA (place where Bush was born) becomes Canada in 40 years. Was George W. Bush born in Canada? --KOCOBO 01:44, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
All the articles you linked here talk about his ethnic origin, which is not disputed. The man was a Serb and openly declared as such though once when they asked him wheter he is a Croat or a Serbs said "it's the same thing in Lika". In any case what I am trying to say and was saying is that the man was ethnically a Serb, but was Croatian scientist as he was born in Croatia(which was part of Habsburg Monarchy) and both openly declared by him more than once. Thus he cannot be only "Serbian-American" or "Croatian-American", he can only be "Serbian-Croatian-America" scientist or none at all(meaning not mentioning this since the article already talks about it. -- User:Afrika Paprika 16:21, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
Article aboutNikola Tesla is not propaganda article, and try to keep it so! As it may not seam at first glance, but Serbian propaganda machinery is pretty well developed in the world. I.e.

1. You may find claims that Dubrovnik was in Serbia, although it NEVER WAS, but you'll hardly find the fact that what's now suburbs of Belgrade WAS a part of Croatia few times in history... 2. Vojvodina less then 30 years ago had Hungarian and Croatian majority, and although ethnical clensing was never proclaimed it occured, as also in Republika Srpska territories in Bosnia and Herzegovina, where less then 10% of croats and muslims returned to thier homes! 3. And just BTW, Miloš Obilić, supposedly Serbian hero on Kosovo, came from catholic family, and Croat village of Kobilići (that existed long before the Serbs fled through from Turks) from central Bosnia, and is ancestor of som Croat Milošević families near Sarajevo and Kiseljak! I knew a person who was direct descendent of him, who claimed it in Belgrade's center in SANU ... those facts Great Serbian propagandist will never admit, and there is just too much of them! 4. Croatia after death of King Petar (Svačić) joined in personal union with Hungary, afterwards, Croat and Hungarian nobility offered joined crown to Habsburgs. Through all that time Croatia newer lost it's statehood, although their rights were diminished after killings os several members of Croatian nobility and Austro-Hungarian treaty afterwards... Through most of that time Serbia was a municipality within "Ottoman empire"... So, Croatia existed at that time as Kingdom of Croatia and Slavonia in union with Kingdom of Dalmatia under supreme governmant of Habsburgs. It was recognised even by Hungarians during Austro-Hungarian Empire (just look at their coat of arms from that time or lookup on their parliament building in Budapest)... So, If you're born i.e. in Novi Sad, and the state on birth certificate is Yougoslavia, does it mean that you were not born in Serbia, does that mean that you were not born in Vojvodina? Or, if you were born in Priština, is it Kosovo, Serbia, was it in Yougoslavia?-- Vladimirko 14:14, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

First, some due disclosure. I'm not Serbian, or Croatian, or Austrian. I was not paid 100$ by a member of the Serbian Propaganda Machine in a dark coat.
Next, my points...
1) -American belongs in the name. Tesla did most of his work in America, and was an American citizen. He died in America, and his funeral was in America. (though his remains now rest in Belgrade).
2) The first part of a Whatever-American's ethic identify typically involves the individual's ethinic affiliation. Typically NOT the birthplace's political status at the time of birth, or the current political status. Thats why we have Irish-Americans, instead of Great British-Americans. It is also why we have Ukrainian-Americans, not Soviet-Americans. If Telsa identified himself as an ethnic Serb, as it seems he did, then he would be Serbian-American. Ethnicity/origin-citizenship.
3)It should be noted that he was born in what was then the Austrian-Hungarian empire, and what is now Croatia, but that doesn't make him Croatian, or Austrian, or Hungarian, unless he said, and felt, that he aligned himself with any of those groups.
4)This argument is all pretty silly... Perhaps its just my impression, as someone who is an ethnic product of numerous people coming to the US from several continents, and people who were already here, that I don't feel like I identify specifically with any of them. It seems like there are a lot of groups that want so badly to OWN Tesla, that this has gotten more complex than it should be. If I were a famous scientist, my article would have to say, German-Irish-Thai-African-Native-American Scientist to satisfy everyone. Phidauex 16:54, 20 July 2006 (UTC)
Nice Statement Phidauex - but the Tesla Case, as an South Slav Case is special in its own, thats because of History .. See .. As for Yugoslavia - everyone born in former Yugoslavia was first Yugoslavian - and then serb, croat, slowenian or what ever. But all this doesnt matter in the Tesla Case. Because Tesla was born before the SFRJ. As for that - It doesnt matter, where one was born in the Countries of Former Yugoslavia - Everyone knew, what Ethnic he falls into. Today for example, there are many Croatians living in Serbia - most of them in Vojvodina, born there many years ago. But they are still Croats - The same Thing with Serbs born and living in Croatia today - or in Slovenia or wherever. The Paradadoxon that we have with Tesla is, that we don't believe in his own Words. I read lots about him - and he never ever declared himself being a Croat - but often stating of being proud to be Serb -> This doesnt mean he was a Nationalist - You see, the former Croatia as we know it today, was Part of the Austro-Hungarians with a very Big Majority of Serbs living in the Krajina - which was a Military Zone once nearly becoming its own Autonomic Part, populated mostly by Serbs - as they settled there to defend against the Osmanians. Those People, like Teslas Family, lived in Serbian Villages or Communities - maintaining and living the Serbian Culture and visiting Seriban-Orthodox Churches regularly - which is very important (heres the only small similarity to the U.S., as there are many irish or italian people f.e. - living in own hoods - and living the way they ethnically belong to), as Teslas Father was an Serbian-Orthodox Priest and his Mother also born into a Family of Serbian Theologists. As for the Ethicity-Struggle we have today - back in this Time - People knew very well, who or what every single People was - without any doubts - unlike we are confronting it today. So even calling him a Croatian Scientist is ludicrous - As he never worked as an Scientist in Croatia or being teached there in Electromechanics or whatever. Sure, he sympathized with the Yugoslavian Idea - the Idea of every South Slav, living Peacful together - but this doesnt makes him a Croat or a Croatian Scientist, expecially integrating the Fact that many Croatians never sympathized with the Yugoslavian Idea and many Croatians and Serbians, living in Croatia past Times, gazed on each other with a wry look. As the Ethnic-Conflict or small Struggles, we still have today, are more complex in Former Yugoslav Countries than in every other Country Worldwide - we have to look back very deep into History, to find the correct answers - instead of contrieving our own Stories to make him something he never was - yet some people are not able, to believe in his own words.

Cheers

Afrika Paprika and some other (Croatian?) members keep deleting the Serbian reference about Tesla, he was so much proud of. This won't pass. I invite them to explain their frustrations here, instead of deleting facts from the article, since it is qualified as vandalism. Marechiel 16:15, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

Actually I deleted nothing at first, I only added the fact he is also Croatian as much as he is Serbian. He was equally proud of being a Serb and being from Croatia, that has been openly stated by Tesla himself on more than one occasion. However after my addition of the fact he was and is also Croatian scientist certain memebers started removing that, thus the only compromise is to remove any mention of his nationality and ethnicity altogether at the begining of the article since the article clearly explains it further down. I am only deleting what is definately not a fact but real vandalism and revisonism.Afrika Paprikal 01:12, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

Afrika: Would you please provide a verifiable source for your statement that"He was equally proud of being a Serb and being from Croatia, that has been openly stated by Tesla himself on more than one occasion." I have read a fair amount of Tesla writings recently and have not seen such a statement, but I cannot prove a negative. It is for you to demonstrate where he said he was proud to be from Croatia. I do not deny it, but a verifiable source would end a lot of ethnic-pride bickering.Edison 23:39, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

What is "verifiable source" for you? Something that has been published on the internet? In May 25th 1936 Vlatko Maček(leader of the Croatian opposition in K.of Yugoslavia) in a telegram to Tesla: "To the great son of Serbian people and his homeland Croatia, leader of manking in their struggle with nature we congratulate in the name of Croatian people"; Nikola Tesla answers: "Thank you for your much appreciated congratulations and honours. I am equally proud of Serbian origin and my Croatian homeland. Long live all Yugoslavs!" In 1892 during his visit to Zagreb he had a lecture on AC electricity said: "I consider my duty that as born son of my land help the city of Zagreb in every advice and act". --Afrika Paprika
It is easy to show that Tesla, as a Serbian patriot and supporter of integral Yugoslavism (which was to melt all Yugoslav peoples into one, Yugoslav, nation) and King Alexander, whenever he spoke of Croatia, he viewed it as part of Yugoslavian state and a state of both Serbs and Croats, what Croatia used to be. He spoke of it more as a region than as a state, which can be shown in his speeches and articles about Kingdom Yugoslavia, where he agitated for its centralization, and against any secession. Modern Croatia is a national, exclusively Croat state, where Serbs were literally thrown out of Constitution, and where Tesla's compatriots today make less than 4% of population (what used to be up to 30%) as a result of 20th century ethnic wars.
Today Croatia agitates against for everything Tesla fought for: centralized Yugoslavian Balkan state and the ideas that Serbs and Croats were one people of identical race, language and tradition. Croatia of today is not the Serbo-Croatian Yugoslav Croatia Tesla spoke of, and it couldn't be clearer. The only time Tesla ever lived to see an independent Croatian state was during WWII, when he openly supported young Yugoslavian King Peter II and his Chetnik army, who fought against Croatia and for the re-establishment of united Yugoslavia.
His courteous reply to Macek (which was, by the way, private), especially with the ending exclamation Long live Yugoslavs! does not change a thing about his opinion towards Yugoslavia, his homeland. As if an African-American living in Pennsylvania said he was proud of his Pennsylvanian homeland, and in 50 years Pennsylvania declares its independence from the U.S.A., and leads a 5-year long racist civil war after which all blacks are expelled from the state, and thrown out of Constitution. The original statement couldn't be used anymore with the same meaning, could it? Marechiel 11:44, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
I suggest you leave the politics out of this. It is also clear that after being proven wrong you are now trying to dispute this fact by some trivial rant. The fact is - Tesla considered Croatia to be his homeland and said it more than once(as I have cited). Afrika paprika
No, he didn't. Read carefully the text above, and when you have finished, read it again. You can't use one single courteous personal note to shade his opinion made in public. Tesla considered Yugoslavia his homeland, and was against any kind of secession of Croatia from it (Tesla: Tribute to King Alexander. According to his wish, in the time WWII was waged in his conquered Yugoslavian homeland, the sounds of Tamo Daleko song played on his funeral (with the leading repeating verses: There's my village, there's Serbia ). (And please, stop insulting and deleting his Serbian reference, Tesla wouldn't like it - If I were happy enough to realize at least some of my ideas, they would benefit the whole mankind. If my hopes were to be fulfilled, my sweetest thought would be that it had been the work of a Serb). Marechiel 22:02, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

Nikola Tesla was SERBIAN! Not SERBIAN - AMERICAN. But SERBIAN! I don't care if he had USA citizenship, he went there when he was 28. He couldn’t even speak the freaking language at the time. He was born in Serbian Orthodox family, and grew up in Balkans. He only went in USA because he had conditions to work there, AND THAT IS IT!

Tesla was ethnic Serbian USA citizen, therefore Serbian-American. Stating "Serbian" would imply that he was either Serbian citizen, or that he lived and worked in Serbia, which he did not and was not. He indeed does belong to Serbia and Serbs all and everywhere, but he was also an American and American patriot. Tesla was Serbian-American, and nothing can change that, neither ALL CAPITAL LETTERS, nor anyone's emotions and/or stubborness. Tesla was Serbian-American. Marechiel 13:57, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
Tesla became USA citizen when he was like 30 or something. That DOES NOT make him a freaking American. How can someone be American, when he didn’t even know how to speak English at 28.!
Being Serbian, means that he was an ethnic Serb, AND THAT’S IT He was born and grew up in today’s Croatia, then an Austrian-Empire. If the Austrian-Empire existed today, you could say that he was Serbian-Austrian. Since that country doesn’t exist anymore, he is Serbian and Serbian only.
And you say "he was also an American and American patriot". How the hell do you know that he was American Patriot? You worked with him or something so you know that?
I’m saying it again; he can NOT be American, if he went there when he was 28.! He only went in USA because he had conditions to work there. Being American means that he was born in America, or at least that he grew up there, or that he was “ethnic American”, but since being an “ethnic American” doesn’t exist, he is not an American!
Who owes a scientist? This can be established by its ethnicity or place of origin or place of work.
Unless Wikipedia is Serbian property it would be only correct to say that Tesla was Serbian/Croatian/American inventor. Pygmalion
The Wikipedia Manual of Style says to refer to people as they refered to themselves. Since Tesla considered himself Serbian, he should be refered to as "Serbian" in this article. Case closed. For the record I am neither Serbian nor Croatian, nor do I give a flying flip about either. Kaldari 16:33, 11 September 2006 (UTC)


He cannot be called Croatian because he replied to Macek in a nice way and because it is the policy of Croatia today. It is isimly not enough. Ban Jelacic was born in Serbia (Austria at the time) and had great relations with Serbian people and opted for Yugoslavia. How would Croatians feel if the page on Jelacic started with " Ban Jelacic was born in Serbia and considered it his homeland"????

[edit] Tesla Motors

Heres a short Statement from the Teslamotors Company Site .. who designed and built an Electric Car, named "Tesla Roadster".

From: http://www.teslamotors.com/learn_more/why_tesla.php


The namesake of our Tesla Roadster is the genius Nikola Tesla, a Serbian-born American inventor, electrical engineer, and scientist. Among his life‘s many inventions (and over 700 patents) are the induction motor and alternating-current power transmission. Without Tesla‘s vision and brilliance, our car wouldn‘t be possible. We‘re confident that if he were alive today, Nikola Tesla would look over our car and nod his head with both understanding and approval. A Bright Moment to Honor the Man Who Lit the World

UNESCO has declared 2006 the Year of Nikola Tesla, in celebration of the 150th anniversary of his birth. We are delighted that the world unveiling of the Tesla Roadster falls on July 19, 2006 — just days after his birthday.

“Were we to seize and eliminate from our industrial world the result of Mr. Tesla‘s work, the wheels of industry would cease to turn, our electric cars and trains would stop, our towns would be dark, and our mills would be idle and dead. His name marks an epoch in the advance of electrical science.”

[edit] Tesla's height

I can't claim to know much at all about Nikola Tesla, but I was scrolling through the article List of famous tall men and he is listed as having been 6'7". Is this true? 70.50.53.38 22:24, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

Serbs are often tall, and I remember reading he was of extraordinary height for his era; never saw the figure before, though.Skookum1 23:55, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

That's the first I've ever heard of Serbs being tall. Does anyone know if there's proof for this claim of 6'7"? If not, he really shouldn't be on that list. 70.50.53.38 01:14, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

I read he was 6'6, he does look tall... and Serbs/Croats are the tallest people in the world!

Well Dalmatians are tall, but they ain't Serbs and Montenegrians are tall but they defintly aren't serbs. And yes, it's strange for a serb to be that tall.

[edit] Standing tall in fairness

I read somewhere that Montenegro has the tallest people in the world. Serbs and Croats are also fairly tall and that would make you wander "all 3 ethnic groups might share the same genetics and origins" I don't think Bosnians, Macedonians and Slovenes are as tall and might be more mixed with other ethnic groups. Interesting as people here are debating origin of Tesla. I would think there is enough evidence to support that he was a Vlah by origin(What's a Vlah today?. Not sure on the time line when these Vlah ancestors came to Croatia but they came to Croatia. His father was clearly as Serb. Confusing but clear. Tesla ancestors and last name were Vlah origin , but he was Serb as was his father, Tesla was born in what is Croatia today. FAIR ENOUGH


Jagoda 1 23:29, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tesla's Poetry ?

In Margaret Cheney's book, she mentions that he was a good, and perhaps great, poet. I've never come across any of his work, and my Serbian friends - raised under Tito's regime - drew a blank on this, although they'd heard of his writings outside of engineering. Does this get mentioned in any of the other bios of him, and if so, is there any further detail? I understand he was also something of a musical aficionado, and I think a minor composer as well.....Skookum1 23:55, 23 July 2006 (UTC) Qualifying that, I remember that what she said was, other than his own poetry, he had written books or articles on Serbian poetry to good reviews...pr which were respected as knowledgeable or something to that effect. I haven't read the book in a long time....Skookum1 04:35, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Studies at Graz

The article under education says he received several degrees from Graz. Seifer, "Wizard.."p17 says he did not take his final exams senior degree and did not receive a degree from the school." So where is a verifiable source to prove he graduated from the Polytechnic at Graz with all the various degrees? Certainly he studied there, but more than one source says he did not receive a degree.Edison 03:52, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

Seifer(op cit) says p17 " Exam time came, and Tesla was unprepared. He asked for an extension to study but was denied. He never graduated from the Austrian Polytechnic School and did not receive any grades for his last semester there." p18 says Tesla's father could not get him to return to Graz and complete his studies, so he started afresh at Charles-Ferdinand branch of the University of Pragus, for the summer term. This does not sound like "graduate studies" as stated in the article. He left after that term (p20) so it does not appear he obtained an undergraduate or graduate degree there either. Authorities Seifer cites for details of Tesla's college years include his roommate, Kosta Kulishich, "Tesla nearly missed his career as inventor; college roommate tells," Newark News, August 27, 1931 and also cites William Terbo, Tesla's great nephew, honorary chairman and cofounder of the Tesla Memorial Society, and life member of the International Tesla Society.Terbo in 1983 said it was likely Tesla was dismissed for gambling and womanizing. In the Wiki article is a citation to Wysock et al which states he got the degree at Graz; the Wysock article does not provide a citation as to how they knew this fact. Perhaps someone could in Newark could verify the Newark News article. Did Tesla in any writing of his own ever claim to have graduated? Does anyone have access to the Tesla Museum to see if they have a diploma among the many volumes of documents Tesla kept? Does Graz Polytech still exist and do they say Tesla graduated? Even without the formal degree, he was better educated in physics than many 19th century electrical authorities. Pending verifiable sources for graduation, the article shoud state that he attended college but did not graduate (like Bill Gates!).Edison 15:50, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

The articles does NOT state that he recieved a PhD, Edison ... only that he studied in graduate school. It states "Graduate studies" ... not "Graduate degree". The article does state that he attended college but did not graduate (atleast not in the time frame of his early years). This is your misinterpertation of the words. Did you misunderstand "studies" for "degree"? There is only Bachelor diplomas, no PhD.

He did though recieve Docteur Honorius Causa (Honorary doctorate) at

The Wysock article (with the Corums) is one of the best on his background. The Corums are have a vast knowledge on Tesla's background. I would imagine the Corums have met William Terbo in person (all have delivered papers at Tesla symposiums)

The article should stand as it is, the misunderstanding is yours not the articles.

134.193.168.250 17:17, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

Sorry you misread what I actually wrote. I did NOT say that the article stated that he received a PhD from Prague. The article incorrectly (or without documentation) says he was a graduate student at Prague, which would imply he had received a baccalaureate at Graz, which he did not. Repeat: Tesla left Graz then "Kaiserlich-königlich Technischen Hochschule" in Graz, without receiving any diploma. He "started afresh" per Seifer, his undergraduate studies at Prague, unless he attended the one summer semesster as a special graduate student without an undergraduate degree. The Corum article is simply wrong, and contains no source for its claim he received a bachelor's degree from Graz. The Wikipedia article is five times wrong when it claims he received 5 baccalaureate degrees from Graz. Later, he received lots of honorary doctorates, including one from Graz (then called "Technische (und Montanistische) Hochschule Graz - Leoben") in 1937. He was very well self-educated outside his college studies, and his college studies such as they were were more extensive than those of many famous 19th century electrical researchers. So when he "made a fresh start" at Prague, he was still an undergraduate. In fact, he did not go beyond the first semester of his junior year at the Polytechnic School of Graz, per a book they published in honor of the 150th anniversary of his birth, "Nikola Tesla und die Technik in Graz" by Jozef W. Wohinz (hg.),Verlag der Technischen Universität Graz, 2006; ISBN-10: 3-902465-39-5; ISBN-13: 978-3-902465-39-9. He started at Graz in the fall semester of 1875. In his third year, the last registration information for Tesla says: "Wegen Nichtbezahlung des Unterrichtgeldes für das I. Semester 1877/78 gestrichen". In English, he was dismissed for nonpayment of his tuition for the first semester of his junior year. This is even earlier than what Seifer said, but the Graz University of Technology is certainly the most credible source for info on who graduated.Edison 17:18, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

Article states that Tesla studied alternating current at Graz. I thought this was the basis of his feud with Edison, that AC did not exist in 1875. Someone who knows for sure please clarify. Thanks.

Please sign your postings with 4 tildes. In the 1875-1876 schoolyear at Graz, Tesla took 11 courses, for a total of 46 hours of credit. He received a grade of “vorzüglich” for each course, corresponding to A+ in U.S. grading. He took "Experimentalphysik" for 5 hours with Prof. Jakob Pöschl, the chair of the physics department, and thereby learned an excellent coverage of electrical physics. He apparently took another physics course with Pöschl in his second year.Pöschl purchased a small Gramme machine which was the first reasonably good motor and generator, and which impressed Thomas Edison as well, inspiring his motor-generator development. A generator is basically a loop of wire rotating in a magnetic field, or a stationary loop of wire with a rotating magnet, and naturally tends to produce alternating current. The Gramme machine was a state of the art motor or generator, with a series of coils embedded in a soft iron ring, which rotated in a magnetic field. By having a series of loops, a nearly continuous current was produced. I see this as the inspiration for Tesla's motors and generators with the rotating magnetic field. A commutator connected to each coil in turn to keep the current always flowing in the same direction. Tesla saw that the commutator produced sparking and a loss of efficiency, and suggested doing away with the brushes. So the DC machine of Gramme in the physics class was the inspiratiuuon for his AC concepts, but it was not used as an AC machine. AC generation, transmission, and use was not taught in the class, except in the sense that AC is the natural result of a simple coil rotating in a field, or a magnet going in and out of a coil. Edison 15:54, 7 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Nikola Tesla

Please stop reverting to your version of this article. The Nobel claims have been discussed at great length, and it is extremely unlikely that what you are writing is correct. Your changes to the school portions would require a citation. The current text already has a citation there, and changing it creates problems with that citation. In addition, please stop using devious methods to revert. --Philosophus T 18:01, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

I have the book in the citations. The text in the books does not match the citations of the article. Moving this to Talk: NT. 134.193.168.250

Ok, that makes sense for the school part. But the Nobel part doesn't seem right. Nominations are not made public, and most of the information there is just pure speculation. --Philosophus T 18:37, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tesla was Serbian-American, what seems to be the problem with it?

Tesla has lived in the USA since he was 28 until the end of his life, had the USA citizenship, and was by no doubt American. Being an ethnic Serb, he belonged to the numerous Serbian-American community, which exists today as well. Some people (Croatians?) seem not to understand the term Serbian-American and keep deleting it: it means primarily American, while the Serbian part is the ethnic reference, like Italian-American, African-American, Native-American etc. Although Tesla was a proud American, he also cherished his Serbdom, Serbian language and Serbian/Yugoslavian connections, and contributed much to the Serbian-American community in the USA. Marechiel 12:05, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

IIRC, Tesla was also at pains to the ethnic rivalry and civil strife that existed in his homeland. Mabey something to put into the personal views if a few refs can be found. 134.193.168.253 17:17, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
This is a another topic that has little to do with his ethnicity and nationality, which was Serbian-American. Tesla was one of the founders of Serbian-American community and a person whose name is cherished the most by the already mentioned Serbian-American community. Considering his political views, Tesla was a supporter of King Alexander's ideas, and a supporter of young King Peter II and his Chetniks during WWII (Tesla&KingPeter.jpg), as the whole USA were at the time, but this is a another topic. See this: Tesla: Tribute to King Alexander (MS Word Document). Marechiel 19:23, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
Yep ... this is a another topic, but it does deal with his ethnicity and nationality (which was Serbian-American). It (his views on his homeland) would be a good thing to cover in the personal views section. 134.193.168.253 19:51, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] 3rr violation - Tesla and Croatian language

Someone keeps deleting the statement that Tesla spoke Croatian, amomg his 8 languages. They would have us believe that he grew up in Croatia, but never learned to speak the language, although he learned to speak several languages of places he never lived. This is vandalism. Tesla wrote in a letter to the New York Times, October 21, 1934, p E5, "Tribute to King Alexander" the following: "The fact is that all Yugoslavians- Serbians,Slavonians, Bosnians, Herzegovinians, Dalmatians, Montenegrins, Croatians and Slovenes- are of the same race, speak the same language and have common ideals and traditions."..."I was born in Croatia. The Croatians and Slovenes were never in a position to fight for their independence. It was the Serbians who fought the battles for freedom and the price of liberty was paid in Serbian blood. All true Croatians and Slovenes remember that gratefully." Is the claim then that he did not speak Croatian because it is the identical language with Serbian? There is a Wikipedia article on Croatian language which says that the Croatian and Serbian languages were forced to be one (mostly Serbian) by the Kingdom of Serbia starting 1918, then the Nazi puppet state of Croatia emphasized linguistic separatism starting 1941. Thus it appears that Tesla would have had no difficulty making himself understood in Croatian, and that Croatian was during much his lifetime considered a separate language. A Maître'D at the St. Regis Hotel in New York stated that he conversed with Tesla in Croatian "The very model of a Maître 'dHotel" NY Times, Feb 19, 1967, p.78. I have provided verifiable sources that Tesla said he was born in Croatia, that Croatia was a language during his lifetime, and that he spoke it. Now the question is how do I not violate the 3RR while adding Croatian back to the article as one of his languages?? The violator of 3RR would seem to be the deletor unless they furnish a verifiable source that a) there was no such language, or b) he was unable to speak it. If it would make the other editor happy, I would settle for the article stating he spoke Serbo-Croatian among 7 languages. I will make such a change. Edison 18:25, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

No, this is most likely not vandalism. Vandalism consists of an change that is "a deliberate attempt to reduce the quality of the encyclopedia". While the edits may be decreasing the quality of the encyclopedia, they do not appear to me to be a deliberate attempt to do so. --Philosophus T 10:52, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

This is a political issue, and can and should be, in my opinion, be solved making a compromise. I beg for this whole article of mine to be read, in order to make the right conclusion.

Serbian and Croatian are basically not only the same language, but the same very dialect of that language: stokavian. The only difference is that "Croatian" de facto also includes the two other dialects not spoken in Serbia, and "Serbian" a subdialect spoken in Eastern Serbia, and not Croatia. But what we call today standard Serbian and standard Croatian are one same language, 100% mutually intelligible. Now to the Tesla issue:

Tesla by his own admission spoke Serbian. But, to be fair, the same variant/accent spoken by Croats, Croatian Serbs and ex-Croatian Serbs (regugees) is called Serbian by Serbs, and Croatian by Croats. Tesla explicitly said that this were one language (See Edison's quote above), and Tesla never called it Croatian - as all Serbs from his region never do - but Serbian. Tesla did not speak two Balkanic/SE-European languages, or three, or four, but one, his mother tongue he called "Serbian", and what was at the called "Serbian", "Croatian", "Serbian or Croatian" and "Serbo-Croatian".

If we were to be 100% truthful, we should also add Bosnian and Bosniak (language of Bosniaks in Sanjak, Serbia), and the other two languages: Montenegrin and Bunjevacki, because Tesla spoke them all: the same variant of Serbian, only called differently, after Croats, Bosniaks, Montenegrins and Bunjevci who speak it. Where would this lead, and what would this do?

I suggest not placing Croatian among Tesla's languages - because he didn't call it that, and because he de facto knew eight languages, and not nine, or ten, or eleven, depending on what we now divide into something he called "Serbian". I suggest as a rightful compromise that Croatian, Bosnian, Montenegrin and Bunjevacki should be added as a reference, or in brackets, next to Serbian. It should also be unjust to late Tesla not to call his language the way he and his countrymen did. Marechiel 13:50, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

Marechiel: The above is informative to thos of us who know not a word of the language. If I understand you correctly, it is the custom of Serbians born in Croatia to say they speak Serbian while Croatians born next door and speaking the same language say they speak Croatian. It seems as artificial to argue over whether he spoke Serbian or Croatian then as to claim that George Bush speaks 'Texan' or 'Connecticuttese' when both are mutually intelligible variants of American English. Is it offensive to both sides to say he spoke "Serbo-Croatian" or if that is offensive, "the Serbian and Croatian language" and count it as one language in the total? To a neutral observer seems like the obvious answer. And in the comment for your last edit you said "(Tesla was not born in Croatia, Croatian state didn't exist until Tesla was 85)" but in the letter above written when he was 78, he said he was born in Croatia. Wikipedia would usually take a person's own statement as the best source. Earlier he wrote he was born in Smiljan, Lika, in the Austro-Hungarian border territory. Is that not also correct? No one is saying he travelled through time to the modern Croatian state to be born (though some of his fans might think that not impossible!).Edison 14:48, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
The article on differences in standard Serbian, Croatian and Bosnian uses the term Serbo-Croatian to jointly refer to the language - as I know nothing other than what I read since reading the above (and knowing there was a contoversy on the mailing list regarding this) - is that term, Serbo-Croatian, potentially offensive? --Trödel 15:36, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
Edison: You got the idea about language totally right. I think that it is not a problem to name the language in any appropriate way, but it is just false to say that he spoke more than eight languages (Serbian + other seven), since one language named in many ways doen't make several languages. Also, to be fair, when stating Croatian, one should also add Bosnian and Montenegrin, since those "languages" are more close to Lika speech than the official Zagreb variant, today called standard Croatian.
Considering the place of Tesla's birth, it is obvious that when he mentions Croatia (or Serbia, or Montenegro etc.) he speaks of it as of region in an ethnic Yugoslav area. The idea of King Alexander was that Serbs, Croats and Slovenes (at the time, Montenegrins, Bosniaks, Bunjevci and Macedonians weren't recognized as separate peoples) were just tribal names for the same Yugoslav nation, which Tesla whole heartily accepted. At the time, Serbs lived throughout Croatia, and app. one third of Croatian territory was ethnically Serbian, including Tesla's Lika. Whenever Tesla spoke of Croatia, he spoke of it as a Serbo-Croat region in their mutual state, and not as independent state of ethnic Croats, which it is today.
Beside everything, for the sake of historical accuracy, Tesla's birhtplace was in Austrian Empire at the time, and today it is part of Croatian state - I simply don't see why this should be a problem, save for political motives to present Tesla as Croatian "brand". As I previously said, Archimedes wasn't born in Italy, Heraclites wasn't born in Turkey and - similar example to Tesla - Tesla's contemporary and fellow-countryman and a colegue scientist, Michael Idvorsky Pupin, Serbian scientist from the USA, also born in Austria, but in the region called Voivodship Serbia isn't stated as born in Serbia, although he was a Serb, and not a member of of an ethnic minority Serbs had a war with, as Croats had in Croatia. Should we mention the Croatia-Slavonia region in Austria as a place of his birth, we should also say that Croatia-Slavonia was a part of Kingdom Hungary, and that Smiljan was at the time part of Military Frontier, a separate region, only later joined with Croatia-Slavonia. See Map of Hungary at the time of Tesla's birth. "HORVÁT-SZLAVONORSZÁG" stands for Croatia-Slavonia, part of Kingdom Hungary of Austrian Empire, while the darkened region is the Military Krajina, subjugated directly to Wienna, Austria. Marechiel 15:59, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
Trödel: I can't speak on behalf of everyone, but I personally don't find "Serbo-Croatian" or "Serbian or Croatian" offensive to any party, although Tesla called it "Serbian", because it is practically the same language. Should people object and find it offensive, I suggest a compromise of not stating the name of the language, but rephrasing the sentence as: 'Beside his mother tongue, Tesla also spoke' etc. Marechiel 15:59, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Edison's edits?

I'm not sure of what POV edison is trying to push, but the following links may be of use to everyone.

See:

For some reason, Edison is trying to imping the validity of the W.C. Wysock, J.F. Corum, J.M. Hardesty and K.L. Corum paper. The paper states:

matriculated with degrees in mathematics, mechanical engineering and electrical engineering) and at the University of Prague (where he performed graduate studies in Physics).

There is no confusion except apparantly in Edison's mind.

204.56.7.1 15:50, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

You may want to looks at ""MY INVENTIONS", III. My Later Endeavors: The Discovery of the Rotating Magnetic Field. He talks about his schoolin in this book. 204.56.7.1 16:10, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

Greetings to the anonymous editor who posted the above from a common terminal at a library: You, or those who share the terminal you use, share my interest in early radio and electronics. But-Your attacks and assertion I am "pushing a POV" are unwarranted and are inappropriate for Wikipedia. This is not a blog. I just want accurate information in the article.
Please see the above section in Talk:Nikola Tesla entitled "Studies at Graz" which documents that Tesla did not finish his undergraduate studies at Technical University of Graz.
The fact that an error has been perpetuated by authors or websites does not make it convincing, when the school itself will tell you the opposite, and have said so on page 16 of the book they published to commemorate the 150th anniversary of Teslas birth, "Wohinz, Josef W.(Ed.): Nikola Tesla und die Technik in Graz. Graz, Verlag der Technischen Universität Graz, 2006, p.16; ISBN -10: 3-902465-39-5; ISBN -13: 978-3-902465-39-9".
At the school's website you will find at http://www.presse.tugraz.at//pressemitteilungen/2006/16.05.2006_graz.htm the following:
"Nikola Tesla kam zu Beginn des Studienjahres 1875/76 nach Graz und schrieb sich als Student der damaligen „k.k. Technischen Hochschule“ ein, die ursprünglich räumlich im Stammhaus des Landesmuseum Joanneum, in der Raubergasse 10, untergebracht war und mit der Eröffnung des neu errichteten Hauptgebäudes 1888 in die Rechbauerstraße 12 übersiedelte. Zur Zeit Teslas wurden wesentliche Inhalte aus der heutigen Elektrotechnik von Physikern vorgetragen. Erst 1940 wurde an der Technischen Hochschule in Graz eine Abteilung für Elektrotechnik eingerichtet.Überdurchschnittliche Leistungen
Nikola Tesla wies im ersten Studienjahr eine weit überdurchschnittliche Leistung nach, hat er doch elf verschiedene Vorlesungen mit insgesamt 46 Stunden absolviert. Im zweiten schloss er nur mehr fünf Lehrveranstaltungen (mit insgesamt 19 Stunden) positiv ab und wurde im dritten Studienjahr schließlich wegen Nichtbezahlung des Unterrichtsgeldes aus dem Katalog gestrichen. Es zeigt sich im Verlauf seines Lebens immer wieder, dass Tesla wenig Geschick im Umgang mit Geld hatte – wirtschaftlich schwierige Phasen kennzeichnen seinen Lebensweg trotz einer Vielzahl erfolgreicher Erfindungen."
Doesn't this mean Tesla was a student at the "Kaiserlich-königlich Technischen
Hochschule in Graz (now Graz University of Technology) from 1875 til
1878. In the third year (1877/78), "Wegen Nichtbezahlung des Unterrichtgeldes für das I. Semester 1877/78 gestrichen", his tuition was not paid and his studies did not continue. They gave him an honorary doctorate in 1937. Do you read it differently, or do you find where the University says more than "he studied there from the beginning of the 1875-1876 term until 1878?"
Please also see the book you mentioned by Seifert, "Wizard." which also documents on page 17 that he did not finish his studies and did not receive a bacalaureate degree from Graz.
Does he say in "My Inventions" that he graduated? And as for "imping" the validity of Corum et al, I stated they said Tesla received all those undergraduate degrees from Graz, but that they do not provide a source for their information. Who's Who says he "completed" the engineering course at Graz, in disagreement with the schools records, but does not say he received a B.S. Their source is not given. Tesla or some anonymous writer at Who's Who?
How about you doing doing the reverting to the previous version, which says he did not graduate, or you providing a better source such as a diploma on deposit in some museum, or a statement in Tesla's own writings that he received an undergraduate degree from Graz, in addition to the honorary doctorate they gave him decades later? Or do you want a section that says he received all those bachelors degrees and then a section that says the University denies it, and his roommate denied he graduated? Edison 21:52, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

The school's website is a page of Josef W. Wohinz's opionion. It is dubious. "Who's Who" is much more reputable source (though, it seem, you don't agree with it). The sources for Corum et al is at the end of their paper. There is a whole citation section. Which is better than one opinion at a website (reguardless that it's jhosted on the school domain; any of the staff or stu8dent can get a page there).

As to Seifert ("Wizard"), though it is one of the better modern biographies, it does sdtill have Seifert's opinions sprinkled throughout (such as his opinion on the photograph of Tesla and Einstein and Steinmetz; Seifert believe that it was not Tesla, but there are other biographers that do). He did recieve degree from these schools. You should not misrepresent what teh reputable reference says and choose only those references that you like. 134.193.168.252 17:05, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

By the way, Anonymous Editor "204.56.7.1" which is the IP of a terminal at Linda Hall Library, "in the heart of the University of Missouri-Kansas City's campus but separate from the University", the previous discussion you were unfamiliar with was with another Anonymous Editor "134.193.168.250" at the selfsame University of Missouri - Kansas City. You "two" should get together. I bet you could have some great discussions about Tesla.Edison 22:51, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

Edison seem to be a impartial name to edit the Nikola Tesla article. Real impartial. 134.193.168.252 17:05, 31 July 2006 (UTC)
The user name Edison reflects a lifelong interest and study of 19th century electrical technology, as well as a degree in and career in electrical engineering. For that matter, anonymous edits are not very compelling in their authenticity.Edison 14:11, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

Went to the library and checked "My Inventions" by Tesla. He does not claim to have graduated from or recieved a Bachelor's degree from Graz. His second year of studies would have been 1876-1877. On p 58 he says "It was in the second year of my studies that we received a Gramme dynamo..." and there follows his account of devising the brushless ac motor concept in Prod Poeschl's physics class. Then he talks about his further thoughts about the ac motor. Then (p 59) he says, and note that "term" is singular, "All my remaining term in Gratz was passed in intense but fruitless efforts of this kind, and I almost came to the conclusion that the problem was insoluble. In 1880 I went to Prague, Bohemia, carrying out my father's wish to complete my education at the University there." Note that he never said he graduated from Graz. Nor did he state that he received any degree from Prague. Please do not misrepresent what a reference says. Tesla accomplished a great deal in his life, and does not need people padding his resumé.Edison 01:57, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

Note that "term" is about the time of development of the motor, not about the length of his overall study. From 1876 to 1880 is the time of his stay. Note that he never said he did not graduated from Graz. He was to undertake his graduate studies at the Prague University. You should not misrepresent what a reference says and choose only those references that you like. Tesla accomplished a great deal in his life, and does not need people removing items from his resumé! 134.193.168.252

To Anonymous Editor "204.56.7.1" I see that you have partially reverted the education section by putting back the discredited claim that Tesla received numerous undergraduate degrees from Graz. I also see that you have been blocked numerous times for repeated 3RR reverts. The university records show that he stopped going to class junior year and did not graduate from Graz. Here is one more nail in the coffin: In the article, one of the sources under "External Articles: History and family" is Mrkich, D., "Tesla - The European Years", Serb National Federation at Tesla - The European Years", Serb National Federation. Mrkich in his book, available online, says he went to Graz in October, 2001. He asked the university officials about Tesla's time there, and says he was was shown Tesla's official school records, which show (pp 2 and 11) that he took no exams in his third year. Mrkich says "In his third year, the fall of 1877, Tesla stopped attending lecture, and in January 1878 is not a registered student anymore." Mrkick says, p 2, "Nikola Tesla, the world's greatest mind in the age of machinery, never graduated from any school of higher learning." Against this you present secondary (tertiary?) sources such as websites which cite no source for their info, and you cited in support of the claim for numerous undergraduate degrees some sources which actually say he DID NOT graduate, ambiguous cites that he "completed his studies" which he certainly did on the last day he attended with or without a degree, and a "postersession" by Corum et al, which it is hard to see how it constitutes a refereed scholarly verifiable source, and which in turn cites no authoritative source to show he graduated. The repeated posting of the numerous claimed baccalaureate degrees is not appropriate without some evidence to tip the scales against the evidence from the school, from his roommate, and from his great-nephew as cited above.Thanks for leaving in the article something of the arguments I presented to show his nongraduation. But the list of degrees should be removed, since it is undocumented, and the evidence he did NOT graduate is very well documented.Edison 16:59, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

The source you cite other than the unreferenced claim by Corum et al is " The Book of New York ,"Publisher: The Book of New York Company Author(s): Julius Chambers Publication Date: 1912. In the snippet whic appears when I click on this source in the article, it just says he studied at Graz for four years, but does not say he "matriculated" with four degrees as claimed in the not, unless that is on some other place in the book. Page number?? Also, when I click on the matriculate link it says the term refers to ENTERING a cource of study, not graduating. So it is misleading to use this as support for the claim he received 4 bachelors degrees from Graz.Edison 17:23, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tesla in Colorado Springs

If I remember right, didn't NT burned out and fixed the power station in Manitou Springs when powering his lab in CS? I believe I read this in one of the more well known NT bios but forgot which one. Please let me know if this is the case.

[edit] Recognition and honors

I'm still trying to clean up this section, which has grown a bit awkward. I've already refined artistic categories, moved documentary films from this section to the Further Readings section, and relocated a few works of fiction which were in Further Reading to Recognition and honors. However, I'm not fully satisfied. I can think of two different approaches:

  • Creating a new root section called "Tesla in fiction" and moving the content under literature and Cinema, television and drama to it. Music would remain a subsection of Recognition and honors, since it's not fiction, or is it?
  • Creating a new root section called "Tesla in popular culture" and moving Literature, Music and Cinema, television and drama to it. Recognition and honors would then be limited to scientific or official honors.

Any preference or suggestion? Orphu of Io 15:19, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

It is rather pointless to try to list every occurance of Nikola Telsa in popular culture, as anyone as prominent as Tesla is going to appear in countless ephemera. You might as well try to list every appearance of Albert Einstien in popular culture. Such lists, though popular in Wikipedia, are not at all encyclopedic. They are typically unverified, have no threshold for notability, and are generally formatted as lists of random trivia, none of which are appropriate for an encyclopedia article. This article will be much better off without such a list, as it only serves as a magnet for trivia. Kaldari 00:07, 13 August 2006 (UTC)
I agree that the quality of the current content is very unequal. Also, I don't think that listing every weapon called "Tesla something" in a videogame is relevant to the article. Maybe a threshold for notability should indeed be established?
For example, Tesla would have to be a central character or inspiration for a work to be mentionned in the list. More remote connections would be only be evoked through generalization. Finally, items otherwise accessible through the wikipedia search engine should be avoided.
But still, you are right about the "trivia magnet" effet. Even if the section is rewritten according to stricter rules, it will probably eventually grow back to a list of trivia... I think we've effectively reached the limits of the wikipedian model here. Random trivia should ideally be accessible, but via pages automatically generated by search engine queries, not as part of a human-maintained article. Orphu of Io 17:58, 13 August 2006 (UTC)
Another benefit of removing the pop culture section is that it drops the overall article length from 77K to 69K. Any articles over 32K are labelled "LONG" in the Good Article evaluation list (which this article is currently on). Thus 77K would be considered really, really, long :) Kaldari 18:55, 13 August 2006 (UTC)
Someone has added all of the pop-culture trivia back into the article. I'm afraid this article will never be featured article material with so much cruft. Kaldari 05:51, 20 August 2006 (UTC)
As it seems some people are determined to keep the cruft in the article, I have at least moved it into a separate Trivia section, as it didn't make any sense being in the Recognition and honors section. Kaldari 07:06, 20 August 2006 (UTC)
Why not moving it Nikola Tesla/in pop culture or just leaving it? There are much much longer biographical articles than this one Isaac Newton's had to be divided into several others. Look at Leibniz's article too. There's an entire section devoted to Einstein in popular culture in his article. It's not a big deal. Trivia is popular on wikipedia. We have articles devoted to cartoon episodes and characters and those articles are being kept. 72.144.103.32 16:04, 25 August 2006 (UTC)
And guess why Leibniz is still rated B-class - it's too long, see the comments page. I think it would be fine to split off the trivia cruft, although I imagine such a subarticle would be deleted before long. Do you really think that the fact that Orchestral Manoeuvres in the Dark released a single called "Tesla Girls" belongs in an encyclopedia article about Tesla? Obviously not. If you want to add cruft like that, start a Telsa fan club with it's own website where you can list every song and toy gun named after Tesla. Kaldari 17:20, 25 August 2006 (UTC)
The whole lot was removed on the 30th so I've grabbed it all and moved it to Nikola Tesla in popular culture - there are a lot of legitimate appearances that do need noting but we do need to make sure it is kept trimmed down. (Emperor 14:16, 12 October 2006 (UTC))

[edit] Place of birth

In the time when Tesla was born, the village where he was born belonged to the Military Frontier province of the Austrian Empire. This province was governed directly from Vienna and was not part of what was then Croatia. Area was included in Croatia in 1882 and Tesla was born in 1856, thus I hope that some people here are able to understand this simple historical fact. PANONIAN (talk) 17:09, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Birth

Is there any proof of this, the whereabouts of his birth, because when reading an article on Croatian Airways, about him it said that this was a legend and not a fact. Does anyone maybe have evidence on this.THE MILJAKINATOR 04:24, 17 August 2006 (UTC)

The proof is in your history book for elementary school. I hope you had one? PANONIAN (talk) 15:27, 17 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tesla's work at Niagara Falls and the missing papers

The article contains no mention whatsoever to Tesla's work for generating power from the Niagara Falls. It was a childhood wish that came true for him.

Also, I think Tesla's missing papers should be mentioned more thoroughly. --Jambalaya 10:33, 19 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Edit war regarding nationality information in the intro

This edit war is not helpful. Please discuss your positions below and attempt to reach a consensus. If everyone can agree to do that at least, I will lift the protection. Disclaimer: The protection of a page on any particular version is not meant to express support for that version. Kaldari 07:19, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

I'm tentatively unprotecting, since apparently no one cares any more. If you want to change any information about Tesla's nationality, please discuss it here before editing the article. Kaldari 14:50, 21 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Admin: Please fix redirect comment (as its protected)

The article says "Tesla" redirects here, but in fact Tesla redirects to the unit Tesla (unit). — Dark Shikari talk/contribs 13:54, 21 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tremendous work

Due to my lack of familarity with the scientific nature of Tesla's work, I don't feel comfortable reviewing it for GA. (Especially when it comes to assesment of WP:V and NPOV). However, I will say that I was thoroughly impressed with this article. I felt that the prose flowed well with nothing overtly technical that couldn't be answered with the corresponding wiki-link. After reading the article, I felt more knowledgeable and enriched--which is obviously a nice mark for a very informative piece. Kudos to the article's editors. :) Agne 17:05, 31 August 2006 (UTC)

A lot of good edits have added to the article, but there is way too much nationalistic edit-warring and ethnic boosterism:"world-renowned" "one of the most important inventors in history" "well known" "Tesla's fame rivaled that of any other inventor or scientist in history or popular culture.""he was widely respected as America's greatest electrical engineer" "many of his discoveries were of groundbreaking importance" all lack citations, and detract greatly from the quality of the article. If the article had only accolades which came from books, speeches, awards ceremonies, or eulogies, the article woud be greatly improved. He won 2 major awards, and was widely praised at his funeral and in books from major publishers. Find where quotes similar to the ones above can be attributed to scientists and other leaders and the article will improve in quality and have a better chance of becoming a featured article. I think it can be shown that he was extremely important to AC electricity development and high frequency electricity including X-rays, and to radio remote control from 1882 to 1900, after which he drifted off into mad scientist mode, except for his high speed turbine invention around 1906. Eddy Kurentz 17:28, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] GAC

I evaluated the article based on 7 criteria:

  1. Well-written: Pass
  2. Factually accurate: Pass
  3. Broad: Pass
  4. Neutrally written: Pass
  5. Stable: Pass
  6. Well-referenced: Pass
  7. Images: Pass

Congratualtions, it passes! As opposed to the person above, I feel comfortable reviewing this article precisely because I don't know much about him, other than the technical side. This is a wonderful article, and I heavily encourage the editors involved to try to push it to Featured Article status. --PresN 22:43, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

If you don't know enough about the subject, how can you tell it's "factually accurate" or "neutrally written"? Have you taken into account the information that is not in the article or what's in the article? --Jambalaya 14:57, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tesla discovers X-rays?!

I find it odd that there's not much discussion of one of Tesla's little-known accomplishments: the discovery of x-rays.

Is this timeline correct?

* Tesla mentions discovering a new form of radiation, keeps it secret, but does make photos of bones in his hand
* His research is destroyed when his lab burns down on March 13, 1985
* Roentgen discovers "x-rays" on November 8, 1985
* Tesla makes no claims, but he does send Roentgen a glass photography plate taken from the remains of his burned lab: a photo of human hand w/visible bones
I seriously doubt that Tesla sent Röntgen anything in 1985, as Tesla died in 1945, and Röntgen died in 1923. Perhaps you're referring to the 5th Avenue lab fire of March 1895, instead? :-) If so, it sounds plausable, but you'd want to find a citation before adding, to avoid the ire of the crowd.  ◉ ghoti 19:29, 23 September 2006 (UTC)
Lol Obviously my typo. I forgot to "save page" after preview. Yes, Roentgen announced the discovery of x-rays in 1895 and not 1985. I've fixed it above. but you'd want to find a citation before adding. More than one Tesla book mentions this issue, in particular "Tesla: Master of Lightning" pp74-75. Also, already the current WP Tesla entry states that Tesla started working with x-rays in 1882 and says that Tesla became aware of them specifically in 1892 (probably in reference to "On light and other high frequency phenomena" lecture at the IEE and Royal Society lecture of 1892.) So the photos recovered from the 1895 fire show that Tesla apparently was making x-ray photographs a half a year before Roentgen at the very least. In other words, Tesla discovered x-ray photography, then sat on the discovery. (This is a common difference between scientists and inventors. Inventors keep secrets. Scientists publish, and they publish fast before others beat them to the punch.) --Wjbeaty 23:05, 24 September 2006 (UTC)
I've un-done the changes to your original post so that folks reading this will have a clue what we're talking about. If you've got these specifics, including titles, page and ISBN numbers, then go ahead, be bold and add the information, with references.  ◉ ghoti 03:55, 25 September 2006 (UTC)
This topic is probably Original Research. But I'm still thinking. There's a big problem: the book "Prodigal Genius" mentions that in 1892 when Tesla was experimenting with HV single-electrode vacuum tubes, he claimed to have discovered "light, black light, and a very special radiation." The same book says that before the lab fire, Tesla using this "special radiation" to produce shadowgraphs on film contained in metal boxes. And the book "Tesla: Master of Lightning" says that Tesla had made an accidental shadowgraph of a human foot in a high-lace shoe which was recovered from the rubble of the 1895 fire. Yet in his 1897 lecture "On the Streams of Lenard and Roentgen With Novel Apparatus for Their Use," Tesla very definitely stepped aside and let Roentgen have the credit for x-rays. Knowing what we know of Tesla's prior shadowgraphs of human bones, it appears that Tesla was being either polite or dishonest in concealing his own discovery. Polite, in not stealing Roentgen's thunder, and dishonest in not letting the physics community find out the embarassing fact that Tesla had discovered x-rays months (years?) previously, but had kept the discovery hidden from other scientists. --Wjbeaty 05:36, 4 October 2006 (UTC)
If Tesla did not show any witness his invention, did not apply for a patent, and did not write about it, he could have been accused of fakery if he came forward after he heard of Roentgen's work and said he had invented it first. He had too much class to want to look like a false claimant. Eddy Kurentz 17:35, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Semi-protection

I'm trying to decide whether or not to remove the semi-protection on this article. Normally semi-protection should only be used for a short period of time, although exceptions are made for articles that are subject to long-term edit wars or vandalism problems. The semi-protection on this article seems to be doing a good job of reducing the edit-warring that the article was subject to previously. It seems that most of the disruption was coming from IP accounts who were only interested in a pro-Serbain or pro-Croatian POV, and not actually interested in the quality of the article. What do other people think? Is it time to remove the semi-protection or is it serving a useful purpose? Kaldari 17:26, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

I honestly do not understand the debate about Tesla's nationality/ethicity. The man himself has said numerous times that he is a Serb, and he was born in then heavily Serbian populated region known as Vojina Krajna, part of Austrian empire. Croatia as a state did not exist until the rescent dissolution of SFRJ. By comparison, Serbia has had some form of kingdom/state since the early 12th century, and rescent findings push that timeline back three centuries. Granted, Ottoman empire conquered the region during 15th century, which caused Serb populations to dispurse accross the Balkan peninsula. Serbia was recognized as kingdom in late 19th century, and was the driving force behind Turkish defeat during First Balkan War. Given these and numerous other supporting facts (no opinions and no bias), how could anyone argue that Tesla was a Croat?

I don't think most of the people edit warring about Tesla's nationality are necessarily interested in presenting a balanced and historically-accurate account. Kaldari 18:35, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
I'm unprotecting the article tentatively. Let's hope it can stay that way. Kaldari 16:48, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

I'm semi-protecting the article again. Sigh. Kaldari 23:02, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Request - Filled

Could someone change all occurences of Conductor (material) to Electrical Conductor? on this page? InvertRect 16:06, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Done. Why not just do it yourself though? In the time it took to type that message you could have done it. Sparkhead 22:32, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Telsa and alternating current - Wiki dates are wrong

If you look up Alternating Current in Wikipedia, it states that it was "devised by many contributors including Nikola Tesla, George Westinghouse, Lucien Gaulard, John Gibbs, and Oliver Shallenger from 1881 to 1889."

But if you look up Nikola Tesla in Wikipedia, it states that he "studied electrical engineering at the Austrian Polytechnic in Graz, Austria (1875). While there, he studied the uses of alternating current."

How could he have studied the uses of alternating current in 1875, if he was one of the inventors of it years later???

I think its bad wording rather than wrong dates. There is a big difference between alternating current as a theoretical possibility/lab curiosity/future idea and alternating current as a practical means of power transmission. Plugwash 19:35, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Serbo-Croat vs. Serbian and Croation

Discuss. Kaldari 21:58, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

"Serbo-Croat" or Central-South Slavic is a diasystem (or dialectal continuum). Croatian and Serbian are languages. Afrika Paprika 05:15, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
Yeah Africa, like Illinois and Indiana are two languages. Pure bullshit.Edison 04:38, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
You're saying he spoke Serbian and Croatian, which implies he spoke two languages. But he spoke the same language with both Serbs and Croats, and it logically follows that Serbian and Croatian are the same language. And I think you'll find that they are considered one language by most non-Croat linguists. One example at random: http://www.nottingham.ac.uk/slavonic/staff/ --estavisti 05:50, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
The statement that he spoke two of these languages is PC statement. He spoke Croatian actually as he was born in Croatia and educated in Croatia. The fact Croatian and Serbian are mutually inteligible doesn't mean they are the same language...f.e. Czech and Slovak; Danish, Swedish and Norwegian; Macedonian-Bulgarian, etc. Stating that he spoke some fantasy never existing "Serbo-Croat" language is just false and wrong. Afrika Paprika 21:17, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
Pure bullshit. One language , two slightly different accents. maybe Kentucky and Illinois speak two different languages??Edison 04:42, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
He was actually born in Military Frontier part of Croatia, which was inhabited by a large Serb majority. Both of his parents were the Serbs. Thus, his native language must be Serbian. It is not logical that members of a Serb family could ever speak Croatian between themselves. ;) And he attended the primary school in Gospić, a town in the Frontier, and thus he spoke Serbian there, too. He could have heard Croatian for the first time only when he went to Karlovac to attend the gymnasium. But he also attended the University of Prague and yet I wouldn't say that he spoke Czech (as a native language). :) --Djordje D. Bozovic 21:29, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
Per Tesla, he was born in the Military Frontier of Austria Hungary, not of Croatia. Croatia (the country) was created much later. Edison 04:42, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
All Serbs in Croatia are speaking and have spoke Croatian language and Tesla was no exception. Just like most if not all Croats in Serbian speak mainly Serbian language. He also did not attend only elementary school in Gospic but he also went to high school in Karlovac and later came to study in Zagreb from where he later went to Vienna, Budapest, Prague, New York (not nesscesarily in that order of course). Afrika Paprika 21:51, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
Oh, please... I wonder, was the Gorski vijenac that both Tesla and his mother knew by heart in Croatian too? And all the other Serbian folk poems Tesla's mother Djuka knew. And the Serbian folk stories she told him before he went to sleep. Were they in Croatian? And perhaps Tesla's father, who was a Serb Orthodox priest, served in Croatian? No, I'm sure they all actually were pure Croats! Just they didn't know that; there was no you to tell them. :) You see, perhaps Croats in Serbia in deed speak Serbian, but they have to, because they live in a Serb environment. On the other hand, in Lika, during the Tesla's lifetime, Serbs were the majority, and they were speaking Serbian freely, with no Croatian influences, unlike Serb-influenced Croats in Serbia (I believe you know that Military Frontier was NOT part of Hungary like neighbouring Croatia and Dalmatia [which were inhabited by the Croats, and the Frontier was inhabited by the Serbs], but under the direct jurisdiction of Austria). --Djordje D. Bozovic 11:57, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Surely there must be a reference somewhere for what Tesla's primary language was. Don't any of his biographies mention it? Kaldari 18:53, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

So in order to tell someone Serbian folk stories you must tell them in Serbian? LOL. That is really ridiculous right there. And btw. 'Military Frontier' was still part of Hungary(and Croatia) althogh it was under direct command of the army and the court as a buffer zone. Serbs were a minority btw. in the Slavonian and Croatian Military Frontier...substantial minority but a minority nonetheless. Afrika Paprika 20:24, 9 October 2006 (UTC)
No, it was not part of Hungary. It was under the direct jurisdiction of Austrian court. In Lika Serbs were the majority. Can you provide some references for your claims? --Djordje D. Bozovic 20:30, 9 October 2006 (UTC)
No, it was part of Croatia. Banatian Frontier was part of Hungary. And exactly, it was under the direct jurisdiction of the Austrian court and the King/Emperor. Nominally it was still and it never ceased to be part of Croatian kingdom. In Lika Serbs were a relative majority. For example in 1910. there were 104 000 Serbs and 100 000 Croats....what "huge majority". If we look at data of the whole Croatian and Slavonian Frontier(the one which is today part of Croatia) Croats were majority. Afrika Paprika 15:06, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
Academic historian Sima Ćirković: "Teritorija Vojne granice bila je izuzeta ispod vlasti bana i Hrvatskog sabora. Teritorija Hrvatske, koju su suvremenici nazivali 'ostaci ostatka Hrvatskog kraljevstva' bila je na taj način još jednom okrnjena." (The territory of Military Frontier was not under the jurisdiction of the Ban and the Croatian Parliament. Thus, the territory of Croatia, which was called 'the remnant of the remnants of Croatian Kingdom' by the people of that time, was once again shortened.) So? :) --Djordje D. Bozovic 14:04, 14 October 2006 (UTC)
Here is Tesla's father biography, with a statement that Milutin Tesla wanted to open a Serbian-language high school in Gospic (I don't know why, perhaps because he was speaking Croatian, like all the other Serbs in Croatia? :)). Then you have ...Ivo Andrić, the famous Nobel laureate in literature who wrote in Serbian, or Nikola Tesla... at [28]. This site says: Other than in mother tongue Serbian, Tesla was fluent in six other languages. But I couldn't find anything other than this. :( It seems that Nikola Tesla had no mother tongue at all! And that ends our discussion - the problem is solved! ;) However, here you can find this: He spoke five languages fluently, but English was

his mother tongue. :D lol! Now what can one say? --Djordje D. Bozovic 23:31, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Seriously, why should anyone point out that Serbian was Tesla's native language? It is quite enough just to say that he was a Serb, and it is logical that a Serb would speak Serbian, isn't it? His mother was singing Serbian epic poems (her family, as Tesla once stated himself, was one of the oldest Serbian families, having roots in the Middle Ages). His father was a Serb priest. There is no way that he could hear them two speaking Croatian, really. :) Don't be ridiculous! --Djordje D. Bozovic 23:31, 7 October 2006 (UTC)
But why don't we pick up a sentence written by Tesla himslef in his native language and analize it? Is there anything like that? --Djordje D. Bozovic 23:37, 7 October 2006 (UTC)
It seems most of his published writing was in English. Kaldari 07:36, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] The two {{fact}}s

Both quotations can be found in Margaret Cheney's biography of Tesla. So it can be used as a source. Somebody please source it when this page becomes unlocked. Horvat Den 22:55, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

The Cheney book is a reliable source, even if there are mistakes in it, so if something has it as a a source, it is fine to cite it in the article and remove the 'fact' tag. If a different book says otherwise, then the article can be kept neutral by citing that as well. Eddy Kurentz 17:13, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Brother's Story

It's been a while since I've read Tesla's Bio, but I believe I read his younger brother fell down the cellar stairs horsing around or some cellar stairs involved accident- age five seems young to have had a horse riding accident, usually children this young would be supervised by adults. I'll try to find where I read this and get back.

Tesla had an older brother Dane, who died in a horse riding accident at the age of 22, in the time when Tesla was five. --Djordje D. Bozovic 16:24, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Birthplace

Why does it link to Croatian Krajina, a very poor stub, instead to the rich Military Frontier article? Also, the seperation on "Croatian" and "Slavonian" was by-gone abandoned (simply on districts) by the time Tesla was born... I have no idea who changed the link to "Croatian Krajina", as it seems like trying to present a POV, at the cost of a very good article. --PaxEquilibrium 16:17, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tesla Invented the Radio, not Marconi

I have read that Nikola Tesla was given the credit for inventing the Radio. The invention was credited to Tesla in 1942. Why do people still say Marconi invented the Radio today?

Was the credit of 1942 taken back and given back to Marconi?


Jagoda 1 03:38, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

"Inventing radio" is a pretty meaningless phrase. See Nathan Stubblefield, who transmitted voice messages in 1892. Marconi used electromagnetic waves to send telegraph signals to great distances, like across the Atlantic Ocean, and his company put wireless units on many ships. Tesla did not. Such is fame. Edison 04:33, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

`````````````

As far as i know Tesla invented a fair few things he never got credit for. Mr Edison and Mr Marconi got that credit and not Tesla. However that changed in 1942 when a court ruled that Tesla invented the radio and not Marconi. Today it has also come to light that Edison also ripped off many ideas and some were from Tesla.

Truth comes out.

As for Nathan Subblefield, never heard of him but looks like he fell by the way side just like Tesla did.

We need to write the wrong...Jagoda 1 05:00, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Marconi stations were the first to be set up to allow communication between navy ships, merchant vessels, and shore stations, as well as allowing ship to ship communication. Tesla did very early experiments in the technology, as did his predecessor Hertz and others, such as Lodge, but he did not put a system into practice which had any practical use. He took out a very general patent which did not give details for a practical radio system. By 1942 it had long since expired. Eddy Kurentz 17:49, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Why?

Is the note of him being proud of his Serbian ethnicity and Croatian homeland in the intro? It isn't that relevant at all... --PaxEquilibrium 18:31, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

If he said those words it should be left in the article, end of story. Why no mention of his possible Vlah origin? In Yugoslav folklore he was also called a Gypsy...how quickly people forget today. Article is fair as it stands only change you can make is adding Vlah which most historians accept as his true origin.

However - Serbian - American born in Austria-Hungary (Croatia today) How is this wrong? This sounds ok to me. Jagoda 1 23:24, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Nikola Tesla was Serb by Origin - Not one of those Morlacs who became catholic and called themselves "Croats" much later. And thats what most of the Croats are -> Just Morlacs or so called "Crni Morlaci" or "Crni Vlasi".

So don't mess things up Folks!

[edit] Birthdate

I think July 9/10 should be restored, as many sources give that – [29] . Biruitorul 06:39, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Cultural depictions of Nikola Tesla

I've started an approach that may apply to Wikipedia's Core Biography articles: creating a branching list page based on in popular culture information. I started that last year while I raised Joan of Arc to featured article when I created Cultural depictions of Joan of Arc, which has become a featured list. Recently I also created Cultural depictions of Alexander the Great out of material that had been deleted from the biography article. Since cultural references sometimes get deleted without discussion, I'd like to suggest this approach as a model for the editors here. Regards, Durova 15:54, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Seeing as how Tesla (played by David Bowie, of all people) is a major character in the new film The Prestige (film), I highly agree with adding a section or separate page about Tesla in media, as is mentioned above. Maria 16:24, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Quote from My Inventions

After Estavisti flagged the quote from Tesla's book My Inventions as needing a more authoritative citation [30], I went to Amazon.com and used the "search inside this book" feature to locate the quote. I searched for both "I am proud" and "Croatian homeland" within the book and came up with nothing. However, the Croatian National Tourist Board's website claims that Tesla used that quote in at least one telegram. [31] With that in mind, are there any objections to me putting the quote back into the article, and citing it with the CNTB's website? (Thanks Estavisti for flagging this issue.) - Walkiped 19:47, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Hmm, the reason I flagged it is because I'd always heard it was mentioned in correspodence with some notable Croat (exactly who it was escapes me), not in My Inventions. I've read My Inventions, and I don't think it's in there. Anyway, it can be put back in for now, but we still need a source that's more authoritative than the Tourist Board of Croatia. --estavisti 20:08, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] AC/DC Efficiency Question

What is meant by the line in the "Middle Years" section: "Also in the late 1880s, Tesla and Edison became adversaries in part due to Edison's promotion of direct current (DC) for electric power distribution over the more efficient alternating current advocated by Tesla and Westinghouse." How is AC more efficient than DC? Does it have some sort of technical meaning or is it a bit of NPOV? I honestly don't know and wonder if this needs som emore clarity. --Gangster Octopus 21:18, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

See War of the currents. AC can be easily stepped up to thousands of volts and sent for great distances over relatively small wires, then be stepped back down the the voltage used in homes and businesses. DC required a generating station every 2 or 3 miles and big conductors. The efficience probably refers to less power lost on the conductors because the current is reduced when the voltage is stepped up. AC won the battle by the 1890's, although big city utilities kept supplying DC to some customers for many decades, since the customers had elevators, pumps etc that continued to work fine on DC.Edison 05:03, 5 November 2006 (UTC)
On the other hand, AC loses some energy via radiation. It is the convenience overall of properties of AC, especially its flexibility using transformers and efficiency of AC motors (particularly 3-phase ones), that seem to have prevailed in practice. — DAGwyn 22:48, 27 November 2006 (UTC)


        • WRONG FACT ABOUT NIKOLA TESLA ****

English Wikipedia claims that Tesla was Serbian-American which is wrong. He was actually Croatian who moved to Austria first, to finish the studies. Then he went to New York where he made most of his inventions and where he also died. He was born in the small village called Smiljan, Croatia (Lika County). His famous sentence was: "I am the Croatian with Serbian roots!" So, he cannot be Serbian cause he never actually was in or lived in Serbia. PLEASE CORRECT THAT!!!

True, Tesla was not a Serbian, since he never lived in Serbia. But he was a Serb by ethnicity, despite that he was born in what is today Croatia. And the adjective meaning of Serbs is Serbian. Read the sentence once again - it does not say that Tesla was Serbian-American, it says that he was Serbian-American scientist, which is not the same. --Djordje D. Bozovic 16:46, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

It's not the most important thing to say about a truly great scientist like Nikola Tesla, however it has to be noted that Tesla was an ethnic Serb and a self declared Serb, a claim which no Serb citizen would question at that time or in the actuality. Legally, he held Austria-Hungary Empire and later USA citizeship. He was never a Croat by any means; that country didn't even existed during his lifetime, with exception of the infamous "Independent State of Croatia", installed in 1941 by the German Third Reich and the Fascist Italy after their invasion of the Kingdom of Yugoslavia.

[edit] I want to know why the greatest of Tesla's project are not here...

Thomas Edison (And I really don't care if I mispelled his name.) is dumb. I don't know why we are saying that he did a lot for the science...

Tesla created many thing that we are still using in our days. But most of all, he created 2 thing that are not in the article and IT SHOULD BE!

First of all, he created a Free energy and secondly he created a tower wich was able to conduct the electricity in the Atmosphere to an another tower. Those 2 great invention were removed from him by the gouvernement. So why his best project are not in those page! And by the way. Don't support G.W.Bush in any possible way. Well, if you care of your own world. And by the way, I suggest you to do some ressearch about free energy, 911, Terrorstorm, IgnoranceIsntBliss, They Want Your Soul, Electric Car, An Inconvenient Truth, New World Order and after that, give the information to anyone. But if you are too sacred and don't want to believe it cause it don't suit your perception of the world, then I hope you will survive the next decade... Without becomming slave or dead as well. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by INeedMoreInfo (talk • contribs).

You missed out the bit about the black helicopters, the Rosicrucians and the lizard people. Great spelling, though. Notreallydavid 14:22, 3 December 2006 (UTC)

Oh, and the Protocols Notreallydavid 14:59, 3 December 2006 (UTC)

I always heard that Thomas Edison was deaf, but that he could speak ok. Didn't he record his voice reciting "Mary had a little Lamb" on the first record made? Maybe that could be added to the Thomas Edison article if you can find a book or something saying he was dumb. I would love to have some free energy, since the electric costs about 10 cents per kilowatt hour. Tesla sent a lot of electricity into the air, but I've never heard he was able to get any out at a different location like he claimed he could. In his old age he would have a birthday party every year and invite reporters and make a lot of wild claims that he never put into practice. Eddy Kurentz 17:06, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Redirect

Since this page is protected, please add this:

For other uses of "Tesla", see Tesla (disambiguation).

Once that's done, Tesla should probably redirect here.

{{otherusesof|Tesla}} added. timrem 04:41, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Unencyclopedic boasting

Added "fact" tag to the boasts in the intro. It is unencyclopedic to repeatedly say things like "Tesla is regarded as one of the most important inventors in history." Find a book where the author said it and is a reliable source. "In the United States, Tesla's fame rivaled that of any other inventor or scientist in history or popular culture." Ditto. Find a source. "he was widely respected as America's greatest electrical engineer. " Find a source where some scientific or engineering organization said it. He certainly made major contributions to electrical engineering, but surely when he won awards they said similar things about him. That would count for something. This sounds like boasts by his descendants or countrymen, and is like someone saying "X is the greatest musician in the world" or "Y is the best football player in the world" which would both get promptly edited out if they don;t have a source saying it. If it is the opinion of an editor, then it is original research and must be removed. Let's put in similar claims, properly sourced, so they do not violate WP:NOR. Thanks Eddy Kurentz 15:14, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

The boasts at the beginning will surely keep this article from getting featured status. They still are POV and lack reliable sources. Someone added footnotes 3,4, and 5 and removed the "Fact" tags. But surely there are better references than websites of fan clubs to support the boasts. Sources should be reliable, like WP:RS describes, and these are not, since one is a photo site where anyone can write anything, the second is a fan club or organization devoted to promoting the inventor, and the third is a site devoted to promoting Serbian national pride. Where are quotes from independent organizations, scholarly journals, or organizations presenting him with prizes? Isn't there anything quoted in the books by Cheney, O'Neill or Seifer? The present sources behind these boasts are nothing more than window dressing, non-reliable sources:

Thanks Eddy Kurentz 19:10, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tesla in C&C

The Command and Conquer: Red Alert game uses several "Tesla" structures, most prominently the Tesla Coil, should this be added into the "Fictional Portrayal" bit?

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